Did he dope? (Amateur)
Poll: Did he dope? (Amateur)
Total Members Polled: 43
Discussion
So RideLondon100 is coming up again. Not doing it this year, but know a couple of people who are. Conversation turned to a guy that I and some friends know who did it last year. For background he's a sub 3 hour marathon runner a few years ago. So a decent athlete by all accounts. He's also massively competitive. RL100 for me was a "Do it for charity, tick it off the list" I wanted a reasonable time, but it wasn't my main focus of last year. (Roth, Germany was)
Last year we were comparing training regimes. It was clear I was riding far more than him. I come from a cycling background, him from a running one. And as he's a massive Strava nerd, I could look at his training. I noticed on more than once he's not a climber. Consistently slower than myself on the 3 main climbs of RL100. His long rides never broke 50-60miles either. He seemed more focused on taking shortish Strava segment PRs on his rides than just doing mileage.
Come the biblically wet day and whilst we started at different times I went round just under 6 hours. (as did a friend who is probably around the same as me fitness wise) He went round in 4h40 (ish) A massive leap! Faster than anybody I know. And I think we all have friends who are next level as far as ability goes.
When questioned about it, he said he "got in with a pack" and certainly the first few official pics show him in a group of probably 4 others. Heck I got in with a group to about Chiswick bridge
But after Kingston Bridge, he's on his own in most pics. The group is nowhere to be seen.
Had he beaten me by half an hour, even 45 mins I would have put it down to "a good engine" But 1h20 seems not normal.
One friend posed the question. We all wondered. "Surely not" "I would never expect it from him" "He'd go down in my estimation if it was true"
Now, I cant prove anything, I'm not going to ask him directly. (since I don't see him all that often) It's potentially adding 2+2 and getting 19. But I have to admit it's made me wonder*. We all know amateur doping is rife, there's no testing at RL100 for obvious reasons.
Does his decent running performance mean it's plausible? And he's just better than me
Is he just a "race day guy" who can absolutely leave everything on the course?
*And by default, its made me also start to question the sub3 barrier too.
On a related note, has anyone encountered amateur dopers first hand?
Last year we were comparing training regimes. It was clear I was riding far more than him. I come from a cycling background, him from a running one. And as he's a massive Strava nerd, I could look at his training. I noticed on more than once he's not a climber. Consistently slower than myself on the 3 main climbs of RL100. His long rides never broke 50-60miles either. He seemed more focused on taking shortish Strava segment PRs on his rides than just doing mileage.
Come the biblically wet day and whilst we started at different times I went round just under 6 hours. (as did a friend who is probably around the same as me fitness wise) He went round in 4h40 (ish) A massive leap! Faster than anybody I know. And I think we all have friends who are next level as far as ability goes.
When questioned about it, he said he "got in with a pack" and certainly the first few official pics show him in a group of probably 4 others. Heck I got in with a group to about Chiswick bridge
But after Kingston Bridge, he's on his own in most pics. The group is nowhere to be seen. Had he beaten me by half an hour, even 45 mins I would have put it down to "a good engine" But 1h20 seems not normal.
One friend posed the question. We all wondered. "Surely not" "I would never expect it from him" "He'd go down in my estimation if it was true"
Now, I cant prove anything, I'm not going to ask him directly. (since I don't see him all that often) It's potentially adding 2+2 and getting 19. But I have to admit it's made me wonder*. We all know amateur doping is rife, there's no testing at RL100 for obvious reasons.
Does his decent running performance mean it's plausible? And he's just better than me
Is he just a "race day guy" who can absolutely leave everything on the course?
*And by default, its made me also start to question the sub3 barrier too.
On a related note, has anyone encountered amateur dopers first hand?
Mileage is a lot less relevant than the quality of the miles you do - HIIT training shows you that, so I wouldn't rate that as a factor.
Over a flattish course like RL100 I would expect getting into a decent group to be a lot! more important than climbing ability. Provided you didn't end up losing your group come the flat again anyway.
