Hired into a job i could "grow into"...
Discussion
So i left a company from a stable job doing a technical job, SAP to be specific. I worked with a contractor in who apparently saw talent in me and said to stay in contact, should anything arise he'd give me a shout and offer me a job.
A year later the call came, him and his other director called me and said i'd be doing a X consulant role. I explained my lack of skill in area a and b they said thats absolutely fine and that id get all the support i need. Great i thought, things were going down the pan at my current role, i.e. being outsourced so figured 6 years is a good time to move on.
I took the job, did well with some initial work and was asked to take on a couple of projects for one of their long term partners, got it done with NO tech or functional spec. Job done. The next project was to integrate with some online sites usng api's which i understand in principle but dont have any experience in doing. I said in my interview my integration work is mostly file, sftp, some web based stuff but not loads. Now ive taken my time wiht this project and ive said at numerous points along the project that im struggling and i could do with some help. So my direct director asked another director to help me, his help wasnt that good and i pointed this out to my director, he agreed he was like that. So i struggled on but got a bit further.. 3 weeks in the customer is getting antsy, and i had a call with my director tonight about whats gong ,bn with it. i states that im 1/3 the way through the build for one site and nowhere with the other site, he moaned than i hadnt done x or y and proceeded to assist via a remote session. I then called him to thank him and ask where things would go, the conversation got a bit heated and he was like 'dont worry your jobs not on line the line but i dont like how you were not honest with how you said you could do a and b which has caused this...'... I was shocked, i said ' do you not remember our initial meeting with the other director about how ive only evey done 'g,h,j' in this role and have never done 'a'or b ' and made that clear in my interview...
It would be a good job in a few years with some mentoring which they promised but as its such a small firm i dont see me getting that mentorship, i think its going to have to come down to self study.. Its daft really as i took ce4k pay cut, am working harder and more hours, get less holiday and was told 'thats how consulting is'.... Yeah if youre charging 600 a day not being paid 250.. hmm...
Any advice from others who have been in that position please, im struggling a bit.
A year later the call came, him and his other director called me and said i'd be doing a X consulant role. I explained my lack of skill in area a and b they said thats absolutely fine and that id get all the support i need. Great i thought, things were going down the pan at my current role, i.e. being outsourced so figured 6 years is a good time to move on.
I took the job, did well with some initial work and was asked to take on a couple of projects for one of their long term partners, got it done with NO tech or functional spec. Job done. The next project was to integrate with some online sites usng api's which i understand in principle but dont have any experience in doing. I said in my interview my integration work is mostly file, sftp, some web based stuff but not loads. Now ive taken my time wiht this project and ive said at numerous points along the project that im struggling and i could do with some help. So my direct director asked another director to help me, his help wasnt that good and i pointed this out to my director, he agreed he was like that. So i struggled on but got a bit further.. 3 weeks in the customer is getting antsy, and i had a call with my director tonight about whats gong ,bn with it. i states that im 1/3 the way through the build for one site and nowhere with the other site, he moaned than i hadnt done x or y and proceeded to assist via a remote session. I then called him to thank him and ask where things would go, the conversation got a bit heated and he was like 'dont worry your jobs not on line the line but i dont like how you were not honest with how you said you could do a and b which has caused this...'... I was shocked, i said ' do you not remember our initial meeting with the other director about how ive only evey done 'g,h,j' in this role and have never done 'a'or b ' and made that clear in my interview...
It would be a good job in a few years with some mentoring which they promised but as its such a small firm i dont see me getting that mentorship, i think its going to have to come down to self study.. Its daft really as i took ce4k pay cut, am working harder and more hours, get less holiday and was told 'thats how consulting is'.... Yeah if youre charging 600 a day not being paid 250.. hmm...
Any advice from others who have been in that position please, im struggling a bit.
Who was involved in requirement gathering ?
There should have been a documentation clearly outlying what needs to be done with some project plan. You supposed to review it before starting a project and tell your boss that you can only do a , b and c but don't have skills to do x, y and z.
Which part of the project are you struggling with? Is it just API? Do you use .Net Framework?
There should have been a documentation clearly outlying what needs to be done with some project plan. You supposed to review it before starting a project and tell your boss that you can only do a , b and c but don't have skills to do x, y and z.
