Taking on a cleaner... will I become an employer legally?

[Scarletpimpofnel]

Hi all.

I am thinking of advertising for a cleaner for two hours a day 5 days a week with flexible hours to suit someone that has kids at school.

I just want to pay say minimum wage +20% and forget about it. HOWEVER I am worried that if I am that person's only work then I may be seen as their employer by HMRC and then become liable for workplace pension, NI, holiday pay, lots of paperwork etc etc.

My question is can I simply advertise on Facebook for this service and pay cash/BACS and that's as far as my responsibility go or will I become their employer with all that goes with that?

Many thanks.

[Fifty]

No advice but 2 hours a day for 5 days a week?!?

[ruggedscotty]

make sure he / she is self employed, has other clients etc.... ask them for their utr number

Edited by ruggedscotty on Thursday 7th September 14:14

[simon_harris]

we have a cleaners twice a week for two hours and we have a fairly big house, effectively 8 person hours so 10 hours a week isn't far off the mark.

they need to be self employed and invoice you.

[Scarletpimpofnel]

OK thanks both. I would guess most people wanting this gig will be stay at home mothers wanting extra cash whilst the kids are at school and most likely not self employed. I will stipulate self employed in the ad but will try agencies too.

[p4cks]

They may insist that all of the electrical items they use of yours are PAT, so head over to eBay for some stickers and a marker pen if so

[Silvanus]

Scarletpimpofnel said:

OK thanks both. I would guess most people wanting this gig will be stay at home mothers wanting extra cash whilst the kids are at school and most likely not self employed. I will stipulate self employed in the ad but will try agencies too.

That sounds like self employed to me

[Muzzer79]

Scarletpimpofnel said:

My question is can I simply advertise on Facebook for this service and pay cash/BACS and that's as far as my responsibility go or will I become their employer with all that goes with that?

There's nothing to stop you paying someone in cash, but if they are not invoicing you and taking said cash in hand, they are defrauding HMRC.

Do you want to encourage this?

Notwithstanding that, you need a cleaner with proper insurance, etc in case they break something.

Get a proper cleaner who will bill you with a proper invoice.

[ruggedscotty]

check out timeforyou cleaners in your area....

[Silvanus]

Muzzer79 said:

Scarletpimpofnel said:

My question is can I simply advertise on Facebook for this service and pay cash/BACS and that's as far as my responsibility go or will I become their employer with all that goes with that?

There's nothing to stop you paying someone in cash, but if they are not invoicing you and taking said cash in hand, they are defrauding HMRC.

Do you want to encourage this?

Notwithstanding that, you need a cleaner with proper insurance, etc in case they break something.

Get a proper cleaner who will bill you with a proper invoice.

No reason why a self employed cleaner can't have insurance and send an invoice.

I do 6 hours of garden work a week (alongside my day job) for a single client and carry the correct insurances and invoice monthly.

[boyse7en]

Someone self employed will be more than Minimum wage + 20% (which is £12.50 ph roughly) I'd think. Friend of mine cleans holiday cottages a few days a week in Devon (a low-wage area) and gets £16 per hour.

[Muzzer79]

Silvanus said:

Muzzer79 said:

Scarletpimpofnel said:

My question is can I simply advertise on Facebook for this service and pay cash/BACS and that's as far as my responsibility go or will I become their employer with all that goes with that?

There's nothing to stop you paying someone in cash, but if they are not invoicing you and taking said cash in hand, they are defrauding HMRC.

Do you want to encourage this?

Notwithstanding that, you need a cleaner with proper insurance, etc in case they break something.

Get a proper cleaner who will bill you with a proper invoice.

No reason why a self employed cleaner can't have insurance and send an invoice.

I do 6 hours of garden work a week (alongside my day job) for a single client and carry the correct insurances and invoice monthly.

I totally agree. It doesn't have to be a non-self employed person.

The point is, it needs to be legit.

[Silvanus]

Muzzer79 said:

I totally agree. It doesn't have to be a non-self employed person.

The point is, it needs to be legit.

I'd imagine anyone serious about the job would be happy to send in invoices and arrange insurance. Could be the perfect job for someone. Sort of nice to give the job to someone local and not go through an agency who will take a cut.

[Scarletpimpofnel]

ruggedscotty said:

check out timeforyou cleaners in your area....

That looks excellent thanks.

[ruggedscotty]

Silvanus said:

Muzzer79 said:

I totally agree. It doesn't have to be a non-self employed person.

The point is, it needs to be legit.

I'd imagine anyone serious about the job would be happy to send in invoices and arrange insurance. Could be the perfect job for someone. Sort of nice to give the job to someone local and not go through an agency who will take a cut.

no bother.... mind how you going to get the cleaner checked vetted ?

just put a card in the newsagent or an ad on gumtree....

just have anyone coming into your house, your documents you personals your jewelry...

any old Toni Rikki or Harriet ?

[Scarletpimpofnel]

boyse7en said:

Someone self employed will be more than Minimum wage + 20% (which is £12.50 ph roughly) I'd think. Friend of mine cleans holiday cottages a few days a week in Devon (a low-wage area) and gets £16 per hour.

Yes agreed. I was being optimistic + naieve!!!

Cleaners nowadays get a premium over minimum wage and fair enough it's hard work that is unfairly looked down upon.

[Scarletpimpofnel]

Muzzer79 said:

Scarletpimpofnel said:

My question is can I simply advertise on Facebook for this service and pay cash/BACS and that's as far as my responsibility go or will I become their employer with all that goes with that?

There's nothing to stop you paying someone in cash, but if they are not invoicing you and taking said cash in hand, they are defrauding HMRC.

Do you want to encourage this?

Notwithstanding that, you need a cleaner with proper insurance, etc in case they break something.

Get a proper cleaner who will bill you with a proper invoice.

No I am not looking to defraud HMRC, just want minimal paperwork my side for getting this service hence my original post.

[simon_harris]

depending on if they provide cleaning materials or not you can expect £18-20 an hour for domestic cleaners

[Scarletpimpofnel]

ruggedscotty said:

Silvanus said:

Muzzer79 said:

I totally agree. It doesn't have to be a non-self employed person.

The point is, it needs to be legit.

I'd imagine anyone serious about the job would be happy to send in invoices and arrange insurance. Could be the perfect job for someone. Sort of nice to give the job to someone local and not go through an agency who will take a cut.

no bother.... mind how you going to get the cleaner checked vetted ?

just put a card in the newsagent or an ad on gumtree....

just have anyone coming into your house, your documents you personals your jewelry...

any old Toni Rikki or Harriet ?

Yes I was initially thinking some local stay at home mum could do with the income due to the col crisis especially as hours are flexible around school times etc. However all the points about them being vetted etc are all valid and I have been bitten in the past when I benevelently took some "unfortunates" on to work in my business but they turned out to be thieving ne'er-do-wells.

So on balance using an agency seems best.

[Countdown]

I believe there are some videos online which clarify what duties the "Cleaner / maid" will do and how much it costs