Red flags instead of Yellows. A rant.
Discussion
Am I the only person who thinks this obsession with throwing a red flag when a car spins at a track day is a bit over the top. I think most of these could be dealt with by yellows and not disrupt the day as much? Surely trackday operators can assess the seriousness of the incident and react in an appropriate manner?
I know we'll get the sensationalist crowers who will bleat on about everyone's safety, in an "Apple Pie and Motherhood" Health and Safety is a serious religion manner that bores us all to distraction, but there has to be a happy compromise somewhere...
I know we'll get the sensationalist crowers who will bleat on about everyone's safety, in an "Apple Pie and Motherhood" Health and Safety is a serious religion manner that bores us all to distraction, but there has to be a happy compromise somewhere...
PetrolTed said:
Probably the circuit operators that decide rather than the TDO.
in most cases yes. equally, the participants on the track day have a major effect on the decisions - if everyone slows down sufficiently under a yellow flag the circuit officials are much less likely to throw a red flag, IME.Jonny
BaT
I have no objection to a red if a car needs to be recovered. I reserve the right to be annoyed at the numpty that caused it, unless it was me and then it was obviously mechanical failure. I did once object to the childish antics of the circuit marshalls threatening to close the track due to too many reds. It was like being back at school, they didn't have the gumption to kick the miscreants off track and decided to threaten everyone instead. Pah.
If you have a comp licence then it can be endorsed or you can be fined or banned etc, a good deterant for un-necessarily endangering recovery crews / marshalls.
On a track day, there is little real deterant and quite frankly there is no race to spoil.
Judging by some of the driving i have seen i would be very worried about going out on track (on foot) to recover a car or piece of debris.
I guess its just not worth it for the crews that do it.
I don't blame them, after all, we've seen marshalls get run over at race mtgs, very sad to see it happen.
Being a Saint and never having caused a red flag (touch wood, no not that).... i still blame the drivers for poorly preped cars and optimistic driving.
What i don't understand about driving instruction is that you get taught how to go faster before you are taught how to recover an errant car, bit like learning Judo without learning how to fall properly.
On a track day, there is little real deterant and quite frankly there is no race to spoil.
Judging by some of the driving i have seen i would be very worried about going out on track (on foot) to recover a car or piece of debris.
I guess its just not worth it for the crews that do it.
I don't blame them, after all, we've seen marshalls get run over at race mtgs, very sad to see it happen.
Being a Saint and never having caused a red flag (touch wood, no not that).... i still blame the drivers for poorly preped cars and optimistic driving.
What i don't understand about driving instruction is that you get taught how to go faster before you are taught how to recover an errant car, bit like learning Judo without learning how to fall properly.
phatgixer said:
Am I the only person who thinks this obsession with throwing a red flag when a car spins at a track day is a bit over the top.
...but Red flags give you the chance to go drifting around Club though Angus, so what you moaning about 
I think there should be a 'special' flag just for you.....hmmm, i'm thinking PINK !!!!!
Edited by Glenn McMenamin on Tuesday 18th December 21:50
With more and more of the corners being given extra tarmac runoff and less gravel, hopefully this will help lessen the reds too.
Having been a habitual whiner at spinners, when it was my turn at Goodwood to make a tit out of meself in the rain i apologised to every driver i got the chance to and bought the marshalls lunch too.
Having been a habitual whiner at spinners, when it was my turn at Goodwood to make a tit out of meself in the rain i apologised to every driver i got the chance to and bought the marshalls lunch too.
Hobzy said:
With more and more of the corners being given extra tarmac runoff and less gravel, hopefully this will help lessen the reds too.
Having been a habitual whiner at spinners, when it was my turn at Goodwood to make a tit out of meself in the rain i apologised to every driver i got the chance to and bought the marshalls lunch too.
What a damned fine chap, i think the Marshalls would have been pretty fat by the end of the day on Saturday at Silverstone, if the spinners decided to do that.Having been a habitual whiner at spinners, when it was my turn at Goodwood to make a tit out of meself in the rain i apologised to every driver i got the chance to and bought the marshalls lunch too.
Edited by Glenn McMenamin on Tuesday 18th December 22:49
Glenn McMenamin said:
phatgixer said:
Am I the only person who thinks this obsession with throwing a red flag when a car spins at a track day is a bit over the top.
...but Red flags give you the chance to go drifting around Club though Angus, so what you moaning about I think there should be a 'special' flag just for you.....hmmm, i'm thinking PINK !!!!!
Edited by Glenn McMenamin on Tuesday 18th December 21:50
Ahem...
Glenn McMenamin said:
phatgixer said:
Am I the only person who thinks this obsession with throwing a red flag when a car spins at a track day is a bit over the top.
...but Red flags give you the chance to go drifting around Club though Angus, so what you moaning about I think there should be a 'special' flag just for you.....hmmm, i'm thinking PINK !!!!!
Angus, you know you love them for the reasons above!
Anggguuuusssss, you been spinning again.......
The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Sundeep said:
Anggguuuusssss, you been spinning again.......
The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Sundeep, you cheeky swine, the word "Again" is extremely ferkin rude as in my memory I have not had a spin at a trackday for years! I'll 'ave yer The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 19th December 15:02
phatgixer said:
Sundeep said:
Anggguuuusssss, you been spinning again.......
The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Sundeep, you cheeky swine, the word "Again" is extremely ferkin rude as in my memory I have not had a spin at a trackday for years! I'll 'ave yer The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 19th December 15:02
Sean Edwards said:
phatgixer said:
Sundeep said:
Anggguuuusssss, you been spinning again.......
The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Sundeep, you cheeky swine, the word "Again" is extremely ferkin rude as in my memory I have not had a spin at a trackday for years! I'll 'ave yer The issue is also track days cars dont always slow down properly for yellow flags ! so all you can do is bring out the reds...
Maybe they need a SAFETY CAR instead.........
but something in between for track day drivers
so hang onto that PINK idea !
Edited by phatgixer on Wednesday 19th December 15:02
Before that it was into the kitty litter at Becketts trying the demon fast line at over Vne and before that was a gyration into the barrier at Les Combs at Spa. My poor CSL..
A good drift might look like a spin, especially as the amount of "wheel slapping*" would be huge.
- (c) Billy Baiter Bennett.
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