Over a flattish course like RL100 I would expect getting into a decent group to be a lot! more important than climbing ability. Provided you didn't end up losing your group come the flat again anyway.
JPJPJP said:
Recent drug test is my guess.Huge gains on the bike (any sport really) to be had by multiple discipline training. I.e. runs, gym and shorter rides at higher intensity. If he’s running marathon in under 3 hours it suggests he knows what he is doing and I think a 4:40 is no problem for him. “Just doing the miles” is not how you get quick.
popeyewhite said:
mcelliott said:
Do you want some salt to go with that chip on your shoulder?
But I'm just not that competitive to be fazed by getting beaten. There's always someone faster and someone slower. It was just an idle conversation.
What if he did a load of Coke first thing? Would that stop the muscle ache?
bulldong said:
Huge gains on the bike (any sport really) to be had by multiple discipline training. I.e. runs, gym and shorter rides at higher intensity. If he’s running marathon in under 3 hours it suggests he knows what he is doing and I think a 4:40 is no problem for him. “Just doing the miles” is not how you get quick.
Indeed. But his training doesn't suggest any of that. Just a commute here and there. The odd longer ride. There's no tempo or interval stuff. I get that some people don't need the level of training that others do. Like I say just an idle conversation. Edited by S1KRR on Thursday 4th July 22:24
You say he is a strava nerd. Are you sure everything he does is on there? It is increasingly common that some rides aren’t shared...
Also, you say you did the 3 climbs faster - was that the case on the day of the event?
As others have said, a runner who does 3 hr marathons is in good shape and understands endurance event training
Also, you say you did the 3 climbs faster - was that the case on the day of the event?
As others have said, a runner who does 3 hr marathons is in good shape and understands endurance event training
If he started early, pre 6:30 ( this is the important bit ) with a big fast group then 4:40 doesn't seem unreasonable for someone that rides regularly with reasonable fitness.
I did the RideLondon a few years back and did it in 4:27 and know plenty of people that did it quicker than that, With enough people around it's not unrealistic. I didn't go mad at training for it, did a few big effort 50 mile rides but spent much of my time on a mountain bike.
As I recall I looked down at my GPS thing after the first hour and it said av speed of 28mph.. it was bonkers but great fun
Admittedly I struggled to turn the pedals after finishing to do the mile and a half back to the car...
I did the RideLondon a few years back and did it in 4:27 and know plenty of people that did it quicker than that, With enough people around it's not unrealistic. I didn't go mad at training for it, did a few big effort 50 mile rides but spent much of my time on a mountain bike.
As I recall I looked down at my GPS thing after the first hour and it said av speed of 28mph.. it was bonkers but great fun
Admittedly I struggled to turn the pedals after finishing to do the mile and a half back to the car...
In the grand scheme of things, 4:40 for the RL is not that special or abnormal, it's the kind of time that any half decent cyclist would do especially if you work together in a group or get pulled along. Certainly not a time that would make me question for a second if he had more than a few Weetabix that morning.
I personally would question why you were over an hour further back, how often did you stop? Most people going for a time wont bother with the food stops. Did you get a late start wave and get help up at the pinch points of RP and Leith Hill?
It's really not worth worrying about, just train harder and ride more if you want to beat his time.
I personally would question why you were over an hour further back, how often did you stop? Most people going for a time wont bother with the food stops. Did you get a late start wave and get help up at the pinch points of RP and Leith Hill?
It's really not worth worrying about, just train harder and ride more if you want to beat his time.
bulldong said:
I think you’re underestimating how hard it is to run a marathon in under 3 hours.
No, as a 1.30 half runner I'm absolutely not.bulldong said:
That should be your starting point for this idle chat. :-)
The starting point for this chat is understanding PEDs don't improve performance by such a huge margin over such a short timespan.Behave OP. It is an average speed of 21.43mph. When I used to race an average speed anywhere between 22-26mph was the norm. I've done reliability rides on open roads at an average close to 21mph, so on a closed road it's certainly possible in a good group.
Edited by S100HP on Friday 5th July 10:11
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