Feels quicker, but isn't ?
Discussion
As part of a rehab program after a heart attack I have taken up cycling.
I've owned several bikes of various types and a couple of years back I settled on a hybrid, a Cannondale Quick 4.
Christmas just gone I bought a road bike, a Cannondale Synapse.
The hybrid is heavier, and the road bike more nimble, but they have similar gearing and both have their uses.
So why is it that the road bike seems so much faster, and yet after similar rides the Cat Eye computers fitted to them both
give more or less the same data, i.e. same average times and speed?
I'm flummoxed.
I've owned several bikes of various types and a couple of years back I settled on a hybrid, a Cannondale Quick 4.
Christmas just gone I bought a road bike, a Cannondale Synapse.
The hybrid is heavier, and the road bike more nimble, but they have similar gearing and both have their uses.
So why is it that the road bike seems so much faster, and yet after similar rides the Cat Eye computers fitted to them both
give more or less the same data, i.e. same average times and speed?
I'm flummoxed.
My carbon bike feels faster than my ally bike, but in reality they're the same. The thing is carbon bike is 2kg lighter, so feels much more nimble than the ally, and I accelerate a bit faster on it - but once you're at speed, it's the drag that's the limiting factor and I'm the same baggy shape on both bikes.
TwistingMyMelon said:
Could be that the computers aren't config'd properly , record the rides using strava on a smart phone as that is gps
Could be your fitness is the limiting factor , the road bike acererates faster but you end up holding the same av speed
There's a farm gate exactly 2 miles from my back yard bike shed and both Cat Eyes clock up this distance to the foot.Could be your fitness is the limiting factor , the road bike acererates faster but you end up holding the same av speed
Fitness, or perhaps my medication definitely is my limiting factor. I get a smack round the head if my heart rate goes above 85.
Some Gump said:
My carbon bike feels faster than my ally bike, but in reality they're the same. The thing is carbon bike is 2kg lighter, so feels much more nimble than the ally, and I accelerate a bit faster on it - but once you're at speed, it's the drag that's the limiting factor and I'm the same baggy shape on both bikes.
I love this post. 
I am doing my best to limit my baggy shape though. I've been on a diet since September and lost 20% of my body weight.
Trouble is I'm 20% lighter on the other bike too.
Both bikes run slick tyres. 32mm on the hybrid @80psi and 25mm on the road bike @100psi
Bored on a rainy day recently, I had a dig around in some old Strava data, curious about this same sort of question.
Turns out that I have PRs that still stand on all three of my road bikes.
Bike 1 is a 1996 Falcon Pro-Line, with 8-speed 53/39 x 11-28 gearing, made of Cro-Moly tubing (the lowest grade) but feels like it's cast iron when you lift it up.
Bike 2 is (well, at least it was) a Merida Road-Race 905. Aluminium frame, carbon fork, with 10-speed 50/34 x 11-25 gearing. Much lighter than the old beast, racier geometry too.
Bike 3 (current 'best' bike) is a 2015 Trek Emonda. Full carbon fibre, 11-speed Ultegra 50/34 x 11-28 gearing, and marketed by Trek as a lightweight climbing bike. A featherweight by comparison with the old steel bike.
Now I've ridden all three of these bikes on some regular routes, so there have been many chances to hit segments hard, in good conditions over four years. It's a fairly decent sample size, with Garmin GPS accurate data. And the fact is that despite the steel bike having been "replaced" twice by incrementally "better" bikes, it still retains top spot in the Strava PR list for some segments on the route.
Many reasons may come into play. Steel just might 'feel' more comfortable on broken surfaces, so can be pushed harder without the jarring ride quality. It also has bigger gearing so a higher potential top speed for the same pedal rpms. It might simply be that my perception of the effort I was putting in was skewed, or my fitness levels have fluctuated. I can't say that I've recorded all the variables, even the weather, on those historic rides. So it's not scientific, just some old data that shows no conclusive evidence of my being quicker overall on any one of the three bikes.
