Few track day questions
Discussion
Hey guys 
I think i would quite like the idea of going on a track day but have a few questions (probably all been asked before).
I have been racing for 4 years now. here's what i race (not me but same kart): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdcEUYvyXx8
First things first, would i find a track day a little frustrating? basically would i get the same thrill as i do from racing? are you not really allowed to push your car? (i totally understand that a track day is NOT a race and that you can only overtake on straights and that you generally have to be very careful and not drive like a dick!)
Secondly, would my car stand up to the abuse? its only a little 1.6 citroen c2 gt so not the quickest thing in the world. i have recently serviced my car and fitted new pads and discs aswell as new tires. would i cook my brakes within a few laps? should i put ducting on to help cool them? should i fit track spec pads? will i destroy my tires? is there anything else that is likely to cry enough?
Also when braking hard and the abs kicks in my hazard lights come on as a safety feature. obviously this could become confusing for others and make me look a bit stupid. i was thinking that i could just take the fuse out to stop this but then i also need the indicators for pulling into the pits or letting people past so is there any way i can get around this?
is there anything else you think i should know? iv looked up insurance and could get it for £75 for the day but would be a bit pointless considering the excess is £1000 and thats half the worth of the car.
I think i would quite like the idea of going on a track day but have a few questions (probably all been asked before).
I have been racing for 4 years now. here's what i race (not me but same kart): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NdcEUYvyXx8
First things first, would i find a track day a little frustrating? basically would i get the same thrill as i do from racing? are you not really allowed to push your car? (i totally understand that a track day is NOT a race and that you can only overtake on straights and that you generally have to be very careful and not drive like a dick!)
Secondly, would my car stand up to the abuse? its only a little 1.6 citroen c2 gt so not the quickest thing in the world. i have recently serviced my car and fitted new pads and discs aswell as new tires. would i cook my brakes within a few laps? should i put ducting on to help cool them? should i fit track spec pads? will i destroy my tires? is there anything else that is likely to cry enough?
Also when braking hard and the abs kicks in my hazard lights come on as a safety feature. obviously this could become confusing for others and make me look a bit stupid. i was thinking that i could just take the fuse out to stop this but then i also need the indicators for pulling into the pits or letting people past so is there any way i can get around this?
is there anything else you think i should know? iv looked up insurance and could get it for £75 for the day but would be a bit pointless considering the excess is £1000 and thats half the worth of the car.
You won't find it as exciting as racing, but that doesn't mean you won't have any fun.
If you are an experienced driver then you are likely to get to the limits of an ordinary road car's brakes quite quickly, but you won't know until you try.
Hazards on wth ABS is a good one - don't Fiat 500s do this as well? Best thingt is to check with the track day organiser at the start of the day what they prefer. They may just mention it in the briefing so everyong knows about it, or ask you to take the fuse out and use hand signals, but lilkely to be the former.
I wouldn't bother with insurance - most track days are well run and I have seen almost no car to car contact in 10 years of doing them.
Martin
If you are an experienced driver then you are likely to get to the limits of an ordinary road car's brakes quite quickly, but you won't know until you try.
Hazards on wth ABS is a good one - don't Fiat 500s do this as well? Best thingt is to check with the track day organiser at the start of the day what they prefer. They may just mention it in the briefing so everyong knows about it, or ask you to take the fuse out and use hand signals, but lilkely to be the former.
I wouldn't bother with insurance - most track days are well run and I have seen almost no car to car contact in 10 years of doing them.
Martin
^^^^^ All this, plus...
I would say definately change your brake fluid to AP racing fluid. My first trackday in my old trackcar (306 GTi6) was spoiled a bit by the brakes fading early on in the day. Everything else was already upgraded when I bought it but, obviously not the fluid. Demon tweeks sell it and it's not expensive.
Re your hazzards, many cars like mine don't have indicators. Just make sure your hand signals are clear, especially the left one. Maybe wind the passenger seat-back down. You'll know from racing that your position and speed say as much as indicating in most cases.
Also your C2 will be fine. You'll get passed on the straights by certain cars but you'll then reel them back in during the next set of bends. Fair enough they'll leave you again on the next straight but it's still satisfying, knowing you're quicker.
Most of all be safe and have fun!
I would say definately change your brake fluid to AP racing fluid. My first trackday in my old trackcar (306 GTi6) was spoiled a bit by the brakes fading early on in the day. Everything else was already upgraded when I bought it but, obviously not the fluid. Demon tweeks sell it and it's not expensive.
Re your hazzards, many cars like mine don't have indicators. Just make sure your hand signals are clear, especially the left one. Maybe wind the passenger seat-back down. You'll know from racing that your position and speed say as much as indicating in most cases.
Also your C2 will be fine. You'll get passed on the straights by certain cars but you'll then reel them back in during the next set of bends. Fair enough they'll leave you again on the next straight but it's still satisfying, knowing you're quicker.
