Working a notice period when made redundant.
Discussion
Ok, yesterday the OH has been given 4 weeks notice. She has worked there 3 years.
Today she has found a new job to start on Monday. If she can't start Monday she doesn't get the job, they need someone ASAP.
What's the deal with working the 4 weeks notice at the old place and will she kiss goodbye to her redundancy pay out?
TIA
Today she has found a new job to start on Monday. If she can't start Monday she doesn't get the job, they need someone ASAP.
What's the deal with working the 4 weeks notice at the old place and will she kiss goodbye to her redundancy pay out?
TIA
Completely depends on the current employers and her relationship with them but I would have thought that if she leaves before then notice period, then there is no obligation to pay her redundancy.
Put it another way - if she resigned a week before they announced the redundancies, she wouldn't expect/be entitled to it, would she?
I have even come across situations (personally) where the redundancy agreement is predicated on the employee not having another job to go to at the date of leaving.
Put it another way - if she resigned a week before they announced the redundancies, she wouldn't expect/be entitled to it, would she?
I have even come across situations (personally) where the redundancy agreement is predicated on the employee not having another job to go to at the date of leaving.
CAPPO has a point, because if the employee leaves early she repudiates the contract. The employer could accept the repudiation and end the contract, and then the termination would occur not by reason of redundancy but by reason of the employee's breach of contract. There could be other negative consequences of leaving early, but I need not dwell on them here. Best idea: seek to negotiate an early release, with redundancy calculated by reference to the early end date.
V8mate said:
Given she only has three years' service, it may be that the OP's wife values continued employment over a (likely) paltry redundancy payment.
That's her way of thinking at the moment. I would be tempted to ride it out and find something better but she has a choice between leaving them in the s
t or a job and work over Xmas. This is no "getting rid of dead wood" exercise either - the whole place goes in 4 weeks! I believe she has a few unused holidays left, not many.
condor said:
I'd suggest she speak to her line manager ( who presumably will also be out of a job). If the company is going bust then there is likely no money to pay redundancy or salaries and it will have to be reclaimed from the goverment which will take months!
It's not really that sort of company. There's tge owner, manager (who had already handed her notice in), assistant manager(the OH 
) and 10 labourers!I had to work my 3 months notice (been there 16 years), when I say work I mean sit in an office on my own without a PC and having had all my work taken off me. I just read and watched films all day although it was incredibly boring, you just have to remind yourself you're getting paid to do it and there's quite a chunk of money at stake.
Breadvan72 said:
CAPPO has a point, because if the employee leaves early she repudiates the contract. The employer could accept the repudiation and end the contract, and then the termination would occur not by reason of redundancy but by reason of the employee's breach of contract. There could be other negative consequences of leaving early, but I need not dwell on them here. Best idea: seek to negotiate an early release, with redundancy calculated by reference to the early end date.
This. When I was last made redundant my employer was quite happy to pay my notice in lieu and let me leave early.It seems strange that a company offer a job only on a condition that you start in 3 days time, or else you dont get it.
That's not a particularly well thought out recruitment process, it'd kill off pretty much everyone in existing jobs and would only let the company take on people who're unemployed.
Do you, or your Mrs really want to get into a company that will put down terms that are very tight, and threaten to pull the rug if you cant or wont do it?
Hardly the best footing to start a new relationship off.
That said, if it's that or nowt, I'd be negotiating hard with the old job on the basis of 'you've made my role redundant, I need another job and one's come up but there's a starting date mismatch. How can you help me'
You've also got to remember that the old company have a duty, I'd be asking for PILON and a leaving date of tomorrow if this new job is what I really wanted or had to do
That's not a particularly well thought out recruitment process, it'd kill off pretty much everyone in existing jobs and would only let the company take on people who're unemployed.
Do you, or your Mrs really want to get into a company that will put down terms that are very tight, and threaten to pull the rug if you cant or wont do it?
Hardly the best footing to start a new relationship off.
That said, if it's that or nowt, I'd be negotiating hard with the old job on the basis of 'you've made my role redundant, I need another job and one's come up but there's a starting date mismatch. How can you help me'
You've also got to remember that the old company have a duty, I'd be asking for PILON and a leaving date of tomorrow if this new job is what I really wanted or had to do
andy-xr said:
It seems strange that a company offer a job only on a condition that you start in 3 days time, or else you dont get it.
