How to get gardening leave instead of working redundancy?
Discussion
I've been under a sort of unofficial threat of redundancy for about 10 months now while management desperately try and replace me and my colleagues with people in Poland.
We have a sudden meeting at 10am this morning, nobody knows what for but we are all pretty certain that this is The Big Day.
I'm not overly fussed, I have 10 years service so should get a good deal. HOWEVER one thing that does get me is that a lot of people - mostly the management club - manage to get lobbed straight out the door and get their 3 or six months notice pay as well as the redundancy package. Plebs like me will be expected to work it, which I find astonishing given the level of disgruntlement in this department and that we are a data processing team who handle and have access to literally thousands of gigabytes of sensitive data. I'd also ask why when someone is "redundant" that they'll be made to work for months given the definition of the word too.
So my question to the wise masses of PHers is this: how can I, as an automated software test analyst, get myself lobbed off the premises and put on 3 months gardening leave so that I don't have to come in here every day?
Got to be a surefire method. Any ideas?
We have a sudden meeting at 10am this morning, nobody knows what for but we are all pretty certain that this is The Big Day.
I'm not overly fussed, I have 10 years service so should get a good deal. HOWEVER one thing that does get me is that a lot of people - mostly the management club - manage to get lobbed straight out the door and get their 3 or six months notice pay as well as the redundancy package. Plebs like me will be expected to work it, which I find astonishing given the level of disgruntlement in this department and that we are a data processing team who handle and have access to literally thousands of gigabytes of sensitive data. I'd also ask why when someone is "redundant" that they'll be made to work for months given the definition of the word too.
So my question to the wise masses of PHers is this: how can I, as an automated software test analyst, get myself lobbed off the premises and put on 3 months gardening leave so that I don't have to come in here every day?
Got to be a surefire method. Any ideas?
I don't know of a sure fire way, but if you write an effective handover doc and keep it to yourself, when you have the meeting with HR you can ask them exactly what they require of you during your notice period. The answer is usually "a handover", ask if you need to come into work after that (it's hard for them to say yes), then give them the doc a week later. It's worked for me a couple of times.
Is there a restrictive covenant clause in your contract? What does it say?
Also do you know how they plan to execute the redundancy? My old mob usually went down the compromise agreement route and compensated redundees for breach of contract. It would be easier to negotiate under these conditions than a bog standard redundo package.
What I’d do:
Refuse to confirm or deny that you are in substantive negotiation for a role with their strongest competitor.
There are ways of getting rumours going round but best not to have your fingerprints on them...
Most firms start experiencing twitchy anus syndrome if they think that experienced and knowledgable staff are likely to take recent info to the competition.
It goes without saying that you should not download/lift any information that belongs to your current employer or do anything that would give them reasonable cause to dismiss you.
Also do you know how they plan to execute the redundancy? My old mob usually went down the compromise agreement route and compensated redundees for breach of contract. It would be easier to negotiate under these conditions than a bog standard redundo package.
What I’d do:
Refuse to confirm or deny that you are in substantive negotiation for a role with their strongest competitor.
There are ways of getting rumours going round but best not to have your fingerprints on them...
Most firms start experiencing twitchy anus syndrome if they think that experienced and knowledgable staff are likely to take recent info to the competition.
It goes without saying that you should not download/lift any information that belongs to your current employer or do anything that would give them reasonable cause to dismiss you.
devnull said:
To be honest, it depends on how the company wants to go about it. I've worked in sales for a long time, and people usually got immediate gardening leave because a) they were going to a competitor and b) everyone thought they were a t
t anyway.
That happened to a colleague of mine - to be fair to him he was VERY good at his job but he kept pointing out all the things that his colleagues and line manager were doing wrong (or not to the standard he thought they should) and he was in the right. But he would do it at Area Manager meetings which was quite embarrassing for them.t anyway.In the end they did a departmental restructure - he got 6 months redundancy pay and 3 months PILON - jammy git
Payment in lieu of notice (PILON) is more usual than gardening leave, and gets you what you want (payment for your notice period) without having to wait until it’s over before you start work elsewhere.
The only reason employers don’t do this is where handovers are required. If that’s the case, I’d be pushing for you to be kept on as an employee while performing the handover, with redundancy and PILON once that’s completed. Suggest this is a “bonus” to provide motivation for you to do a good job handing over, rather than very little...