Most of all be safe and have fun!
Thanks for the replies guys. I'll make sure i change the brake fluid for some good stuff, hopefully be able to get some from work :P
What about tires? Will i ruin my set of new Pirelli's or will they not wear too much? I'm guessing a lot of it comes down to driving style.
As you say it should be good fun going through the bends and then getting annialated on the straights
What about tires? Will i ruin my set of new Pirelli's or will they not wear too much? I'm guessing a lot of it comes down to driving style.
As you say it should be good fun going through the bends and then getting annialated on the straights
Steve H said:
You can usually get the body control unit on Peugeot-Citroens reconfigured to remove the hazards-under-hard-braking feature so as long as you can live with not having it on the road then that might be a good option.
oo this sounds interesting! How do i go about doing this? Is it something i do myself or will i have to take it to a dealer?Also isn't one of the reasons the car is only insurance group 6 is because of this safety feature. Would this mean removing it would void my insurance?
Would be brilliant if i could get it removed though
Normal road tyres should be OK. I done my first trackday on a set of Toyo T1Rs and they were fine.
I didn't really do much research about pressure levels, so the tyres would have been over inflated by quite a bit. That, coupled with a bit too much enthusiasm in the first half of the day, meant that the fronts were worn close to the legal limit on the outside edge (they were pretty much brand new, only done a few hundred miles on the road).
Just swapped the fronts with the backs now for road use, and got a completely different set for track. Much easier that way.
Easily avoidable if you do your research before, like you're doing now
Still at £30 a corner, it's not the end of the world if any of them need replacing
I wouldn't worry about the car being fast enough. My car is hopeless in a straight line, it just means I have to pay a bit more attention to my mirrors and let lots of people by.
I didn't really do much research about pressure levels, so the tyres would have been over inflated by quite a bit. That, coupled with a bit too much enthusiasm in the first half of the day, meant that the fronts were worn close to the legal limit on the outside edge (they were pretty much brand new, only done a few hundred miles on the road).
Just swapped the fronts with the backs now for road use, and got a completely different set for track. Much easier that way.
Easily avoidable if you do your research before, like you're doing now
Still at £30 a corner, it's not the end of the world if any of them need replacing I wouldn't worry about the car being fast enough. My car is hopeless in a straight line, it just means I have to pay a bit more attention to my mirrors and let lots of people by.
i did my first trackday 2 years ago at oulton park, in what was pretty much the lowest powered car there. ran initially on nexen n2000 road tyres, then toyo t1rs, since then have done quite a few more, and always looking to improve and upgrade as and when time/finance permit. ebc brakes, poly bushes, exhaust, induction, dampers and springs, r888s, and so on. it's always something new you discover, as you're pushing on, and the process of improving is absorbing in itself.
even now, the only cars i keep up and run with are friends who bring their 207 and new shape 500, but the winter period will be about sorting out the epic body roll i get, as you can see below:
but despite the lack of power, it's not a race and the only person i am testing really, is myself, i must admit, i'm not that good, and do lose concentration a little a get a bit raggedy her and there. but it's great fun, and i look forward to more. if the old girl will hold together long enough!
ps: my friend with a 500 has the same hazard flashing issue, apparantly is quite simple with a laptop and OBD thingy to turn it off, apparantly.......
even now, the only cars i keep up and run with are friends who bring their 207 and new shape 500, but the winter period will be about sorting out the epic body roll i get, as you can see below:
but despite the lack of power, it's not a race and the only person i am testing really, is myself, i must admit, i'm not that good, and do lose concentration a little a get a bit raggedy her and there. but it's great fun, and i look forward to more. if the old girl will hold together long enough!
ps: my friend with a 500 has the same hazard flashing issue, apparantly is quite simple with a laptop and OBD thingy to turn it off, apparantly.......
Edited by jaibk on Thursday 16th December 21:05
You reprogram the configuration via the 16 pin OBD plug on the car but you will need either a dealer or a decent diagnostic specialist to do it, it's not something for the average garage or for DIY.
Interesting question about the insurance, hard to imagine that they would ever find out but the proper answer is that you should inform them as with any mods that you make to the car.
Interesting question about the insurance, hard to imagine that they would ever find out but the proper answer is that you should inform them as with any mods that you make to the car.
Well i have a load of AP 5.1 brake fluid sat at home as long as nobodies put it in a van or something!
As for pads, what would you reccomend? I can get green stuff but i dont think that would really be an improvement. Do you know where i could purchase some race spec pads?
Will probably be sticking with the tires i have on at the moment as R888's look like they'll be costing me about £500 for 4.
What tire pressures would you reccomend for my current tires? 30psi hot?
Will get in contact with Citroen over christmas about the indicators.
Thanks for all the info btw!