Which part of the project are you struggling with? Is it just API? Do you use .Net Framework?
That's the thing. We never seem to work with fs/req doc. I'm supposed to come up with solution as a consultant. As I'm Junior and having brruy little Experience with this tech.i knew what the high level design would look like but having no experience with 3rd party api or any api for that matter I was soon spinning! I've got a bit further this week. But to be told it should take a week rather than 4 and the b
king I got was just a bit much.
king I got was just a bit much. PorkRind said:
Its daft really as i took ce4k pay cut, am working harder and more hours, get less holiday...
Some might say ‘what were you thinking man!’I can’t remember the last time I may have agreed with a client that a pay cut was a good thing, never mind any other reduction in package.
This isn’t going to help you, but it may help others. Experience tells me that, unless in exceptional circumstances, you shouldn’t move unless there’s a 20% improvement in overall package. It’s a guide, but the principle is sound.
This goes some way to protecting you from the risk and costs usually associated with any move.
rog007 said:
PorkRind said:
Its daft really as i took ce4k pay cut, am working harder and more hours, get less holiday...
Some might say ‘what were you thinking man!’I can’t remember the last time I may have agreed with a client that a pay cut was a good thing, never mind any other reduction in package.
This isn’t going to help you, but it may help others. Experience tells me that, unless in exceptional circumstances, you shouldn’t move unless there’s a 20% improvement in overall package. It’s a guide, but the principle is sound.
This goes some way to protecting you from the risk and costs usually associated with any move.
PorkRind said:
rog007 said:
PorkRind said:
Its daft really as i took ce4k pay cut, am working harder and more hours, get less holiday...
Some might say ‘what were you thinking man!’I can’t remember the last time I may have agreed with a client that a pay cut was a good thing, never mind any other reduction in package.
This isn’t going to help you, but it may help others. Experience tells me that, unless in exceptional circumstances, you shouldn’t move unless there’s a 20% improvement in overall package. It’s a guide, but the principle is sound.
This goes some way to protecting you from the risk and costs usually associated with any move.
OP Speaking from experience of working for a small consultancy, I was expected to do everything with little to no support. I was charged out at £800 a day and the better I did at delivering projects, the more work was heaped on me. Never saw a bonus and only every saw a payrise when I threatened to leave. I stuck that out for 10 years, probably 4-5 years too long, but couldn't be happier now.
One thing I've found interesting at my current place (magic circle law firm) - you increase your responsibility and are then promoted into the job you are doing, rather than being told one day "you're now a manager - go manage". It seems obvious to be now, but I've never worked anywhere that does this before. It means you're not thrown into the deep end with high expectations.
Good luck OP, but I wouldn't expect the situation to get any better in terms of support speaking from my own experience.
wiggy001 said:
Interesting you say that. I know exceptions prove the rule etc but in January I left a consulting job for a perm role: £10k cut in salary and probably a £2k cut in overall package. Best move I've ever made! I'm valued, I can genuinely do a 35 hour week if I wanted (I don't though), I've been promoted once already, will be promoted to a team lead role in January and Manager in May.
OP Speaking from experience of working for a small consultancy, I was expected to do everything with little to no support. I was charged out at £800 a day and the better I did at delivering projects, the more work was heaped on me. Never saw a bonus and only every saw a payrise when I threatened to leave. I stuck that out for 10 years, probably 4-5 years too long, but couldn't be happier now.
One thing I've found interesting at my current place (magic circle law firm) - you increase your responsibility and are then promoted into the job you are doing, rather than being told one day "you're now a manager - go manage". It seems obvious to be now, but I've never worked anywhere that does this before. It means you're not thrown into the deep end with high expectations.
Good luck OP, but I wouldn't expect the situation to get any better in terms of support speaking from my own experience.
Hey WiggyOP Speaking from experience of working for a small consultancy, I was expected to do everything with little to no support. I was charged out at £800 a day and the better I did at delivering projects, the more work was heaped on me. Never saw a bonus and only every saw a payrise when I threatened to leave. I stuck that out for 10 years, probably 4-5 years too long, but couldn't be happier now.
One thing I've found interesting at my current place (magic circle law firm) - you increase your responsibility and are then promoted into the job you are doing, rather than being told one day "you're now a manager - go manage". It seems obvious to be now, but I've never worked anywhere that does this before. It means you're not thrown into the deep end with high expectations.
