Can a client do this, is this discrimination?

[Thebaggers]

I'm looking to put in a small team to work on an IT systems delivery for a government client. The budget is small, as is the scope, so it will be 2 or max 3 people for 6 months. Remote working has been requested by the client. Trawling through the conditions of the bid I read the below. Whilst we can probably put in a diverse mixed team, they may not be the A-Team for the job needing doing. Got me questioning whether this requirement is fair and legal; i.e. can we challenge it if the best fit team for the job is rejected based upon sex / race?

Keen to get some guidance if there are any specialists out there before I worry about taking paid advice on this.

Direct cut and paste:


14. Re. the Stage 2 proposal criteria, please could you confirm what is meant by “a representative team for the diversity of our council and borough”, and are you able to provide any more details on how you intend to score this answer?
a. We live in a diverse borough, and we are actively working to avoid all white- and male-dominated teams. We expect the team working with us to be balanced in terms of sex and not 100% white in make up. We will score based on at least one case study of teams you’ve previously placed in similar clients. We understand you won’t know the exact team make up in advance, but we reserve the right to request different team members if you are successful and propose an all-white or all-male team.

[miniman]

What a wonderful culture where selecting the best person for the job is secondary to ticking some boxes.

[randlemarcus]

Be diverse then. They'll soon ask for Ramesh to be replaced with an onshore . Obviously price up the ATeam though.

[bmwmike]

Its a council. They most definitely do value almost everything else above actual capability.

Source: used to supply pro services into councils. They are a joke.

[JeffreyD]

Just put in the team you want and decline the contract if they don't like it.

[InitialDave]

If you can put in a team that will do the job and meet their demands, do so.

If this means there are more skilled staff not in that rotation, then they will benefit other clients instead.

[bad company]

I used to recruit lawyers for law firms, companies and local authorities. Some of the left wing councils blatantly practiced what they might call positive discrimination. We reckoned if we had a black, gay & disabled candidate they’d almost certainly get the job even if less qualified/experienced.

[Freshprince]

miniman said:

What a wonderful culture where selecting the best person for the job is secondary to ticking some boxes.

Unfortunately it doesn’t work like that. People have sub-conscious biases so pick people who are more similar to themselves if candidates are pretty evenly matched.

[Thebaggers]

InitialDave said:

If you can put in a team that will do the job and meet their demands, do so.

If this means there are more skilled staff not in that rotation, then they will benefit other clients instead.

That's the quandary, put in a less experienced team we may not get look in, if we do win it will require more oversight from the undesirable white male population.

I am still unclear whether they can specify this.

[Thebaggers]

bad company said:

I used to recruit lawyers for law firms, companies and local authorities. Some of the left wing councils blatantly practiced what they might call positive discrimination. We reckoned if we had a black, gay & disabled candidate they’d almost certainly get the job even if less qualified/experienced.

If there are any black, gay and disabled full stack developers out there please do get in touch, your country needs you.

[InitialDave]

Alternatively, just submit the bid with the team you think is best, with no information on the team members, and deal with any silliness from the client later?

[bad company]

Thebaggers said:

bad company said:

I used to recruit lawyers for law firms, companies and local authorities. Some of the left wing councils blatantly practiced what they might call positive discrimination. We reckoned if we had a black, gay & disabled candidate they’d almost certainly get the job even if less qualified/experienced.

If there are any black, gay and disabled full stack developers out there please do get in touch, your country needs you.

It’d complete the set if they were also HIV positive. That was also a good one.

[Countdown]

That will be ONE of many questions so, if you score the most in the other categories you should be fine. It’s also not clear what the weighting for that particular question is (I doubt it would be particularly high). The highest weightings are normally for Price and Quality so I wouldn’t worry too much if your team is all white/all male.

[ChocolateFrog]

Having white male children, as I do it does make me feel a bit sick.

Is being educated by HMG a disability? Might qualify for that one.

[randlemarcus]

ChocolateFrog said:

Having white male children, as I do it does make me feel a bit sick.

Is being educated by HMG a disability? Might qualify for that one.

Don't be silly. White males will continue to have a nice life for a while yet. They may have to work a bit harder than we have had to, rather than being selected just because.

[mw88]

A. The team will be made up of the best people/most qualified for the job, regardless of race, gender, gender identity or sexual orientation.

[ChocolateFrog]

randlemarcus said:

ChocolateFrog said:

Having white male children, as I do it does make me feel a bit sick.

Is being educated by HMG a disability? Might qualify for that one.

Don't be silly. White males will continue to have a nice life for a while yet. They may have to work a bit harder than we have had to, rather than being selected just because.

Well they'll clearly have to work harder than women and black people for the same jobs.

[Douglas Quaid]

mw88 said:

A. The team will be made up of the best people/most qualified for the job, regardless of race, gender, gender identity or sexual orientation.

Yes answer with this. Maybe as a prefix put: Unfortunately I don’t believe in discrimination so won’t be discriminating based on colour or gender I’ll just have to give you the best people I have instead.

[vaud]

Douglas Quaid said:

Yes answer with this. Maybe as a prefix put: Unfortunately I don’t believe in discrimination so won’t be discriminating based on colour or gender I’ll just have to give you the best people I have instead.

Noooo.... never commit to the "best people" as that becomes a contractual commitment to always provide your best people.

It's like the trap of agreeing to "best endeavours" which doesn't mean what many people think it does.

[Jasandjules]

In effect yes they can do so. Positive discrimination is acceptable in law....