As for pads, what would you reccomend? I can get green stuff but i dont think that would really be an improvement. Do you know where i could purchase some race spec pads?
Will probably be sticking with the tires i have on at the moment as R888's look like they'll be costing me about £500 for 4.
What tire pressures would you reccomend for my current tires? 30psi hot?
Will get in contact with Citroen over christmas about the indicators.
Thanks for all the info btw!
Go for Yellow Pads. I use them and put them on track/road cars. They are very good value.
What size are your tyres. Try a set of Federal RS-R's. Much cheaper than 888's.
Cannot really comment on your pressures without testing the car on track myself really, but hot pressures around normal specified pressure or slightly above. You need to see how the car handles and monitor tyre wear then adjust appropriately really. Have you acces to a pyrometer?
Eddy
What size are your tyres. Try a set of Federal RS-R's. Much cheaper than 888's.
Cannot really comment on your pressures without testing the car on track myself really, but hot pressures around normal specified pressure or slightly above. You need to see how the car handles and monitor tyre wear then adjust appropriately really. Have you acces to a pyrometer?
Eddy
I have been looking everywhere but can't seem to find any track spec pads for a C2. Can't find yellow stuff or anything of the sort 
I'm at uni atm so not near my car but from memory i think my tires are 196/45 R16 and can't remember speed rating. They're standard GT rims.
Is it a case of just going a bit higher on the pressures. I should be able to borrow a pyrometer for the day. A case of taking inside, middle and outside temps on all 4 corners and then adjusting as neccisary? Im sure camber adjustment would come in handy here...
I'm at uni atm so not near my car but from memory i think my tires are 196/45 R16 and can't remember speed rating. They're standard GT rims.
Is it a case of just going a bit higher on the pressures. I should be able to borrow a pyrometer for the day. A case of taking inside, middle and outside temps on all 4 corners and then adjusting as neccisary? Im sure camber adjustment would come in handy here...
Lots of good advice here apart from not bothering with trackday insurance. unless you can afford to put your car in the barrier and write it off to expearience and assuming this is your daily I would have it. Most trackday incidents are not car to car but typically driver getting too cocky or enthusiastic then panicing and disappearing into a tyrewall or pitwall possibly via a gravel trap .
See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
mad4amanda said:
Lots of good advice here apart from not bothering with trackday insurance. unless you can afford to put your car in the barrier and write it off to expearience and assuming this is your daily I would have it. Most trackday incidents are not car to car but typically driver getting too cocky or enthusiastic then panicing and disappearing into a tyrewall or pitwall possibly via a gravel trap .
See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
All add the the other persons experience who said don't bother. In 9 years of regular trackdays I have seen a grand total of one incident. That was at Castle Combe when a chap with a Saphire Cosworth told his 18 year old daughter to get behind the wheel and have a go and she planted it straight into the armco.See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
Edited by Herman Toothrot on Friday 17th December 18:20
Herman Toothrot said:
mad4amanda said:
Lots of good advice here apart from not bothering with trackday insurance. unless you can afford to put your car in the barrier and write it off to expearience and assuming this is your daily I would have it. Most trackday incidents are not car to car but typically driver getting too cocky or enthusiastic then panicing and disappearing into a tyrewall or pitwall possibly via a gravel trap .
See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
All add the the other persons experience who said don't bother. In 9 years of regular trackdays I have seen a grand total of one incident. That was at Castle Combe when a chap with a Saphire Cosworth told his 18 year old daughter to get behind the wheel and have a go and she planted it straight into the armco.See it every day Ive ever been on except for 1 .
It was a saxo today at brands Paddock hill bend too fast crunch !
Wow please come to brands if thats the effect your prescence has as for me its just my job for too many years!
Edited by Herman Toothrot on Friday 17th December 18:20
DBaldwin said:
I have been looking everywhere but can't seem to find any track spec pads for a C2. Can't find yellow stuff or anything of the sort
I'm at uni atm so not near my car but from memory i think my tires are 196/45 R16 and can't remember speed rating. They're standard GT rims.
Is it a case of just going a bit higher on the pressures. I should be able to borrow a pyrometer for the day. A case of taking inside, middle and outside temps on all 4 corners and then adjusting as neccisary? Im sure camber adjustment would come in handy here...
You can get Yellow to fit your caliper. You just need to know how to manipulate their part numbers.I'm at uni atm so not near my car but from memory i think my tires are 196/45 R16 and can't remember speed rating. They're standard GT rims.
Is it a case of just going a bit higher on the pressures. I should be able to borrow a pyrometer for the day. A case of taking inside, middle and outside temps on all 4 corners and then adjusting as neccisary? Im sure camber adjustment would come in handy here...
Eddy
DBaldwin said:
I have been looking everywhere but can't seem to find any track spec pads for a C2. Can't find yellow stuff or anything of the sort
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