Work Politics and opposing motivations / development

[BobSaunders]

Hi, as part of my annual development cycle my boss has advised me i need to take some time out in my development to refocus my understanding of politics and their personal motivations of other people sitting the other side of the table on certain discussions. i.e. try and determine what they get out of a decision.

I suspect at some point in the last year i've not seen something coming and got screwed over without realising it and he's had to save my arse, and not been able to tell me.

Any decent books? education material? courses?

Am trawling Amazon (Kindle) store

[smashing]

BobSaunders said:

Hi, as part of my annual development cycle my boss has advised me i need to take some time out in my development to refocus my understanding of politics and their personal motivations of other people sitting the other side of the table on certain discussions. i.e. try and determine what they get out of a decision.

I suspect at some point in the last year i've not seen something coming and got screwed over without realising it and he's had to save my arse, and not been able to tell me.

Any decent books? education material? courses?

Am trawling Amazon (Kindle) store

Can they offer any mentoring to assist you in this? may be more helpful than trying to find a specific book on the issue.

[BobSaunders]

Yes, but i'm generally a self starter.

Also, COVID throws a curveball on training courses, 1 2 1 mentoring etc.

[mr_spock]

Google Chris Voss, great videos, books and I think they do an online course as well. It's really in negotiating but that's very much about understanding the other party's motivation.

[lyonspride]

Sounds to me like you're not complying with "groupthink"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink

Basically you might be upsetting the apple cart by not simply nodding and agreeing with the rest of the group.
You probably have a strong character, with your own opinions and are not someone who will be bullied into thinking a certain way.

Maybe you have expressed some wider political opinions (Brexit, immigration, Corbyn, Boris, etc etc) and upset people??

Edited by lyonspride on Tuesday 14th April 11:10

[BobSaunders]

lyonspride said:

Sounds to me like you're not complying with "groupthink"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink

Basically you might be upsetting the apple cart by not simply nodding and agreeing with the rest of the group.
You probably have a strong character, with your own opinions and are not someone who will be bullied into thinking a certain way.

Maybe you have expressed some wider political opinions (Brexit, immigration, Corbyn, Boris, etc etc) and upset people??

Edited by lyonspride on Tuesday 14th April 11:10

Work politics. Not politics politics. I don’t discuss world politics at work, or personal views.

[lyonspride]

BobSaunders said:

lyonspride said:

Sounds to me like you're not complying with "groupthink"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Groupthink

Basically you might be upsetting the apple cart by not simply nodding and agreeing with the rest of the group.
You probably have a strong character, with your own opinions and are not someone who will be bullied into thinking a certain way.

Maybe you have expressed some wider political opinions (Brexit, immigration, Corbyn, Boris, etc etc) and upset people??

Edited by lyonspride on Tuesday 14th April 11:10

Work politics. Not politics politics. I don’t discuss world politics at work, or personal views.

Yeah, I figured as much to be fair, but thought it worth mentioning as these days you can upset people just by telling them you voted the "wrong" way.

[omniflow]

I'm not sure this is something that can be taught in the traditional sense.

Do you have any inkling into what you might have missed? Was it a case of "this solution is the best for me and my team, so I don't care about the impact on anyone else", or was it more a case of "What I'm proposing has the best outcome for the company" whilst ignoring the fact that it would mean 3 people round the table lost their jobs.

Depending on what you are actually doing "wrong", then one book that might be worth a read is "5 dysfunctions of a team".

The other thing I could suggest is to try a bit of empathy - try to think about how someone else might react to or interpret what you're saying. I did once work with someone who didn't understand this concept at all - he really wasn't a pleasant person to work with.

[TCX]

Ask them what specifically they're on about,because your unhappy with such a 'wishy washy'approach,n if they're unable to vocalise their concerns better you'll be firing your boss

[devnull]

You need to ask your boss outright for specific examples of this. I fking hate it when people give you an abstract idea that you have done something wrong and are even more abstract in providing a solution. If they can't, therein lies the issue - poor management.

[lyonspride]

devnull said:

You need to ask your boss outright for specific examples of this. I fking hate it when people give you an abstract idea that you have done something wrong and are even more abstract in providing a solution. If they can't, therein lies the issue - poor management.

This is why I think the issue is failure to align with "groupthink".

"A psychological phenomenon that occurs within a group of people in which the desire for harmony or conformity in the group results in an irrational or dysfunctional decision-making outcome"

Boss knows you've done nothing wrong, and is only acting because other people have complained.

Remember that in a "groupthink" situation, if the group has decided on a bad course of action, any suggestion to the contrary, no matter how logical, will be seen as criticism.

I've worked for a defence sector company where the word "opinion" was directly interchangeable for "attitude problem".

