Learning how to spin, higher cadance
Discussion
Would anyone know the easiest way of improving my cadence on a bike? For one reason or another i can not seem to engage HR to a high rate when i am just spinning the wheels in a low gear.
Seems like an obvious solution to just pedal faster but then the HR still does not rise that high <150 and then i get bored (lose focus).
Seems like an obvious solution to just pedal faster but then the HR still does not rise that high <150 and then i get bored (lose focus).
I found it really took time to get used to the higher cadence, it will feel unnatural at first.
It's often cited as a way of improving your efficiency isn't it? Using a turbo trainer, (to eliminate nearly all of the other variables that you get on the road), it you're moving at the same speed, but using a higher cadence with a lower heart rate, this simple proves that the method is more efficient, right?
Heart rate can vary with a number of other factors, such as sleep, hydration, food intake before and during, etc. To make this a fair study, I'd have thought you'd want to do multiple tests, first thing in the morning, before breakfast, with something like:
20 mins warm up, getting your heart rate to www bpm.
10 mins @ xx mph at yy spm, measure heart rate during. (lower cadence)
10 mins @ xx mph at zz spm, measure heart rate during. (higher cadence)
20 mins warm down
You would probably want to alternate the sessions between low and high cadence first, to negate the (hopefully) positive effect for doing a week or more of 1 hr turbo sessions each morning.
Please let us know the results.
It's often cited as a way of improving your efficiency isn't it? Using a turbo trainer, (to eliminate nearly all of the other variables that you get on the road), it you're moving at the same speed, but using a higher cadence with a lower heart rate, this simple proves that the method is more efficient, right?
Heart rate can vary with a number of other factors, such as sleep, hydration, food intake before and during, etc. To make this a fair study, I'd have thought you'd want to do multiple tests, first thing in the morning, before breakfast, with something like:
20 mins warm up, getting your heart rate to www bpm.
10 mins @ xx mph at yy spm, measure heart rate during. (lower cadence)
10 mins @ xx mph at zz spm, measure heart rate during. (higher cadence)
20 mins warm down
You would probably want to alternate the sessions between low and high cadence first, to negate the (hopefully) positive effect for doing a week or more of 1 hr turbo sessions each morning.
Please let us know the results.
If you're having trouble getting your HR up by spinning a high cadence in a low gear, knock it down a few gears and maintain the same cadence.
If you have a cadence sensor, you don't really want to be going much over 100-110, just make sure you're in the suitable gear to maintain this.
If you have a cadence sensor, you don't really want to be going much over 100-110, just make sure you're in the suitable gear to maintain this.
okgo said:
Cadence.
Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
surely you can travel further using less energy , much like fell runners power walking up hill rather than being bloody minded and running despite the fact it's slow as fAnother thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
k , uses too much energy and isn't the quickest way to cover ground.AndStilliRise said:
Would anyone know the easiest way of improving my cadence on a bike? For one reason or another i can not seem to engage HR to a high rate when i am just spinning the wheels in a low gear.
Seems like an obvious solution to just pedal faster but then the HR still does not rise that high <150 and then i get bored (lose focus).
It's not easy to just up cadence when you might have ridden a certain way for years. I'm guilty of grinding away and have to think about what I'm doing to raise my cadence.Seems like an obvious solution to just pedal faster but then the HR still does not rise that high <150 and then i get bored (lose focus).
I remember reading how long it took Valverde to increase his. I've found his data in a book called The Science of the Tour de France.
2012 - 82rpm
2013 - 86rpm
2014 - 91rpm
Edited by Mark83 on Friday 2nd September 21:09
Nope. How, why? How would the physics even work? To move an object a certain distance requires a certain amount of energy. Unless the drivetrain losses change dramatically that is the same whether you do it at 100rpm or 70.
Generally lower candence punishes your legs (because you need more force, but a lesser number of times), whereas higher cadence tends to utilise your cardivascular capacity while limiting the stress on your legs.. but if you use too low a gear in an attempt to spin like a loon, then you're not stressing anything at all.
At the top end of my cadence range, I see a very sharp drop in power as my feet spend most of their time chasing the pedals, rather than exerting force on them.. I'm sure I could train to improve that / work at a higher rpm, but as I have gears, why bother.
Cadence tends to be self selecting to a large extent, and depends on physiology. A 55kg twig will tend to settle at a higher cadence than someone built like a rugby player. It's easier to move legs quickly when they're small, and the rugby chap has much more force to play with before they start to fatigue the muscles.
Generally lower candence punishes your legs (because you need more force, but a lesser number of times), whereas higher cadence tends to utilise your cardivascular capacity while limiting the stress on your legs.. but if you use too low a gear in an attempt to spin like a loon, then you're not stressing anything at all.
At the top end of my cadence range, I see a very sharp drop in power as my feet spend most of their time chasing the pedals, rather than exerting force on them.. I'm sure I could train to improve that / work at a higher rpm, but as I have gears, why bother.
Cadence tends to be self selecting to a large extent, and depends on physiology. A 55kg twig will tend to settle at a higher cadence than someone built like a rugby player. It's easier to move legs quickly when they're small, and the rugby chap has much more force to play with before they start to fatigue the muscles.
Something to make you think twice about the "higher cadence is more efficient" idea.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jh-5TYAtJI&ab...
I personally use different cadences for different rides, not through a conscious choice, it's just what feels natural to me. In a TT i'll be at 90-100rpm, while anything less than 75% of threshold tends to be at 75-85rpm.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-jh-5TYAtJI&ab...
I personally use different cadences for different rides, not through a conscious choice, it's just what feels natural to me. In a TT i'll be at 90-100rpm, while anything less than 75% of threshold tends to be at 75-85rpm.
okgo said:
Cadence.
Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
I guess they've heard that Wiggins spins at 110ish and figure that's the best way to do things.Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
I don't know for sure, but probably when he was doing Team Pursuit he was less than 80.
I used to have a computer with Cadence. After 2 rides the novelty wore off. I was roughly 75ish. But who the hell cares. Spinning at 120 wont make me faster
Edited by Rich_W on Friday 2nd September 21:18
okgo said:
Cadence.
Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
Grinding along in 53x12 (OK, 50x11 these days) is a typical newbie trait, and it's worth them learning there's a better way. So I think people should be at least slightly interested.Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
outnumbered said:
okgo said:
Cadence.
Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
Grinding along in 53x12 (OK, 50x11 these days) is a typical newbie trait, and it's worth them learning there's a better way. So I think people should be at least slightly interested.Another thing I have no idea why people spend so much time being even slightly interested in.
The spinner will have fresher legs at the top.
egor110 said:
Exactly , every time you grind up a hill your wasting energy compared to spinning.
The spinner will have fresher legs at the top.
The energy required is the same, power is torque x rpm. The spinner will have fresher legs at the top.
Whether that be a high torque x low rpm or vice versa.
As Okgo says, some riders will have peak power at different rpms much like different engines.
egor110 said:
75rpm is hardly what i'd call grinding .
I don't think anyone is suggesting that riding at 30rpm is in anyway smart. The same as you wouldn't drive around a town center in 5th gear in your car. But if you cannot work out what gearing is actually for then you have little hope in general.To someone used to riding at 95rpm which most people would call quite spinny, making them do 75 would feel very very alien. Just like it would for my mate to suddenly start riding at 95.
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