Essentials for a basic track car.

[RB Will]

Hi all just after peoples opinions on a silly idea I have had.

My Mum is looking to get rid of her Corolla T-Sport to buy an Audi A3. Since the trade in is going to be at best £750 she has said I can have it for nowt (early birthday present I guess). It's just had a service and passed an MOT with no advisories but the bodywork and interior is a bit crappy.

My thought was spend a little money on it and use it as a track car. I have taken it round The Ring before and it was OK just a bit wobbly and could do with more grip. I Didnt manage it at The Ring but on the road I have managed to fry the brakes before. So I need to change a few things to address these problems

So far I am thinking..

Strip it as much as possible
Get decent, matching tyres all round (195-205/XX/16 fits the standard alloys if anyone has suggestions for tyres)
suitable pads and vented discs
Braided brake lines and DOT 5.1 fluid
lowering springs and wheel alignment maybe adjusted for more grip?
A CG Lock to hold me in place.

I have done plenty of track days in the past but have used standard or near standard cars so just checking the above is adequate.

Will the lowering springs be enough to tighten it up and make it a bit less boaty or am I going to have to fork out £600 for some coilovers?
is a CG lock going to be enough or shall I start searching the bay for a couple of used buckets and harnesses?
I'm just trying to keep the budget under £1k.

If the setup proves fun then I may splash out and get a cage and harnesses put in just for safety.

[_Batty_]

My bone stock 318is. Only things it had was a full service, new brake pads/fluid and two front tyres.
Had an absolute ball! I see no problem in tracking anything stock as long as the brakes are of decent standard.

[geeks]

Get some dampers too, even if they are fresh stock items the difference will be night and day.
Good decent disks and pads on the brakes is always a good shout, braided lines aren't a big deal but good if you have the time money and skill to drop them on.
Decent tyres, plenty of coice, budget is the one here.
Bucket seat with harness.
Passenger seat with a harness.
Go Pro.
Get as much weight out as you can.
Service the engine first as well and change the cambelt.
Only get it aligned once you have all the weight out and your new parts on.
If you fancy a set of coilovers corner weighting is a good experience builder.

Sky is the limit, some will say you dont need any of the above or what is on your list and they are right, you can have a hoot no matter what you are in or where you are.

[Adenauer]

I'd probably be dead if I hadn't had a cage in my track car.

[RB Will]

Nobody makes one for the Corolla E12 though. I have mailed Custom Cages to get a rough price but I expect it will be my whole budget in one lump.


Just had a call back from them. Starting price for a bespoke cage would be about £1600 and can go up to £4000 depending on spec.

Edited by RB Will on Monday 7th April 15:12

[skibum]

I've just started building my own track toy (MX5) and prioritised the following:

Tyres - I went with Federal 595 RSRs
Suspension - I went with coilovers rather than just lowering springs
Brakes - kept existing discs, but uprated fluid and yellowstuff pads.

That's it for now, but will be fitting a roll bar soon - although appreciate there are options for the MX5 and not for you.

I think that is probably a good start and will then just start using it and getting more experience before I think of doing anything else (although seats and harness may creep onto the list).

[Lorientfo]

RB Will said:

Strip it as much as possible

If you do strip it down just remember to keep it safe and either leave the door cards in or replace them with some sort of lightweight covers. Too many people seem to think removing door cards and leaving razor sharp edges right next to their arms is a good idea.

[RB Will]

Good point. Will probably leave the door cards and dash in so all the electrics stay functional . Loosing every last ounce doesn't matter so much as its only for fun not setting lap times.
Should still be able to drop a fair bit of weights it's quite a lardy hatch. Makes an appreciable difference even if carrying a passenger or not so if I can drop 100 kg I will be happy.

[upsidedownmark]

skibum said:

I've just started building my own track toy (MX5) and prioritised the following:

Tyres - I went with Federal 595 RSRs
Suspension - I went with coilovers rather than just lowering springs
Brakes - kept existing discs, but uprated fluid and yellowstuff pads.