ETA: notice you posted yesterday - what happened?!
The only reason employers don’t do this is where handovers are required. If that’s the case, I’d be pushing for you to be kept on as an employee while performing the handover, with redundancy and PILON once that’s completed. Suggest this is a “bonus” to provide motivation for you to do a good job handing over, rather than very little...
ETA: notice you posted yesterday - what happened?!
Find out who your biggest competitor(s) is, tell your manager you have interviews at said competitor(s).
Even better if you can find a competitor that has some bad blood with one of the execs.
I had to work a 3 month notice period and it was soul destroying having to turn up for a job I hated, but you can (within reason) take time off for interviews.
Even better if you can find a competitor that has some bad blood with one of the execs.
I had to work a 3 month notice period and it was soul destroying having to turn up for a job I hated, but you can (within reason) take time off for interviews.
My redundancy in 2009 had the following offers.
1) Volunteer and be accepted and get double the money but work 1/2 notice period.
2) Don't volunteer and get notice period pay but leave within seconds of finding out.
Notice period was 3 months.
My redundancy entitlement after 18 months was zero. Double zero is zero.
I struggled to keep a straight face at the meeting. As the manager read out the options.
So if i volunteer, you'll double zero to what? Does that seem tempting to you.
I was picked. I started contracting 10 days later. I didn't pay myself anything from LTD company for 4 months.
Did not do gardening leave.
1) Volunteer and be accepted and get double the money but work 1/2 notice period.
2) Don't volunteer and get notice period pay but leave within seconds of finding out.
Notice period was 3 months.
My redundancy entitlement after 18 months was zero. Double zero is zero.
I struggled to keep a straight face at the meeting. As the manager read out the options.
So if i volunteer, you'll double zero to what? Does that seem tempting to you.
I was picked. I started contracting 10 days later. I didn't pay myself anything from LTD company for 4 months.
Did not do gardening leave.
sugerbear said:
Find out who your biggest competitor(s) is, tell your manager you have interviews at said competitor(s).
Even better if you can find a competitor that has some bad blood with one of the execs.
I had to work a 3 month notice period and it was soul destroying having to turn up for a job I hated, but you can (within reason) take time off for interviews.
I think the majority of people don’t work in roles which have access to confidential information that a supplier would willingly pay for. Plus if somebody who was leaving made such a suggestion I’d suggest they GTFO rather than pay them gardening leave.Even better if you can find a competitor that has some bad blood with one of the execs.
I had to work a 3 month notice period and it was soul destroying having to turn up for a job I hated, but you can (within reason) take time off for interviews.
Dog Star said:
I've been under a sort of unofficial threat of redundancy for about 10 months now while management desperately try and replace me and my colleagues with people in Poland.
We have a sudden meeting at 10am this morning, nobody knows what for but we are all pretty certain that this is The Big Day.
I'm not overly fussed, I have 10 years service so should get a good deal. HOWEVER one thing that does get me is that a lot of people - mostly the management club - manage to get lobbed straight out the door and get their 3 or six months notice pay as well as the redundancy package. Plebs like me will be expected to work it, which I find astonishing given the level of disgruntlement in this department and that we are a data processing team who handle and have access to literally thousands of gigabytes of sensitive data. I'd also ask why when someone is "redundant" that they'll be made to work for months given the definition of the word too.
So my question to the wise masses of PHers is this: how can I, as an automated software test analyst, get myself lobbed off the premises and put on 3 months gardening leave so that I don't have to come in here every day?
Got to be a surefire method. Any ideas?
Were you asked to sign a NDA at the meeting? We have a sudden meeting at 10am this morning, nobody knows what for but we are all pretty certain that this is The Big Day.
I'm not overly fussed, I have 10 years service so should get a good deal. HOWEVER one thing that does get me is that a lot of people - mostly the management club - manage to get lobbed straight out the door and get their 3 or six months notice pay as well as the redundancy package. Plebs like me will be expected to work it, which I find astonishing given the level of disgruntlement in this department and that we are a data processing team who handle and have access to literally thousands of gigabytes of sensitive data. I'd also ask why when someone is "redundant" that they'll be made to work for months given the definition of the word too.
So my question to the wise masses of PHers is this: how can I, as an automated software test analyst, get myself lobbed off the premises and put on 3 months gardening leave so that I don't have to come in here every day?
