Track Day Camera advice please
Discussion
I do a reasonable amount of track days each year, using two different cars. I'm looking for a decent camera for use on the two cars. One will require, at a minimum, water proofing, sound muffling (or remote microphone) and preferably remote control. the second car will have it mounted internally so not such a major issue.
I'd like to be able to use the feed to add to a data logging system in the future.
I've heard good things about the Gopro HD2 and borrowed an older version previously. Before I order one, are there any other suggestions?
Any feedback or advice greatly appreciated.
I'd like to be able to use the feed to add to a data logging system in the future.
I've heard good things about the Gopro HD2 and borrowed an older version previously. Before I order one, are there any other suggestions?
Any feedback or advice greatly appreciated.
I went through a similar process last year on track cameras. Here is a test of a Go Pro 2 HD mounted on my Caterham. It was using a 3.5mm external mic run down into the boot area under the boot cover. The mount was from EyeOfMine and not the GoPro roll bar mount.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PuTqqjvYlw&fea...
For contrast here my test of the VIO POV HD camera on the same day. Same 3.5mm external mic mounted in the same spot as for the Go Pro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=ULI9wQqNFmlbs&am...
Excuse the driving as these are the opening warm up laps so I am not trying to look good.
The downside of the GoPro is it is clunky to use which will largely be cured (for my purposes) in Feb with the new wifi backpack. The sound is better in the Go Pro but possibly the color is better in the VIO POV? The VIO POV has a tendency to not like vibrations in my car and turn itself off at times. I am going with the GoPro based on my testing last year - cheaper, fairly idiotproof, better sound, wifi remote can control multiple cameras simultaneously (I will run a front and back camera). Currently I use one of those MD80 mini cams for my rear camera which is ok but pretty poor quality compared to the HD cameras.
As for data you will see in the test videos I have integrated it with GPS log data. At the following link you can see I have gone further and inserted a rear view camera along with the data.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=ULNcBJBQMcyGI&am...
I chose not to go vbox or other integrated track camera/data log unit for reasons of cost and simplicity. For data logging I use the RaceChrono Touchscreen GPS. This is not the iphone app version but a little dedicated unit:
http://racechronosystems.com/
Dead easy to use. GPS based so does not need to be wired in - just transfer from car to car as you want. Easy to mount the little matchbox sized GPS receiver on the scuttle (or dash for a car with a roof) and then the small base unit is connected by bluetooth and is velcroed into a map pocket next to my knee. You do not need to drive the track or download a map - it does it for you automatically by just going out and driving and when you come in at the end to the pits, you add the start/finish line manually and it then crunches the data based on this input. I am still exploring ways to analyze the data to improve my driving - fascinating toy to waste lots of time. Data can be viewed on the screen or imported into a Circuit Tools or other software to perform analysis.
To merge with the video, I export the data in CSV format. Load the multiple videos and CSV file into RaceRender software and synchronize. First time was slow and then I had the hang of it and it moved quickly. Output from RaceRender I then use in a video editor to clean it up nicely.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-PuTqqjvYlw&fea...
For contrast here my test of the VIO POV HD camera on the same day. Same 3.5mm external mic mounted in the same spot as for the Go Pro.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=ULI9wQqNFmlbs&am...
Excuse the driving as these are the opening warm up laps so I am not trying to look good.
The downside of the GoPro is it is clunky to use which will largely be cured (for my purposes) in Feb with the new wifi backpack. The sound is better in the Go Pro but possibly the color is better in the VIO POV? The VIO POV has a tendency to not like vibrations in my car and turn itself off at times. I am going with the GoPro based on my testing last year - cheaper, fairly idiotproof, better sound, wifi remote can control multiple cameras simultaneously (I will run a front and back camera). Currently I use one of those MD80 mini cams for my rear camera which is ok but pretty poor quality compared to the HD cameras.
As for data you will see in the test videos I have integrated it with GPS log data. At the following link you can see I have gone further and inserted a rear view camera along with the data.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=ULNcBJBQMcyGI&am...
I chose not to go vbox or other integrated track camera/data log unit for reasons of cost and simplicity. For data logging I use the RaceChrono Touchscreen GPS. This is not the iphone app version but a little dedicated unit:
http://racechronosystems.com/
Dead easy to use. GPS based so does not need to be wired in - just transfer from car to car as you want. Easy to mount the little matchbox sized GPS receiver on the scuttle (or dash for a car with a roof) and then the small base unit is connected by bluetooth and is velcroed into a map pocket next to my knee. You do not need to drive the track or download a map - it does it for you automatically by just going out and driving and when you come in at the end to the pits, you add the start/finish line manually and it then crunches the data based on this input. I am still exploring ways to analyze the data to improve my driving - fascinating toy to waste lots of time. Data can be viewed on the screen or imported into a Circuit Tools or other software to perform analysis.
To merge with the video, I export the data in CSV format. Load the multiple videos and CSV file into RaceRender software and synchronize. First time was slow and then I had the hang of it and it moved quickly. Output from RaceRender I then use in a video editor to clean it up nicely.