Edited by lyonspride on Wednesday 15th April 10:57

[BobSaunders]

lyonspride said:

devnull said:

You need to ask your boss outright for specific examples of this. I fking hate it when people give you an abstract idea that you have done something wrong and are even more abstract in providing a solution. If they can't, therein lies the issue - poor management.

This is why I think the issue is failure to align with "groupthink".

"A psychological phenomenon that occurs within a group of people in which the desire for harmony or conformity in the group results in an irrational or dysfunctional decision-making outcome"

Boss knows you've done nothing wrong, and is only acting because other people have complained.

Remember that in a "groupthink" situation, if the group has decided on a bad course of action, any suggestion to the contrary, no matter how logical, will be seen as criticism.

I've worked for a defence sector company where the word "opinion" was directly interchangeable for "attitude problem".

Edited by lyonspride on Wednesday 15th April 10:57

Financial services organisation. Work politics are rife - it's all about one upmanship and expanding teams and budget, whilst also offloading risk and pain., and avoiding maelstrom. All about playing the person the other side of the table. Long story short, i did not think long term on a short to medium term decision (which i thought was long term decision making at the time) which rather than offloaded risk and pain and avoided maelstrom, in fact simply brought it back to my door in a couple of years time via another strategic project. One could argue experience, foresight, etc. but if i had taken the time to analyse why this person was supportive for the decision to be made i would have realised, and cut the cloth somewhere else.

In short, total and utter political rubbish which does not drive the organisation forwards, but simply builds kingdoms... but it makes the world go round.

[lyonspride]

BobSaunders said:

lyonspride said:

devnull said:

You need to ask your boss outright for specific examples of this. I fking hate it when people give you an abstract idea that you have done something wrong and are even more abstract in providing a solution. If they can't, therein lies the issue - poor management.

This is why I think the issue is failure to align with "groupthink".

"A psychological phenomenon that occurs within a group of people in which the desire for harmony or conformity in the group results in an irrational or dysfunctional decision-making outcome"

Boss knows you've done nothing wrong, and is only acting because other people have complained.

Remember that in a "groupthink" situation, if the group has decided on a bad course of action, any suggestion to the contrary, no matter how logical, will be seen as criticism.

I've worked for a defence sector company where the word "opinion" was directly interchangeable for "attitude problem".

Edited by lyonspride on Wednesday 15th April 10:57

Financial services organisation. Work politics are rife - it's all about one upmanship and expanding teams and budget, whilst also offloading risk and pain., and avoiding maelstrom. All about playing the person the other side of the table. Long story short, i did not think long term on a short to medium term decision (which i thought was long term decision making at the time) which rather than offloaded risk and pain and avoided maelstrom, in fact simply brought it back to my door in a couple of years time via another strategic project. One could argue experience, foresight, etc. but if i had taken the time to analyse why this person was supportive for the decision to be made i would have realised, and cut the cloth somewhere else.

In short, total and utter political rubbish which does not drive the organisation forwards, but simply builds kingdoms... but it makes the world go round.

Empire building, f**k that st.

[BMWBen]

lyonspride said:

BobSaunders said:

lyonspride said:

devnull said:

You need to ask your boss outright for specific examples of this. I fking hate it when people give you an abstract idea that you have done something wrong and are even more abstract in providing a solution. If they can't, therein lies the issue - poor management.

This is why I think the issue is failure to align with "groupthink".

"A psychological phenomenon that occurs within a group of people in which the desire for harmony or conformity in the group results in an irrational or dysfunctional decision-making outcome"

Boss knows you've done nothing wrong, and is only acting because other people have complained.

Remember that in a "groupthink" situation, if the group has decided on a bad course of action, any suggestion to the contrary, no matter how logical, will be seen as criticism.

I've worked for a defence sector company where the word "opinion" was directly interchangeable for "attitude problem".

Edited by lyonspride on Wednesday 15th April 10:57

Financial services organisation. Work politics are rife - it's all about one upmanship and expanding teams and budget, whilst also offloading risk and pain., and avoiding maelstrom. All about playing the person the other side of the table. Long story short, i did not think long term on a short to medium term decision (which i thought was long term decision making at the time) which rather than offloaded risk and pain and avoided maelstrom, in fact simply brought it back to my door in a couple of years time via another strategic project. One could argue experience, foresight, etc. but if i had taken the time to analyse why this person was supportive for the decision to be made i would have realised, and cut the cloth somewhere else.

In short, total and utter political rubbish which does not drive the organisation forwards, but simply builds kingdoms... but it makes the world go round.

Empire building, f**k that st.

I've done my time in Financial Services (VP level in tech) and encountered the same kind of thing. The people who played those kind of games were short term successful, long term fired.

Decide what your values are, live by them, make decisions by them, stick with it and be the positive change you want to see...

If you're drowning in a swamp of these people move elsewhere. You'll probably make more money that way anyway.