Track-hack: Elise S1 v's VX220
Discussion
I'm thinking of getting one of these for just under 10k, and using it as a track-hack, plus for the odd sunny jaunt to Wales or over Snake Pass.
Which would be the best basis to form a good track motor? The VX seems like a lot more car for the money, whereas there's so many S1 variations that I just wouldn't know where to start!!!
I'm initially looking to track it straight out of the box (well, once I've added a harness, harness-holes to the seats, and a harness-bar) so don't want something where I'll need to junk all the suspension, brakes, etc.
ps, I really don't care that the VX is a Vauxhall.
Which would be the best basis to form a good track motor? The VX seems like a lot more car for the money, whereas there's so many S1 variations that I just wouldn't know where to start!!!
I'm initially looking to track it straight out of the box (well, once I've added a harness, harness-holes to the seats, and a harness-bar) so don't want something where I'll need to junk all the suspension, brakes, etc.
ps, I really don't care that the VX is a Vauxhall.
You're right, there are indeed alot of Elise varients. The VX220 is alotr of car for the money, although they weigh alot more than an S1 and this affects handling and breaking.
If you have a £10k budget you have several options:
1) Buy a 143 bhp S1 111s with close ratio gearbox
2) Buy a standard S1 with 118bhp
Don't be put off buy "standard" 118bhp cars with upgrades such as suspension, brakes, exhaust, and head work.
Key things for track work are:
- Upgraded toe links (if you plan to run semi slicks) as the standard toe links can snap.
- Nitron or Ohlin suspension for track work (common upgrade)
- Head work by Dave Andrews (DVA) or Kiwirog (Sabregheads)
- Brakes such as alloy bell discs and pagid pads.
They're great cars and very light on tyres and brakes. The key areas to watch on heavily tracked ones are suspension.
Hope this helps
If you have a £10k budget you have several options:
1) Buy a 143 bhp S1 111s with close ratio gearbox
2) Buy a standard S1 with 118bhp
Don't be put off buy "standard" 118bhp cars with upgrades such as suspension, brakes, exhaust, and head work.
Key things for track work are:
- Upgraded toe links (if you plan to run semi slicks) as the standard toe links can snap.
- Nitron or Ohlin suspension for track work (common upgrade)
- Head work by Dave Andrews (DVA) or Kiwirog (Sabregheads)
- Brakes such as alloy bell discs and pagid pads.
They're great cars and very light on tyres and brakes. The key areas to watch on heavily tracked ones are suspension.
Hope this helps
From my experience with both cars, (Used to instruct on the VX220 training courses, and at silverstone race school with the S1)
The S1 Elise is far better handling, as the VX was set up by Vauxhall to understeer, which it does at every opportunity, whereas the lotus tends to go into oversteer, more controllable and fun!
Both of these traits could be engineered out with setup though.
The VX is heavier, with the 2.2 engine versus the much lighter K series, but on the other hand the K series can be a tad unreliable.
Also to add to the weight of the VX, is ABS and airbags etc
The ABS & Servo system on the VX are a nightmare, cuts in way too soon when you`re trying to push on, no ABS or servo on the S1(The way a proper race car should be!)
The build quality of the lotus is better(shock!!) as all of the VX`s I have been in, the interiors tended to start to fall to pieces very quickly, the rear lights fill up with rain etc
You will prob find that most of the Elises have the harnesses in them, if not they are not that difficult to fit, never tried on a VX.
Personally I like the looks of the S1 more.
Would def be an S1 Elise for me, ideally the Sport 160.(might be out of your budget though)
Hope this helps, and obviously all in my opinion, am sure others will differ.
Scotty
The S1 Elise is far better handling, as the VX was set up by Vauxhall to understeer, which it does at every opportunity, whereas the lotus tends to go into oversteer, more controllable and fun!
Both of these traits could be engineered out with setup though.
The VX is heavier, with the 2.2 engine versus the much lighter K series, but on the other hand the K series can be a tad unreliable.
Also to add to the weight of the VX, is ABS and airbags etc
The ABS & Servo system on the VX are a nightmare, cuts in way too soon when you`re trying to push on, no ABS or servo on the S1(The way a proper race car should be!)
The build quality of the lotus is better(shock!!) as all of the VX`s I have been in, the interiors tended to start to fall to pieces very quickly, the rear lights fill up with rain etc
You will prob find that most of the Elises have the harnesses in them, if not they are not that difficult to fit, never tried on a VX.
Personally I like the looks of the S1 more.
Would def be an S1 Elise for me, ideally the Sport 160.(might be out of your budget though)
Hope this helps, and obviously all in my opinion, am sure others will differ.
Scotty
Edited by scotty_dog on Tuesday 23 March 12:55
Have you thought of a kit car?
I got myself a Fury, very light, far quicker than either of the cars you are thinking of, great handling which is easy to adjust and upgrade at minimal cost, easy to work on and very cheap to run. My insurance is £120 per year and I hvae no no claims as I have always had Company cars.