Edited by LostCroc on Thursday 26th January 19:35
I've been looking at trackday cameras too and my research is leaning me towards this:
Mini DVR Camera
Mini DVR Camera
grenpayne said:
I've been looking at trackday cameras too and my research is leaning me towards this:
Mini DVR Camera
Yep, that was also on my short list but no weather proofing that I could find.Mini DVR Camera
I know this might sound daft.... but can you live with having the camera mounted inside the car?
And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
I was bloody amazed frankly.
You get 720P HD video and audio recording, plus it automatically draws a map of the track (any track or road) in its memory and you can add the "dot moving round the track" map to the playback screen later if you wish.
On playback and export of the video it also gives you the option to add Lap timers, Track Map, G meters, Speedometer (various types) and loads of other stuff to the exported video. All this is monitored and logged via the iPhone GPS receiver.
I'm not sure sure what you would have to spend to have all this in a standalone unit that wasn't a phone.. but the app only cost me about £6!
My screenshots:
Edited to add:
You can add anything to the videos on export even if they are 'old' videos.. so for a laugh here is an old one with all the stuff added to the screen to show what you can do:
And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
I was bloody amazed frankly.
You get 720P HD video and audio recording, plus it automatically draws a map of the track (any track or road) in its memory and you can add the "dot moving round the track" map to the playback screen later if you wish.
On playback and export of the video it also gives you the option to add Lap timers, Track Map, G meters, Speedometer (various types) and loads of other stuff to the exported video. All this is monitored and logged via the iPhone GPS receiver.
I'm not sure sure what you would have to spend to have all this in a standalone unit that wasn't a phone.. but the app only cost me about £6!
My screenshots:
Edited to add:
You can add anything to the videos on export even if they are 'old' videos.. so for a laugh here is an old one with all the stuff added to the screen to show what you can do:
Edited by NinjaPower on Thursday 26th January 22:26
Stubby Pete said:
grenpayne said:
I've been looking at trackday cameras too and my research is leaning me towards this:
Mini DVR Camera
Yep, that was also on my short list but no weather proofing that I could find.Mini DVR Camera
Sounds good ! But what kind of mount do you use ?
NinjaPower said:
I know this might sound daft.... but can you live with having the camera mounted inside the car?
And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
I was bloody amazed frankly.
You get 720P HD video and audio recording, plus it automatically draws a map of the track (any track or road) in its memory and you can add the "dot moving round the track" map to the playback screen later if you wish.
On playback and export of the video it also gives you the option to add Lap timers, Track Map, G meters, Speedometer (various types) and loads of other stuff to the exported video. All this is monitored and logged via the iPhone GPS receiver.
I'm not sure sure what you would have to spend to have all this in a standalone unit that wasn't a phone.. but the app only cost me about £6!
My screenshots:
Edited to add:
You can add anything to the videos on export even if they are 'old' videos.. so for a laugh here is an old one with all the stuff added to the screen to show what you can do:
And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
I was bloody amazed frankly.
You get 720P HD video and audio recording, plus it automatically draws a map of the track (any track or road) in its memory and you can add the "dot moving round the track" map to the playback screen later if you wish.
On playback and export of the video it also gives you the option to add Lap timers, Track Map, G meters, Speedometer (various types) and loads of other stuff to the exported video. All this is monitored and logged via the iPhone GPS receiver.
I'm not sure sure what you would have to spend to have all this in a standalone unit that wasn't a phone.. but the app only cost me about £6!
My screenshots:
Edited to add:
You can add anything to the videos on export even if they are 'old' videos.. so for a laugh here is an old one with all the stuff added to the screen to show what you can do:
Edited by NinjaPower on Thursday 26th January 22:26
grenpayne said:
It does says in the text that "The camera part is fully waterproof and the recorder part is rugged and splash proof" or did you need more protection than that? If I get one, mine will be mounted on the roll bar of my aero-screened Caterham and it will be getting wet!
I obviously didn't read it fully, thanks. Mine will be mounted similarly. Unfortunately you've made the decision harder now!!NinjaPower said:
I know this might sound daft.... but can you live with having the camera mounted inside the car?
And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
I've gone down the Android route rather than iPhone. Had a look at apps and found "aLapeecorderHD" (free trial version with max of two videos). Might work as a temporary measure for the saloon car. I'll try it on a road trip tomorrow Nd report back, assuming I can work out a way to mount the phone.And do you own an iPhone 4 or 4S?
The reason I ask is that I was fancying a track day cam but I decided to try out an app for my iPhone called TrackCam.
Stubby Pete said:
I've gone down the Android route rather than iPhone. Had a look at apps and found "aLapeecorderHD" (free trial version with max of two videos). Might work as a temporary measure for the saloon car. I'll try it on a road trip tomorrow Nd report back, assuming I can work out a way to mount the phone.