That's not a particularly well thought out recruitment process, it'd kill off pretty much everyone in existing jobs and would only let the company take on people who're unemployed.
Do you, or your Mrs really want to get into a company that will put down terms that are very tight, and threaten to pull the rug if you cant or wont do it?
Hardly the best footing to start a new relationship off.
That said, if it's that or nowt, I'd be negotiating hard with the old job on the basis of 'you've made my role redundant, I need another job and one's come up but there's a starting date mismatch. How can you help me'
You've also got to remember that the old company have a duty, I'd be asking for PILON and a leaving date of tomorrow if this new job is what I really wanted or had to do
I think what it boils down to is he needs someone ASAP. If she starts Monday its hers. If not he has to wait 4 weeks he will carry on looking for someone who will start sooner. Don't forget there's another 10 people in the same boat locally in the same sector. It's not a dream package or anything, it's a means to an end. That's not a particularly well thought out recruitment process, it'd kill off pretty much everyone in existing jobs and would only let the company take on people who're unemployed.
Do you, or your Mrs really want to get into a company that will put down terms that are very tight, and threaten to pull the rug if you cant or wont do it?
Hardly the best footing to start a new relationship off.
That said, if it's that or nowt, I'd be negotiating hard with the old job on the basis of 'you've made my role redundant, I need another job and one's come up but there's a starting date mismatch. How can you help me'
You've also got to remember that the old company have a duty, I'd be asking for PILON and a leaving date of tomorrow if this new job is what I really wanted or had to do
The current boss has made some comment in passing along the lines of "as long as you all work your notice you will get your money at the end of it" and I wondered if that was a fact or if it was so she doesn't lose her man power in the next 4 weeks. There is still work to do.
It's not great leaving people up s
t creek - but that's little consolation when you're crying into your gruel on Xmas day. It's a dog eat dog world. There is a probably small but not utterly remote chance that the current employer could come after Mrs OP if she leaves the job early. I doubt that any Judge would grant an injunction in these circumstances to compel,the employee to wait out her notice (on garden leave or otherwise), but a stroppy employer could have a pop at a claim for damages, arguing that the value of the employee's services for the notice period had been lost. Unlikely to happen, but could happen.
I can't believe a company can make you redundant and then expect you to work your notice period. Given how hard it is for many to find work these days you're going to need that time to make finding a new job into a full time occupation. If you do have a new job lined up tell them what your notice period is and enjoy an extended break if you can escape working your notice.
There is nothing unbelievable or unfair about the situation. The employer can decide to close its business or reduce some part of it on day X. It can decide that it needs employees to work until that day. It's running a business. Even a business that is shutting down remains in business until it shuts down. Presumably in your world it is unfair for an employer to hire someone for a fixed term, saying "this job is for one year and no longer". Must everything revolve around the convenience and/or feelings of the employees?
MitchT said:
I can't believe a company can make you redundant and then expect you to work your notice period. Given how hard it is for many to find work these days you're going to need that time to make finding a new job into a full time occupation. If you do have a new job lined up tell them what your notice period is and enjoy an extended break if you can escape working your notice.
The notice period works both ways. Both parties understand it and are bound by it. If you don't want to work the notice period, that's your prerogative, but don't expect to be paid for it or as already explained expect to benefit from it either.Leptons said:
I think what it boils down to is he needs someone ASAP. If she starts Monday its hers. If not he has to wait 4 weeks he will carry on looking for someone who will start sooner.
Don't forget there's another 10 people in the same boat locally in the same sector.
Interesting way to do it. Most people of sound mind would probably get the right person in and take a bit of a delay in having them join for the longer term benefit they'll bring, vs getting anyone and then having to part ways 3 months later when it unravels. Don't forget there's another 10 people in the same boat locally in the same sector.
I think if I was in your wife's shoes and really wanted this urgent Monday start job I'd be negotiating with them about getting the best person in and if that's her then a reasonable notice period is only fair.
After all, would the new job like it if she walked out to the next job leaving him high and dry. Many employers forget it's a 2 way street.
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