I track min and I can get Jerry can tools and oil on the passenger seat spare clothes and pump no problem, its not great if it rains but the advantages far out way that particular drawback if its just a car for fun.
I got myself a Fury, very light, far quicker than either of the cars you are thinking of, great handling which is easy to adjust and upgrade at minimal cost, easy to work on and very cheap to run. My insurance is £120 per year and I hvae no no claims as I have always had Company cars.
I track min and I can get Jerry can tools and oil on the passenger seat spare clothes and pump no problem, its not great if it rains but the advantages far out way that particular drawback if its just a car for fun.
Cheers guys! That's all perfect – just the sort of stuff I needed to hear! I'll start the look-out based on what you've suggested!
Sniff, the 325 got sold a fair while ago – about a year ago I think!!! I chopped it in for an E46 M3 which I then treated with total respect...
You can see my old 325i in the background of this shot actually...
The guy I sold it to had planned to fit the LSD I also sold him, some Porker brakes (his mate runs Ninemeister) and repaint it white, though I've not seen or heard anything of it for a while. I chopped in the M as eventually it only ever got used for track days and I was starting to get a bit daft with it.. conversations with my passenger like "how many times can I slide out of Knickerbrook in the wet without getting black-flagged?" and it was going to end badly (££££). In truth, having all that power made it too easy to be sloppy, as I could always stamp on the gas and catch up. Fancy something a bit more precise now, something that requires a lot more concentration and skill, hence the lightweights mentioned here.
How's your build going?
Sniff, the 325 got sold a fair while ago – about a year ago I think!!! I chopped it in for an E46 M3 which I then treated with total respect...
You can see my old 325i in the background of this shot actually...
The guy I sold it to had planned to fit the LSD I also sold him, some Porker brakes (his mate runs Ninemeister) and repaint it white, though I've not seen or heard anything of it for a while. I chopped in the M as eventually it only ever got used for track days and I was starting to get a bit daft with it.. conversations with my passenger like "how many times can I slide out of Knickerbrook in the wet without getting black-flagged?" and it was going to end badly (££££). In truth, having all that power made it too easy to be sloppy, as I could always stamp on the gas and catch up. Fancy something a bit more precise now, something that requires a lot more concentration and skill, hence the lightweights mentioned here.
How's your build going?
The vx may be heavier but bhp is much more, I know of two vx's within your budget with 182 and 172 bhp. If you buy an NA VX you have the choice of supercharging, if you do it yourself for about £2500 and this will give you approx 250bhp. If you intend to track it you are better buying one with 16" front wheels rather than the standard 17", this will give you more tyre choice and will turn quicker. Regarding the ABS it is rubbish, some people fit the 4 channel ABS off the VXR, others, like me, just put in a switch to turn it off.
If I had £10k to spend I would buy a VX for around £7.5k with 16" front wheels and spend the rest fitting a supercharger, you will then have a car with close on 300bhp per ton!!!!!
If I had £10k to spend I would buy a VX for around £7.5k with 16" front wheels and spend the rest fitting a supercharger, you will then have a car with close on 300bhp per ton!!!!!
Windymiller said:
Sniff, the 325 got sold a fair while ago – about a year ago I think
It's not this one by any chance?:http://www.bmwowner.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&a...
I've driven my mates vxr220, which are turbos, and I was unimpressed. There are turbos running 400bhp, around 300bhp seems easily attainable but I would imagine most of the power comes all at once, I'm open to being educated, and this prob not ideal as atrack car. I still say a vx for 7.5k and supercharger install for 2.5k would be better than a turbo, plus you'll really struggle to get a turbo for 10k
I share an S1 with a mate , purely a track car so trailered to tracks but no insurance/tax/mot costs to add to running the car.
If you primarily want a track car then the Lotus is the only choice imo, from my experience much faster around a track but less frills on the road.
Our S1 cost us about 6.5k, on the road still at that point, (cheapest we could find) but we've spent plenty on it since. An ex silverstone academy car so came with extra diagonal roll bar, harnesses and plumbed in extinguisher etc etc (which devalued it !) Well worth looking for something simillar.
With the added single rate springs, gaz shocks and race set up it wouldnt be a nice drive on the road but fast on track.
A std motor can be pushed up to 180ish bhp without spending stupid money but remember the more power the less miles before it breaks !!
D.
If you primarily want a track car then the Lotus is the only choice imo, from my experience much faster around a track but less frills on the road.
Our S1 cost us about 6.5k, on the road still at that point, (cheapest we could find) but we've spent plenty on it since. An ex silverstone academy car so came with extra diagonal roll bar, harnesses and plumbed in extinguisher etc etc (which devalued it !) Well worth looking for something simillar.
With the added single rate springs, gaz shocks and race set up it wouldnt be a nice drive on the road but fast on track.
A std motor can be pushed up to 180ish bhp without spending stupid money but remember the more power the less miles before it breaks !!
D.
sniff diesel said:
Windymiller said:
Sniff, the 325 got sold a fair while ago – about a year ago I think
It's not this one by any chance?:http://www.bmwowner.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=26&a...
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