Take the money and run?
Discussion
On Monday I was given the option of either being performance managed (ie out of the buisness) or taking a pay-off to leave. The actual amount was not mentioned, but I saw from the top bosses crib sheet.
I was asked to give my answer by tomorrow, given I've not had the amount actuall told to me, nor had it in writting yet - whats the best option?
At this stage its about maximising the payoff and leaving on my terms.
I was asked to give my answer by tomorrow, given I've not had the amount actuall told to me, nor had it in writting yet - whats the best option?
At this stage its about maximising the payoff and leaving on my terms.
Edited by DMN on Thursday 3rd December 09:07
Compromise Agreement seems the way forward. Gives you a little longer to think about it, with the second result as the end game. You should be able to take independent legal advice on the wording of the CA, paid for by you employer, and agree a mutually amicable separation with money, tax liability, and an agreed reference.
CA is the way forward as above.
You'll need an agreed reference too.
The figure of the CA should be equal to the salary they would have to pay by managing you out.
Looks a good way forward, my guess is that they may have some issues with their procedures and a pay off helps cover up their inadequate procedures.
You'll need an agreed reference too.
The figure of the CA should be equal to the salary they would have to pay by managing you out.
Looks a good way forward, my guess is that they may have some issues with their procedures and a pay off helps cover up their inadequate procedures.
anothernameitist said:
CA is the way forward as above.
You'll need an agreed reference too.
The figure of the CA should be equal to the salary they would have to pay by managing you out.
Looks a good way forward, my guess is that they may have some issues with their procedures and a pay off helps cover up their inadequate procedures.
A settlement agreement isn't always used to cover over procedural gaps. Indeed, in this instance pre-process the risk is probably small, afterall there is nothing to cover over if there is no process yet started. Businesses will also look at the collateral cost/opportunity cost. If the cost of managing the process and/or the lost sales etc is greater than the payment then the business can simply make a commercial decision.You'll need an agreed reference too.
The figure of the CA should be equal to the salary they would have to pay by managing you out.
Looks a good way forward, my guess is that they may have some issues with their procedures and a pay off helps cover up their inadequate procedures.
edc said:
A settlement agreement isn't always used to cover over procedural gaps. Indeed, in this instance pre-process the risk is probably small, afterall there is nothing to cover over if there is no process yet started. Businesses will also look at the collateral cost/opportunity cost. If the cost of managing the process and/or the lost sales etc is greater than the payment then the business can simply make a commercial decision.
Valid Point. I would avoid the compromise agreement until it's brought up, while tire's benefits they're mainly 'here's more money, now f
k off' to the employee, if they're going to pay you the same with or without the agreement, don't bother with one as an employee. You can negotiate everything you need (3-6 months, waive non compete, solid reference) without the CA in a lot of cases.
If there's a choice between CA + more money vs no CA and a month's pay+holidays, take the CA, but you need the company to pay the legal fees (few hundred quid) and it has to pretty much be read back to you by someone legal to make it binding. No legal read back = no valid agreement.
k off' to the employee, if they're going to pay you the same with or without the agreement, don't bother with one as an employee. You can negotiate everything you need (3-6 months, waive non compete, solid reference) without the CA in a lot of cases. If there's a choice between CA + more money vs no CA and a month's pay+holidays, take the CA, but you need the company to pay the legal fees (few hundred quid) and it has to pretty much be read back to you by someone legal to make it binding. No legal read back = no valid agreement.
OP, much advice here is well meant but based on little or no knowledge of the law. People sometimes give half baked advice based on their own (mis)understanding of something that happened to them or something they heard about in the pub. Take for example Andy's made up hoo hah about a "legal read back". There is no such requirement, but that is a fine Chinese whispers back of a cornflake packet bit of internet made uppery.
The reality is that no sensible employer will pay you off without insisting that you enter into a statutory Compromise Agreement, as without such an agreement your statutory claims relating to your employment cannot be excluded. It is not a requirement that the employer pays for you to have legal advice, but many employers offer to pay a sum towards legal costs. It IS a requirement that you receive advice from someone insured to give that advice on the effect of the agreement. This does not require that someone sits and reads the agreement out loud to you.
Anyway, negotiate firmly but realistically. Better to move soon with a decent package than go through he stress of being squeezed out over time. An experienced lawyer can help you negotiate a better package. I can recommend some for you if you like.
The reality is that no sensible employer will pay you off without insisting that you enter into a statutory Compromise Agreement, as without such an agreement your statutory claims relating to your employment cannot be excluded. It is not a requirement that the employer pays for you to have legal advice, but many employers offer to pay a sum towards legal costs. It IS a requirement that you receive advice from someone insured to give that advice on the effect of the agreement. This does not require that someone sits and reads the agreement out loud to you.