I wouldn't worry about it. Especially if you need to keep your heart rate down. Just ride a bike, enjoy the ride, and repeat.
And DON'T get into Strava. Because I'm off to the garage to get gear sizes to put into a gear inches calculator so that I can choose a MTB for a KOM attempt later today. Which is kinda sad, and just a tad obsessive really. And it's verging on the point where 'data' and 'achievements' start to erode the simple pleasure of riding a bicycle...
Turns out that I have PRs that still stand on all three of my road bikes.
Bike 1 is a 1996 Falcon Pro-Line, with 8-speed 53/39 x 11-28 gearing, made of Cro-Moly tubing (the lowest grade) but feels like it's cast iron when you lift it up.
Bike 2 is (well, at least it was) a Merida Road-Race 905. Aluminium frame, carbon fork, with 10-speed 50/34 x 11-25 gearing. Much lighter than the old beast, racier geometry too.
Bike 3 (current 'best' bike) is a 2015 Trek Emonda. Full carbon fibre, 11-speed Ultegra 50/34 x 11-28 gearing, and marketed by Trek as a lightweight climbing bike. A featherweight by comparison with the old steel bike.
Now I've ridden all three of these bikes on some regular routes, so there have been many chances to hit segments hard, in good conditions over four years. It's a fairly decent sample size, with Garmin GPS accurate data. And the fact is that despite the steel bike having been "replaced" twice by incrementally "better" bikes, it still retains top spot in the Strava PR list for some segments on the route.
Many reasons may come into play. Steel just might 'feel' more comfortable on broken surfaces, so can be pushed harder without the jarring ride quality. It also has bigger gearing so a higher potential top speed for the same pedal rpms. It might simply be that my perception of the effort I was putting in was skewed, or my fitness levels have fluctuated. I can't say that I've recorded all the variables, even the weather, on those historic rides. So it's not scientific, just some old data that shows no conclusive evidence of my being quicker overall on any one of the three bikes.
I wouldn't worry about it. Especially if you need to keep your heart rate down. Just ride a bike, enjoy the ride, and repeat.
And DON'T get into Strava. Because I'm off to the garage to get gear sizes to put into a gear inches calculator so that I can choose a MTB for a KOM attempt later today. Which is kinda sad, and just a tad obsessive really. And it's verging on the point where 'data' and 'achievements' start to erode the simple pleasure of riding a bicycle...
finishing touch said:
Up until I bought the Synapse I'd read hundreds of posts on loads of forums that all said;
"get a road bike and you'll be quicker."
Anyone know where I can get a butchers delivery bike?
Road bikes are only quicker because of less drag. Is your riding position on the Synapse much different than your old Quick 4? How rough are the roads you ride on? "get a road bike and you'll be quicker."
Anyone know where I can get a butchers delivery bike?
I have a strava record going up a hill on my hybrid which I cant touch on my road bike. I may have just been having a really good day on the hybrid or the more stable position made me feel like I could push it harder, or maybe I'm just not fit enough to make the most of the difference.
yellowjack said:
And DON'T get into Strava. Because I'm off to the garage to get gear sizes to put into a gear inches calculator so that I can choose a MTB for a KOM attempt later today. Which is kinda sad, and just a tad obsessive really. And it's verging on the point where 'data' and 'achievements' start to erode the simple pleasure of riding a bicycle...
I can't tell you how annoyed I was when - having spent months improving my fitness with the vague goal of taking a KOM on a lungbuster local hill - I got ready for a ride ready to take the KOM, and saw that I'd dropped a place. And I am certain that the person concerned was in a car - no way they rode up that at the quoted pace. Frustrated beyond all reason, but went out and got 2nd place all the same. But it gets me out there when the weathers c**p, so it's not all bad I guess.
Edited by tenohfive on Friday 10th March 16:00
I'm certainly quicker on my road bike than I was/am on my commuters.