That's it for now, but will be fitting a roll bar soon - although appreciate there are options for the MX5 and not for you.

I think that is probably a good start and will then just start using it and getting more experience before I think of doing anything else (although seats and harness may creep onto the list).

Look at a foamectomy - done that with mine, makes a surprisingly large difference. Struggling to justify a proper seat right now.

For the OP, I'd suggest you get booked on a day, go thrash it, THEN decide what it needs..

[RB Will]

That is an option but then there is the chance that I will throw £200 at a trackday only to find the brakes are smoking after 2 laps.
Luckily there is the castle Combe action day coming up in a few weeks so if I can get the car by then it would be a handy shakedown.

[Munter]

RB Will said:

That is an option but then there is the chance that I will throw £200 at a trackday only to find the brakes are smoking after 2 laps.
Luckily there is the castle Combe action day coming up in a few weeks so if I can get the car by then it would be a handy shakedown.

Action Day.... I wouldn't. You have good personal injury cover right?


Just put some more track focused pads, and racing fluid (not dot 5.1, racing fluid will be dot 4), on and book a real trackday.

Then decide on suspension upgrades.

[motorhole]

Don‘t forget if you upgrade to track rubber, the extra grip will mean brakes and suspension have to do more work. If the brakes can be overwhelmed on the road, on normal road rubber, you‘ll cook them in no time at all on a track with 595s, 888s or the like. Stripping as much weight out as you‘re willing to will help though.

Same with the suspension. If the car rolls a bit now, wait till you have some extra adhesion from track rubber!

The likes of KW and Koni do sports dampers and springs for reasonable money, there‘s no need to go full coilover yet. Avoid being tempted by cheap coilovers (JOM, ProSport etc) that appear to be the same price as decent springs/dampers, they‘re best left to people who want to roll low without much care for handling. If you want to go coilover, BC, Gaz and HSD are fairly well regarded for the money.

Uprated anti-roll bars will make a big difference in combination with springs and dampers.

I‘d keep it on road rubber first to see how it feels - but you will wear road tyres quickly on track if you do more than 3 or 4 laps at a time. If it‘s happy on uprated discs and pads and dampers/springs, then go get yourself some track rubber.

[upsidedownmark]

My point is that so much 'depends' - on the car, and you as a driver.

Some will say you need track rubber. Pros and cons discussed above.
Some will say you must have uprated suspension, etc.
The list goes on. If it's just for trackday fun and laptime is less important, not much is required.

I've driven a few different cars on track, all bone stock. Some ate tyres (boxster, 3 td's from a set) some don't (mx5 - no noticeable wear). Some cooked brakes (z3 - after about 5 laps), others will go all day (boxster, mx5)..

If you can cook the brakes after 2 laps you're using them too much on any car. Brake properly (hard and short) and carry corner speed. Plus it's a fairly low powered car; the amount of energy you can put into the brakes is limited by how much the engine puts out!

Entirely up to you of course, but as you asked

[_Batty_]

RB Will said:

That is an option but then there is the chance that I will throw £200 at a trackday only to find the brakes are smoking after 2 laps.
Luckily there is the castle Combe action day coming up in a few weeks so if I can get the car by then it would be a handy shakedown.

I'd find a track day that does beginner sessions (30mins) and do a couple to see. After seeing plenty of action days and their driving standards I think I'd rather leave it.