Good luck OP, but I wouldn't expect the situation to get any better in terms of support speaking from my own experience.
Yeah i've managed to speak to some other people in consulting and theyve said similar things about it tbh. Will give it a year or so and then move on i think]
PorkRind said:
wiggy001 said:
Interesting you say that. I know exceptions prove the rule etc but in January I left a consulting job for a perm role: £10k cut in salary and probably a £2k cut in overall package. Best move I've ever made! I'm valued, I can genuinely do a 35 hour week if I wanted (I don't though), I've been promoted once already, will be promoted to a team lead role in January and Manager in May.
OP Speaking from experience of working for a small consultancy, I was expected to do everything with little to no support. I was charged out at £800 a day and the better I did at delivering projects, the more work was heaped on me. Never saw a bonus and only every saw a payrise when I threatened to leave. I stuck that out for 10 years, probably 4-5 years too long, but couldn't be happier now.
One thing I've found interesting at my current place (magic circle law firm) - you increase your responsibility and are then promoted into the job you are doing, rather than being told one day "you're now a manager - go manage". It seems obvious to be now, but I've never worked anywhere that does this before. It means you're not thrown into the deep end with high expectations.
Good luck OP, but I wouldn't expect the situation to get any better in terms of support speaking from my own experience.
Hey WiggyOP Speaking from experience of working for a small consultancy, I was expected to do everything with little to no support. I was charged out at £800 a day and the better I did at delivering projects, the more work was heaped on me. Never saw a bonus and only every saw a payrise when I threatened to leave. I stuck that out for 10 years, probably 4-5 years too long, but couldn't be happier now.
One thing I've found interesting at my current place (magic circle law firm) - you increase your responsibility and are then promoted into the job you are doing, rather than being told one day "you're now a manager - go manage". It seems obvious to be now, but I've never worked anywhere that does this before. It means you're not thrown into the deep end with high expectations.
Good luck OP, but I wouldn't expect the situation to get any better in terms of support speaking from my own experience.
Yeah i've managed to speak to some other people in consulting and theyve said similar things about it tbh. Will give it a year or so and then move on i think]
The reasons I stuck it out for as long as I did were:
1. I learnt a massive amount. Being chucked in at the deep end works for some people, not for others. At the time I didn't have kids so could focus on the work.
2. The money. You get used to it and it's hard to even look elsewhere when you know perm roles will offer a lot less, you'll have to pay for travel, lunches etc. It was only when we had our second daughter than I felt I really needed to address the work-life balance and the role I'm in now came up at the right time.
Success and happiness rely on a bit of luck, and the skill to make to most of that situation when it presents itself.
mikyccity said:
Who was involved in requirement gathering ?
There should have been a documentation clearly outlying what needs to be done with some project plan. You supposed to review it before starting a project and tell your boss that you can only do a , b and c but don't have skills to do x, y and z.
Which part of the project are you struggling with? Is it just API? Do you use .Net Framework?
Thats the linear approach, this sounds more like an agile/sprint approach, short req gathering meetings, produce something, see if client likes, do more etc. I only work with linear but we're starting to look at this approach more for small solutions/rapid turnaround.There should have been a documentation clearly outlying what needs to be done with some project plan. You supposed to review it before starting a project and tell your boss that you can only do a , b and c but don't have skills to do x, y and z.
Which part of the project are you struggling with? Is it just API? Do you use .Net Framework?
I have worked in a small busy company. You sink or swim.
The positive is you are exposed to many things and learn a lot.
The negative is you may know nothing about many of those things... and neither may anyone else. So you can either whinge on about no training and no support or you can Google stuff, get on courses, pay on line gurus for an hour of help at a time to solve some specific issue for you and use initiative.
If you are the former type then go now as you will never thrive. If the latter type then use the sources of help open to you but don't expect the others around you to solve everything for you.
The positive is you are exposed to many things and learn a lot.
The negative is you may know nothing about many of those things... and neither may anyone else. So you can either whinge on about no training and no support or you can Google stuff, get on courses, pay on line gurus for an hour of help at a time to solve some specific issue for you and use initiative.
If you are the former type then go now as you will never thrive. If the latter type then use the sources of help open to you but don't expect the others around you to solve everything for you.
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