My 'comfortable' pedalling speed on the road bike is a good 3-4mph quicker than on the others. Partly due to a more aero position but also, I suspect, because I tend to only use it at weekends when I don't have a rucksack full of clothing, a lock, extra waterproofs just in case etc etc.
What I have noticed though is that my Brompton which is very sit up and beg, is NOT noticeably slower than my Dahon Matrix (also a folding bike, but a 26" wheeled 'proper' looking bike. In fact most of the times I set on the older bike on Strava have now been superceded by ones I've set on the Brompton.
My 'comfortable' pedalling speed on the road bike is a good 3-4mph quicker than on the others. Partly due to a more aero position but also, I suspect, because I tend to only use it at weekends when I don't have a rucksack full of clothing, a lock, extra waterproofs just in case etc etc.
What I have noticed though is that my Brompton which is very sit up and beg, is NOT noticeably slower than my Dahon Matrix (also a folding bike, but a 26" wheeled 'proper' looking bike. In fact most of the times I set on the older bike on Strava have now been superceded by ones I've set on the Brompton.
Concentrate on keeping that HR down, not on getting faster!
A colleague of mine is on a similar post-heart attack programme. He set me and my other colleague a challenge to see if we could go further in an hour than him... without exceeding 115bpm. I exceed 115bpm getting off the sofa to make a cup of tea...
A colleague of mine is on a similar post-heart attack programme. He set me and my other colleague a challenge to see if we could go further in an hour than him... without exceeding 115bpm. I exceed 115bpm getting off the sofa to make a cup of tea...
Having just recently got my first carbon road bike , I have done a couple of decent rides and smashed 27 of my PB's on strava in just 2 rides so it's defo quicker , and a lot of the segments have been hills which would make sense as its a lot lighter . So yesterday I went back out on my old Ali bike as a comparison it's a full 2.5 kg heavier , so I can say it's harder up hills , no surprise there then , but along the flat and down hills the same if not feels slightly quicker as it feels more planted to the road and gusts of wind seem to affect me less , I was really surprised how much I still did enjoy the ride on my old bike . I guess you can say cycling is enjoyable no matter what bike your on , bloody strava! Chasing those times cost me a lot of cash ! Oh and my average speed was only down 0.4 Km/h over the same distance .
Edited by neil-935ql on Friday 10th March 16:34
tenohfive said:
I can't tell you how annoyed I was when - having spent months improving my fitness with the vague goal of taking a KOM on a lungbuster local hill - I got ready for a ride ready to take the KOM, and saw that I'd dropped a place. And I am certain that the person concerned was in a car - no way they rode up that at the quoted pace. Frustrated beyond all reason, but went out and got 2nd place all the same.
But it gets me out there when the weathers c**p, so it's not all bad I guess.
Yeah sorry about that, I knew you'd take it badly but I couldn't resistBut it gets me out there when the weathers c**p, so it's not all bad I guess.
Edited by tenohfive on Friday 10th March 16:00
Kawasicki said:
Road bikes are only quicker because of less drag. Is your riding position on the Synapse much different than your old Quick 4? How rough are the roads you ride on?
I think I've just caught on.At first I thought that rough roads would be the same for both bikes. Most of the roads round here were re-surfaced last summer with big chippings.
Could it be that wider tyres cope with the rough surface better ?
I sit more upright with arms further apart using flat bars on the Quick 4.
Forward lean with hunched shoulders on the hoods of the Synapse.
Do a ride on the drops, if you can get there comfortably.
Bet you gain .5-1mph for same heart rate.
For even more gains, learn to do that "arms on the hoods but flat" thing the pros can do. If you can get there, then you've clearly lost too much baggy and need more pies. Celebrate with a big cake at the cafe stop.
Bet you gain .5-1mph for same heart rate.
For even more gains, learn to do that "arms on the hoods but flat" thing the pros can do. If you can get there, then you've clearly lost too much baggy and need more pies. Celebrate with a big cake at the cafe stop.
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