Anyway, negotiate firmly but realistically. Better to move soon with a decent package than go through he stress of being squeezed out over time. An experienced lawyer can help you negotiate a better package. I can recommend some for you if you like.
Breadvan72 said:
OP, much advice here is well meant but based on little or no knowledge of the law. People sometimes give half baked advice based on their own (mis)understanding of something that happened to them or something they heard about in the pub. Take for example Andy's made up hoo hah about a "legal read back". There is no such requirement, but that is a fine Chinese whispers back of a cornflake packet bit of internet made uppery.
The reality is that no sensible employer will pay you off without insisting that you enter into a statutory Compromise Agreement, as without such an agreement your statutory claims relating to your employment cannot be excluded. It is not a requirement that the employer pays for you to have legal advice, but many employers offer to pay a sum towards legal costs. It IS a requirement that you receive advice from someone insured to give that advice on the effect of the agreement. This does not require that someone sits and reads the agreement out loud to you.
Anyway, negotiate firmly but realistically. Better to move soon with a decent package than go through he stress of being squeezed out over time. An experienced lawyer can help you negotiate a better package. I can recommend some for you if you like.
I didn't quite mean it like that, more that it could be done remotely or over the phone if needs be, as it has been in my cases. The reality is that no sensible employer will pay you off without insisting that you enter into a statutory Compromise Agreement, as without such an agreement your statutory claims relating to your employment cannot be excluded. It is not a requirement that the employer pays for you to have legal advice, but many employers offer to pay a sum towards legal costs. It IS a requirement that you receive advice from someone insured to give that advice on the effect of the agreement. This does not require that someone sits and reads the agreement out loud to you.
Anyway, negotiate firmly but realistically. Better to move soon with a decent package than go through he stress of being squeezed out over time. An experienced lawyer can help you negotiate a better package. I can recommend some for you if you like.
The point I'm making is, it's not always a good idea as an employee to bring a compromise agreement to the discussion, it'd be better to wait for the employer to bring that one up, see what options are offered and then make a decision on it
So
andy-xr said:
...it has to pretty much be read back to you by someone legal to make it binding. No legal read back = no valid agreement.
actually means andy-xr said:
I didn't quite mean it like that, more that it could be done remotely or over the phone if needs be, as it has been in my cases.
Er, so why say something daft and plain wrong like "no read back = no legal agreement"? Someone might mistake you for someone giving advice from a basis of knowledge, rather than just recounting personal anecdotes. Why not just say what you mean? A general observation: One of the problems here and in S,P&,L is that people say, quite emphatically: "the position on X is Y", when what they are in fact saying is that "in my case, I seem dimly to recall that X was Y, but it was a while ago and I wasn't really paying attention anyway. Oh, by the way, the facts were A, whereas in the OP's case they are Z". There is nothing wrong with that sort of personal anecdote, but dressing it up as an answer to someone's request for legal advice is, I suggest, unhelpful.
97 times out of 100, these threads arise because the OP has shagged the boss's daughter.
Or....
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0210/4540/product...
Or....
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0210/4540/product...
Breadvan72 said:
97 times out of 100, these threads arise because the OP has shagged the boss's daughter.
Or....
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0210/4540/product...
Thanks BV - first sober belly laugh for many weeks.Or....
http://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/0210/4540/product...
Breadvan72 said:
Er, so why say something daft and plain wrong like "no read back = no legal agreement"? Someone might mistake you for someone giving advice from a basis of knowledge, rather than just recounting personal anecdotes. Why not just say what you mean?
It's not for me to try and make things easy for you to understand. The OP wanted to look at how he'd get a good return, I said don't run into a compromise agreement unless it's got something worthwhile and it needs to be explained to you by someone who's able to give insured advice. It's dead simple really I don't know why you've overcomplicated it
Nope, you spouted BS, you were called out on that, and now you're just flim flamming. Top tip: stop giving advice about things you don't understand.
PS:
PS:
andy-xr said:
...I said don't run into a compromise agreement unless it's got something worthwhile and it needs to be explained to you by someone who's able to give insured advice.
Nope, you didn't say that. Your attempt to backpedal is, however, mildly hilarious.Edited by anonymous-user on Friday 4th December 12:42
I had this with my last role. It was apparent that unless I moved in a way that I didn't want to I was going to be managed out.
I mentioned to my new boss that they could give me a chunk of cash and I'd fk off and drink beer in the sun for a bit. They went for it, they paid for me to get some legal advice and we parted company quite amicably.
Saved me being a pain in the arse for them and them paying someone to sit and watch films all day.
I mentioned to my new boss that they could give me a chunk of cash and I'd f
k off and drink beer in the sun for a bit. They went for it, they paid for me to get some legal advice and we parted company quite amicably.Saved me being a pain in the arse for them and them paying someone to sit and watch films all day.
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