Easy... Either buy a cheap £5-10 adjustable phone holder with windscreen sucker mount and twist it to landscape mode. The mounts usually always have a gap or hole in the back of the so the camera can still 'see out'.Or if you are even tighter with your cash, get a couple of strong elastic bands and strap the phone to the rear view mirror. Do it so it is on your side of the mirror so you can see the phone screen, but edge it along so the camera is looking past the edge of the mirror and through the windscreen. The advantage of this is it makes a sturdy mount, good high view, and you can adjust the mirror to get a good camera angle
For the screenshot through the window of the green Murtaya I just had it in a crappy window sucker phone holder. Worked great!
NinjaPower said:
Easy... Either buy a cheap £5-10 adjustable phone holder with windscreen sucker mount and twist it to landscape mode. The mounts usually always have a gap or hole in the back of the so the camera can still 'see out'.
Or if you are even tighter with your cash, get a couple of strong elastic bands and strap the phone to the rear view mirror. Do it so it is on your side of the mirror so you can see the phone screen, but edge it along so the camera is looking past the edge of the mirror and through the windscreen. The advantage of this is it makes a sturdy mount, good high view, and you can adjust the mirror to get a good camera angle
For the screenshot through the window of the green Murtaya I just had it in a crappy window sucker phone holder. Worked great!
Not for trackdays in the UK. Neither should get past the marshals.Or if you are even tighter with your cash, get a couple of strong elastic bands and strap the phone to the rear view mirror. Do it so it is on your side of the mirror so you can see the phone screen, but edge it along so the camera is looking past the edge of the mirror and through the windscreen. The advantage of this is it makes a sturdy mount, good high view, and you can adjust the mirror to get a good camera angle
For the screenshot through the window of the green Murtaya I just had it in a crappy window sucker phone holder. Worked great!
Because if you shunt it can go flying around and maim you horribly in a blood curdling and gruesome way. (it's Friday, I'm feeling descriptive)
In particular MSV circuits have a total cow if you approach pit exit with anything that isn't bolted on. Me, I'm happy with teeny, teeny sucky on bullet cams but things that can introduce your face to your phone are bad idea.
In particular MSV circuits have a total cow if you approach pit exit with anything that isn't bolted on. Me, I'm happy with teeny, teeny sucky on bullet cams but things that can introduce your face to your phone are bad idea.
gtdc said:
Because if you shunt it can go flying around and maim you horribly in a blood curdling and gruesome way. (it's Friday, I'm feeling descriptive)
In particular MSV circuits have a total cow if you approach pit exit with anything that isn't bolted on. Me, I'm happy with teeny, teeny sucky on bullet cams but things that can introduce your face to your phone are bad idea.
Well yes, I can only imagine the injuries one would sustain by being slapped in the arm by an iPhone in a rubber case...In particular MSV circuits have a total cow if you approach pit exit with anything that isn't bolted on. Me, I'm happy with teeny, teeny sucky on bullet cams but things that can introduce your face to your phone are bad idea.
I would be more worried about the unopened can of Coke in the cup holder by the handbrake!
Seriously though, I didn't know about the 'loose objects rule' as no one has ever mentioned it on the track days I have been on, so thanks for the info.
A bit of googling reveals that 'heavy duty' metal clamp-on iPhone holders are available (for fastening your iPhone to the handlebars of a motorbike) which look like the phone is locked firmly in the holder.
Would this sort of thing be ok if it were bolted to a roll cage bar behind the seats or suchlike?
Seriously? You'd be amazed at the cretinosity of some people. I had serious narky gip off a guy who couldn't understand why having a tyre lever banging about in the cockpit was stupid. Ditto for cans, hand held cameras, empty helmets, phones and homemade camcorder mounts made of skinny bits of wood. It doesn't take much size to make a mess of someone (or get stuck under a pedal).
Sadly, these days, an organiser must always have a "what if" head on and because the lowest common denominator is now not only allowed to walk the streets but drive too we must spell these things out very carefully and slowly. Some organisers don't bother which is equally annoying because if something happens we all suffer somewhere along the line.
Sadly, these days, an organiser must always have a "what if" head on and because the lowest common denominator is now not only allowed to walk the streets but drive too we must spell these things out very carefully and slowly. Some organisers don't bother which is equally annoying because if something happens we all suffer somewhere along the line.
NinjaPower said:
Seriously though, I didn't know about the 'loose objects rule' as no one has ever mentioned it on the track days I have been on, so thanks for the info.
That surprises me, Every trackday I've been on in the last three years has mentioned this and deffo not allowed......Iphone or camera, I wouldn't want either hurtling towards my face at speed in a prang... I'm too good looking to want that to happen
FUNKSTER UK said:
NinjaPower said:
Seriously though, I didn't know about the 'loose objects rule' as no one has ever mentioned it on the track days I have been on, so thanks for the info.
That surprises me, Every trackday I've been on in the last three years has mentioned this and deffo not allowed......Iphone or camera, I wouldn't want either hurtling towards my face at speed in a prang... I'm too good looking to want that to happen
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