[AMST09]

Brakes are probably no1

I had massive fade after 20mins at Rockingham, with 4 pot brembos with grooved and vented discs, literally did nothing was doing 120mph at the time.
Was pretty scary, luckily they have run off area, so just for safety and piece of mind I would do this first

Next would be tyres, I was running track tyres and standard suspension
A mate in another car the same as mine had road tyres and lowering springs
He struggled like hell to get grip round the corners even though his was quite a bit lower than mine

Don't forget the grip from the tyres will put more strain on everything though, and if you get track tyres warm them up! A mate in an evo didn't realise how much warming they needed and after 1 lap we came boucing over the kerbs and through the gravel/grass

[rallycross]

sell it and buy something else like an MR2 or MX5 - apart from the engine there is nothing suitable about a Corolla T sport for a track car - unless you want to get involved in changing anti roll bars, shocks and springs, front brakes, seats etc.

[RB Will]

Swapping it is a reasonable idea but I cant think what for. I have spent time in mk2 and mk3 MR2s and didnt find them particularly interesting. A couple of times I have driven MX5s I just cant fit comfortably and my feet are too big to use the pedals safely.
Other option would be pushing the budget a bit on a beemer of some sort but I used to track my E30 325IS and while it was fine and capable even with DS2500 pads, good fluid and braided lines it would get brake fade after a few laps and wobbled and rolled around like a boat. Gripped like poo to a sheet though and would turn in respectable times. E30s are a bit expensive now and having driven a mates E36 a few times it didnt feel too inspiring either.
All of the above options would probably involve spending a few pennies sorting it and then there is the risk of me buying a dud one and I know the Corolla is sound and no worse on track than my 325 was. Also a bit of fun to use something different.

[geeks]

rallycross said:

sell it and buy something else like an MR2 or MX5 - apart from the engine there is nothing suitable about a Corolla T sport for a track car - unless you want to get involved in changing anti roll bars, shocks and springs, front brakes, seats etc.

Bullst! Sorry but that is utter rubbish. Trackdays aren't about ultimate driving machinery and pace, they are about driver enjoyment, involvement, technique and above all just plain fun. Even the most bland of road cars can be immense fun on a track. There are plenty of people who track cars other than MR2's and MXs's and grin like idiots.

RB Will said:

Swapping it is a reasonable idea but I cant think what for. I have spent time in mk2 and mk3 MR2s and didnt find them particularly interesting. A couple of times I have driven MX5s I just cant fit comfortably and my feet are too big to use the pedals safely.
Other option would be pushing the budget a bit on a beemer of some sort but I used to track my E30 325IS and while it was fine and capable even with DS2500 pads, good fluid and braided lines it would get brake fade after a few laps and wobbled and rolled around like a boat. Gripped like poo to a sheet though and would turn in respectable times. E30s are a bit expensive now and having driven a mates E36 a few times it didnt feel too inspiring either.
All of the above options would probably involve spending a few pennies sorting it and then there is the risk of me buying a dud one and I know the Corolla is sound and no worse on track than my 325 was. Also a bit of fun to use something different.

If it is yours and free keep it and crack on. Why not get it out in a 30 minute taster as is and see how you get on with it before commiting time or money into it first. Get some weight out from unreqired things for a track such as rears seasts, rear trim panels, sterios, speakers etc these are easy to remove and will drop a decent amount of weight from the car. Leave the front door panels in or replace with something if you do remove them from the car. Bang the lot on eBay and spend any money you make on some tuition, then look into upgrades.

However if you do decided to swap it out, don't be put off by an E36 2nd poster in thread has one, as do I. Ok mine is stripped out, on uprated brakes, track rubber and coilovers with all of the weight dropped but is a hoot to drive and has seen off much more exoctic machinery at Bedford!



If it were me, I would stick to the Corolla!

[5RedLights]

RB Will said:

Also a bit of fun to use something different.

Totally agree with this. You'll have far more fun being in something different than just being another 172, MX5, MR2 or E36/E46 (not to say that they aren't great cars though). Plus, you're familiar with this car already, so you'll be much happier pushing it than something new to you.

[motorhole]

E36 Compact isn't a bad shout actually! Smaller and lighter than a full E36, same rear end as an E30 so a little lively, cheap to buy, cheap to run and a whole host of future engine swaps available should you like it.