Got to be a surefire method. Any ideas?
Would be good to have a follow up.
ruggedscotty said:
with me it was the fact that they asked me to teach others on how to do my job, I refused, unreasonable demand, speak to unions, training someone to do your job to replace you isn't a viable or reasonable request.
If someone is having to replace you then I suppose you could argue that your role is not redundant. SD.
shed driver said:
ruggedscotty said:
with me it was the fact that they asked me to teach others on how to do my job, I refused, unreasonable demand, speak to unions, training someone to do your job to replace you isn't a viable or reasonable request.
If someone is having to replace you then I suppose you could argue that your role is not redundant. SD.
Hello, OP here
We had our meeting and, although we have entered a formal 30 days of “consultation “ and our “jobs are at risk” we have basically been made redundant, 100%.
Bit of background - I work in IT for a big gaming firm, and the team I work for manages data, a LOT of data, for promotions, stats, trend analysis - you name it.
A couple of years ago we acquired a gaming development firm in Poland - I spotted what this meant way back then.
There were about 50 people all told from the top down, right on from product owner, BAs, PMs, devs, QA etc. Last year a rumour was conveniently circulated about redundancies and our jobs going to Poland - this caused a mass exodus which upper management did nothing to stop. They just said that any developers who left would be replaced on Poland. I stayed put - I’m over 50 which is quite good from a redundancy point of view and been here six years and to be honest they pay me very well as well.
About March this year we even got a conciliatory email from the head hatchet man, clearly as a result of the failure to recruit staff in Poland, saying how he looked forwards to our being able to work together etc in future. When we mentioned this cheesy email to him in our meeting he just shrugged.
So on Thursday it was all about saving money and all our jobs (there are 27 of us left) are now vacant in Poland. Incidentally they have in the last 9 months managed to replace 3 of the people who have left with people in Poland - and curiously wages in Poland are about the same as they are in the north of the UK.
So I have the 30 days plus 3 months notice at the end of it.
I’m not worried about securing a new role, I just want to maximise my take and do as little as possible for a company that’s treated people very shabbily.
One of the good things is that, since they’ve canned every single person the managers don’t give a flying fk. We all buggered off down the pub and didn’t come back, I WFHd Friday and it’s just a WFH-fest now. I can handle this for the summer!!! 
I suspect we will just get marched off premises in a months time. I’ve also got an interview with our arch-competitor lined up.
I think I might just go contracting again to be honest - I was a contractor for 21 years and this was my first ever permie role. I’ve had longer contracts!
We had our meeting and, although we have entered a formal 30 days of “consultation “ and our “jobs are at risk” we have basically been made redundant, 100%.
Bit of background - I work in IT for a big gaming firm, and the team I work for manages data, a LOT of data, for promotions, stats, trend analysis - you name it.
A couple of years ago we acquired a gaming development firm in Poland - I spotted what this meant way back then.
There were about 50 people all told from the top down, right on from product owner, BAs, PMs, devs, QA etc. Last year a rumour was conveniently circulated about redundancies and our jobs going to Poland - this caused a mass exodus which upper management did nothing to stop. They just said that any developers who left would be replaced on Poland. I stayed put - I’m over 50 which is quite good from a redundancy point of view and been here six years and to be honest they pay me very well as well.
About March this year we even got a conciliatory email from the head hatchet man, clearly as a result of the failure to recruit staff in Poland, saying how he looked forwards to our being able to work together etc in future. When we mentioned this cheesy email to him in our meeting he just shrugged.
So on Thursday it was all about saving money and all our jobs (there are 27 of us left) are now vacant in Poland. Incidentally they have in the last 9 months managed to replace 3 of the people who have left with people in Poland - and curiously wages in Poland are about the same as they are in the north of the UK.
So I have the 30 days plus 3 months notice at the end of it.
I’m not worried about securing a new role, I just want to maximise my take and do as little as possible for a company that’s treated people very shabbily.
One of the good things is that, since they’ve canned every single person the managers don’t give a flying f
k. We all buggered off down the pub and didn’t come back, I WFHd Friday and it’s just a WFH-fest now. I can handle this for the summer!!! I suspect we will just get marched off premises in a months time. I’ve also got an interview with our arch-competitor lined up.
I think I might just go contracting again to be honest - I was a contractor for 21 years and this was my first ever permie role. I’ve had longer contracts!
Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff