IT Contractors - How are you doing?

[Arese]

I've been contracting for nearly four years now. Mostly 3rd-line infrastructure support, VMWare, Citrix etc. My first contract was initially for 5 months, but I ended up staying there 2 years and 10 months! Since finishing that in July last year it's been a bit quiet to say the least, save for a 10 week contract at the end of last year.

I've applied for what must be 30-odd contracts this year which I'm more than capable of, and my CV reflects that. I get calls back probably on a third of them, where the agency proceeds to blow smoke up my rear-end telling me how great I am, put me forward for the role, and then I don't hear anthing back from them. This is the frustrating part, give me some feedback so I can improve myself and my CV! I've had feedback and help with my CV from two kind chaps on here, so I don't think that's the problem.

Is the just the downturn? I do see maybe four or five roles per week that would suit me though, so I think the work is out there, just maybe too many guys like me in the same boat.

I've got so desperate that I've just accepted a short-term role on the same weekly rate as I used to get daily, doing work that I can do without even turning up.

I'm not even limiting myself geographically. I'm happy to uproot and move, even out of the country, if I have to.

How's everyone else doing?

[Big Rod]

I've not long delved back into contracting. I'm in CTI.

It took a looooong time to secure this role. Seemed that, last year at least, the people running projects and/or agencies really couldn't get their act together.

Many times last year I was offered positions 'when they came available' and invariably they never became available.

I was actually offered one which I condsidered accepting but pushed back on them to increase the rate. Cue six weeks of fart arsing around trying to free up the extra £30 a day that we'd agreed on. I was starting to wish I'd just accepted their original offer when I heard they'd not actually got the business in the first place so if I taken the job I'd have been binned 6 weeks into a 6 month contract. I think I was fortunate because I'd have been leaving a permanent job on the strength of it.

The job I have now I landed through a friend of a friend etc so I'm not involving an agency.

ETA, although this job means I have to be away from home during the week, I'm really hoping for extensions. While I know there's 'stuff' bubbling away waiting to break, I'm not looking forward to going through the rigmarole of applying for jobs through agencys again.

Edited by Big Rod on Tuesday 16th February 17:21

[Zeonalarm]

Arese said:

I've been contracting for nearly four years now. Mostly 3rd-line infrastructure support, VMWare, Citrix etc. My first contract was initially for 5 months, but I ended up staying there 2 years and 10 months! Since finishing that in July last year it's been a bit quiet to say the least, save for a 10 week contract at the end of last year.

The market has been extremely flat for well over a year. There are a lot of contractors on the bench in much the same position as yourself. Not that it will give you much comfort knowing this.

Arese said:

I've applied for what must be 30-odd contracts this year which I'm more than capable of, and my CV reflects that. I get calls back probably on a third of them, where the agency proceeds to blow smoke up my rear-end telling me how great I am, put me forward for the role, and then I don't hear anthing back from them. This is the frustrating part, give me some feedback so I can improve myself and my CV! I've had feedback and help with my CV from two kind chaps on here, so I don't think that's the problem.

Here lies the biggest problem. Agencies. I'll try not to turn it into a rant and I won't name names as they tend to be as bad as each other.

So here goes. These are my experiences but they do tend to be consistent with other contractors I've worked with:

1. Internet job boards. There seems to be a lot of "ghost" jobs posted on these boards by agencies. What used to happen was that you got a call straight back from the agent asking for two references. A lot of agency waffle about your CV, what the agent will do for you but actually no information about the role they had posted. Cue ten minutes later the same agent ringing your line manager asking if he needed any contractors. Thankfully most contractors are switched onto this practice of "fishing" so it rarely happens to me nowadays. A quick "I only give references to the client once a contract has been offered" usually does the trick.

2. Lack of phone calls from the agents once you've sent in the CV. This can be down to yourself or the agent:
a) Agent - No such job existed and you didn't have any references on your CV. Not worth their time to ring you back (see point 1).
b) Contractors - Agent received 1000+ CV's in their Inbox. 90% of them being not relevant to the role. Make sure you are not in the 90%.
c) Agent - After receiving 1000+ CV's decides to only deal with the people who follow up CV with a phone call. Try doing this. If I'm interested in a role I usually call the agent and then send them my CV while I'm on the call.
d) Contractors - CV. I keep it concise. I've worked closely with hiring managers in the past and none of them liked receiving CV's that were 8 pages long and had large amounts of text. Most preferred 2 pages with a few lines or bullet points about each role. This enabled them to scan it quickly and determine if you warranted further investigation in an interview.

3. Lack of feedback. One of my pets hates as well. Again you are not alone in this.

Arese said:

Is the just the downturn? I do see maybe four or five roles per week that would suit me though, so I think the work is out there, just maybe too many guys like me in the same boat.

It's the downturn. Not only are there lots of contractors out of work there are lots of permanent employees willing to do contract work for a lot less money.

Arese said:

I've got so desperate that I've just accepted a short-term role on the same weekly rate as I used to get daily, doing work that I can do without even turning up.

Not sure of your circumstances but you are probably earning a huge amount of money for the agent because they know your desperate. Most clients I've worked for are extremely large companies and as such will have set budgets etc. which take nothing sort of ice-ages to get approved and changed due to the bureaucracy. Don't be fooled into taking a low rate just because the agent says that's all the client are offering. I am not sure of your skill set and what it can command but if I was on £500p/d and then had to take £500p/w it wouldn't happen, not for another short term role. What would you feel like if you found out the agent had spun you a yarn and the client was paying £500p/d? If I got really desperate I would go for a permanent role and enjoy the paid holidays until the storm blew over.

Arese said:

I'm not even limiting myself geographically. I'm happy to uproot and move, even out of the country, if I have to.

How's everyone else doing?

Same here no limits to were I'll work possible exceptions being war zones.

I've got 4 months left on the current contract. After that we'll just have to wait and see. Not looking forward to it though for all the above reasons.

[ewenm]

My current main contract ends in March, already restricted to 20 hours max a week with time on other contracts or on holiday actively encouraged. Got a meeting on 2nd March to find out whether the contract will be extended for another 6 months or not - feeling is that it is quite likely fortunately, but with the same restrictions.

[NoelWatson]

The market is very bouyant in the City.

[anonymous-user]

I have been out of work since my contract ended in July 09. 100% agree with Zeonalarm as my experience applying for contract and permy roles mirrors this.

Only jobs I really see are for investment banks but of course they want investment banking experience.

Even Permy roles want you to have every skill under the sun and expect to pay you peanuts. I have seen some 6 month fixed term contracts jobs (PAYE) that want to get away with paying the equivalent of 35K a year. Guess some people are desperate enough to take it.

[ewenm]

NoelWatson said:

The market is very bouyant in the City.

I've noticed an increased number of hits on JobServe for my skills, mostly in the City. Hopefully over the next year that will spread down the M4 corridor.

[ChrisMCoupe]

Just to give my 2p as a Java Developer specialising in the Financial sector...

Came out of contract Feb 2009, found it bloody awful tbh, many calls, many telephone interviews which all went well, further interviews, then invarably nothing. A lot of roles seemed to just dissapear or went internal. I didn't want to drop out of the financial sector and was determined not to take a nothing role which would end up de-skilling me. By May 2009 I lined up an interview in Zurich Switzerland for one of their big banks. Loved the place, so took the position. Haven't looked back. The weak pound also makes the rates pretty attractive

This year I have been getting a lot of phone calls from my old agencies in London, it is apparently picking up in a big way (so they say). So fingers crossed it will be a better year. I will eventually come back to london for work, but haven't decided when.

[anonymous-user]

Scarily enough out of the blue I have just had a call from the agent at my last contract asking me if I am available and if he can put me forward for a role!

How is that for a coincidence!

[JimCross]

ChrisMCoupe said:

Just to give my 2p as a Java Developer specialising in the Financial sector...

Came out of contract Feb 2009, found it bloody awful tbh, many calls, many telephone interviews which all went well, further interviews, then invarably nothing. A lot of roles seemed to just dissapear or went internal. I didn't want to drop out of the financial sector and was determined not to take a nothing role which would end up de-skilling me. By May 2009 I lined up an interview in Zurich Switzerland for one of their big banks. Loved the place, so took the position. Haven't looked back. The weak pound also makes the rates pretty attractive

This year I have been getting a lot of phone calls from my old agencies in London, it is apparently picking up in a big way (so they say). So fingers crossed it will be a better year. I will eventually come back to london for work, but haven't decided when.

If you're at the same big Swiss bank I'm at I bet you're seriously glad you're a contractor today (wish I was!)

[Zeonalarm]

Joey Deacon said:

Scarily enough out of the blue I have just had a call from the agent at my last contract asking me if I am available and if he can put me forward for a role!

How is that for a coincidence!

Always the case. You spend loads of time chasing jobs, sending CV's out, then out of the blue somebody rings you up with something promising.

Good luck.

[amir_j]

ChrisMCoupe said:

Just to give my 2p as a Java Developer specialising in the Financial sector...

Came out of contract Feb 2009, found it bloody awful tbh, many calls, many telephone interviews which all went well, further interviews, then invarably nothing. A lot of roles seemed to just dissapear or went internal. I didn't want to drop out of the financial sector and was determined not to take a nothing role which would end up de-skilling me. By May 2009 I lined up an interview in Zurich Switzerland for one of their big banks. Loved the place, so took the position. Haven't looked back. The weak pound also makes the rates pretty attractive

This year I have been getting a lot of phone calls from my old agencies in London, it is apparently picking up in a big way (so they say). So fingers crossed it will be a better year. I will eventually come back to london for work, but haven't decided when.

Chris- look into IR20 before you come back, if you are not away a full tax year, hmrc will want the difference in tax between here and there. I quit zurich due to this as if didnt stay away long enough wasn't worthwhile compared to here when all was considered.

[ChrisMCoupe]

JimCross said:

If you're at the same big Swiss bank I'm at I bet you're seriously glad you're a contractor today (wish I was!)

I have a feeling I'm at the other one, but worked for your bank in the UK during 08/09, not a very fun place to be towards the end!

amir_j said:

Chris- look into IR20 before you come back, if you are not away a full tax year, hmrc will want the difference in tax between here and there. I quit zurich due to this as if didnt stay away long enough wasn't worthwhile compared to here when all was considered.

Thanks Amir, yes I'm unfortunately aware of IR20, but I do plan on being here for the next tax year. Last tax year I shouldn't be hit too badly as up till July I hadn't earn't much that year so had a bit of a buffer before hitting the higher UK tax bracket. Will have to wait and see.

[Arese]

Thanks all for your replies, in particular Zeonalarm for his mini-rant!

Zeonalarm said:

1. Internet job boards. There seems to be a lot of "ghost" jobs posted on these boards by agencies. What used to happen was that you got a call straight back from the agent asking for two references. A lot of agency waffle about your CV, what the agent will do for you but actually no information about the role they had posted. Cue ten minutes later the same agent ringing your line manager asking if he needed any contractors. Thankfully most contractors are switched onto this practice of "fishing" so it rarely happens to me nowadays. A quick "I only give references to the client once a contract has been offered" usually does the trick.

I was aware that this does happen occasionally, so I tend not to give out references until I know the job is real. There are no references on my CV, either.

Zeonalarm said:

2. Lack of phone calls from the agents once you've sent in the CV. This can be down to yourself or the agent:
a) Agent - No such job existed and you didn't have any references on your CV. Not worth their time to ring you back (see point 1).
b) Contractors - Agent received 1000+ CV's in their Inbox. 90% of them being not relevant to the role. Make sure you are not in the 90%.
c) Agent - After receiving 1000+ CV's decides to only deal with the people who follow up CV with a phone call. Try doing this. If I'm interested in a role I usually call the agent and then send them my CV while I'm on the call.
d) Contractors - CV. I keep it concise. I've worked closely with hiring managers in the past and none of them liked receiving CV's that were 8 pages long and had large amounts of text. Most preferred 2 pages with a few lines or bullet points about each role. This enabled them to scan it quickly and determine if you warranted further investigation in an interview.

I do tend to follow up applications with a phonecall a couple of hours later, and they are usually worthwile. If it turns out that I'm not suitable for that particular role, then I think at least I'll be fresh in the agency's mind if anything else comes up. My CV is just on four pages, and that's after trimming, so hopefully it's not too long. Two guys off PH (who both run agencies) said my CV was good.

Zeonalarm said:

Not sure of your circumstances but you are probably earning a huge amount of money for the agent because they know your desperate. Most clients I've worked for are extremely large companies and as such will have set budgets etc. which take nothing sort of ice-ages to get approved and changed due to the bureaucracy. Don't be fooled into taking a low rate just because the agent says that's all the client are offering. I am not sure of your skill set and what it can command but if I was on £500p/d and then had to take £500p/w it wouldn't happen, not for another short term role. What would you feel like if you found out the agent had spun you a yarn and the client was paying £500p/d? If I got really desperate I would go for a permanent role and enjoy the paid holidays until the storm blew over.

Well, I've knocked that job on the head anyway. I was reasonably happy to do it until the end of March, but they then decided they wanted someone to commit for a year, which I obviously couldn't do.

On a positive note, since making this post I've had my CV put forward for four different roles in the space of a few days. I've become so cynical though that I don't expect to hear anything at all! One of them is around 25 miles away (perfect), one is 180 miles away (not so bad), the other two are overseas (eek).

ChrisMCoupe said:

Just to give my 2p as a Java Developer specialising in the Financial sector...

Came out of contract Feb 2009, found it bloody awful tbh, many calls, many telephone interviews which all went well, further interviews, then invarably nothing. A lot of roles seemed to just dissapear or went internal. I didn't want to drop out of the financial sector and was determined not to take a nothing role which would end up de-skilling me. By May 2009 I lined up an interview in Zurich Switzerland for one of their big banks. Loved the place, so took the position. Haven't looked back. The weak pound also makes the rates pretty attractive

This year I have been getting a lot of phone calls from my old agencies in London, it is apparently picking up in a big way (so they say). So fingers crossed it will be a better year. I will eventually come back to london for work, but haven't decided when.

Good to hear that it worked out for you and you're enjoying it. I applied for something over in Basel last year, as I'd love the life experience of working over there for a year or so.

So, do you lot use any websites other than Jobserve and Jobsite? Now and then I check www.cwjobs.co.uk and Monster, but Jobserve and Jobsite seem to be the best ones.

Edited by Arese on Thursday 18th February 10:18

[Dupont666]

Contracts are good in the City and im a .Net with several years in credit derivatives and the agents are falling over themselves with supposed jobs...

Latest one was in Surrey and a few in a certain Swiss place (the country), but to be honest Im wanting to stay here and see the project out rather than move. I got this in August last year and have 6 days left on the contract.

[NoelWatson]

Dupont666 said:

Contracts are good in the City and im a .Net with several years in credit derivatives and the agents are falling over themselves with supposed jobs...

Indeed. My client is recruiting for just that.

[Dupont666]

NoelWatson said:

Dupont666 said:

Contracts are good in the City and im a .Net with several years in credit derivatives and the agents are falling over themselves with supposed jobs...

Indeed. My client is recruiting for just that.

Pitch the job to me then

[Arese]

Sigh.

An agency called me yesterday, talked the talked, usual crap. Said that he didn't have any roles immediately, but they'd like me on their books etc. All good I think, I don't care who gets me a job, as long as someone does. Then he sends me an email:

Agency Guy said:

As I am going to “take you to market” in order to secure that next career move, there are a number of things I need you to do. First, I would look unprofessional with any potential client that had already seen your details were I to present you to them; as such, I need to know the names of each and every company and the position for which you have applied for within the last six months; this way I am not wasting your, my or the client’s time. Second, I need to know if you are contacted about any potential positions or you apply for any yourself going forward, as I pride myself on my networking and I don’t want any application of yours ruined by my talking to a client that you may already be “in the process” with, at any stage.

I understand where he's coming from, but it's unrealistic to expect me to let him know every time I apply for anything.

Edited by Arese on Thursday 18th February 12:48

[TEKNOPUG]

Arese said:

Sigh.

An agency called me yesterday, talked the talked, usual crap. Said that he didn't have any roles immediately, but they'd like me on their books etc. All good I think, I don't care who gets me a job, as long as someone does. Then he sends me an email:

Agency Guy said:

As I am going to “take you to market” in order to secure that next career move, there are a number of things I need you to do. First, I would look unprofessional with any potential client that had already seen your details were I to present you to them; as such, I need to know the names of each and every company and the position for which you have applied for within the last six months; this way I am not wasting your, my or the client’s time. Second, I need to know if you are contacted about any potential positions or you apply for any yourself going forward, as I pride myself on my networking and I don’t want any application of yours ruined by my talking to a client that you may already be “in the process” with, at any stage.

I understand where he's coming from, but it's unrealistic to expect me to let him know every time I apply for anything.

Edited by Arese on Thursday 18th February 12:48

WTF?? He's trying to find out as much information as possible about OTHER contacts, jobs, firms hiring, names of HR staff/recruiting managers etc. LOL what a chancer....

[Arese]

TEKNOPUG said:

Arese said:

Sigh.

An agency called me yesterday, talked the talked, usual crap. Said that he didn't have any roles immediately, but they'd like me on their books etc. All good I think, I don't care who gets me a job, as long as someone does. Then he sends me an email:

Agency Guy said:

As I am going to “take you to market” in order to secure that next career move, there are a number of things I need you to do. First, I would look unprofessional with any potential client that had already seen your details were I to present you to them; as such, I need to know the names of each and every company and the position for which you have applied for within the last six months; this way I am not wasting your, my or the client’s time. Second, I need to know if you are contacted about any potential positions or you apply for any yourself going forward, as I pride myself on my networking and I don’t want any application of yours ruined by my talking to a client that you may already be “in the process” with, at any stage.

I understand where he's coming from, but it's unrealistic to expect me to let him know every time I apply for anything.

Edited by Arese on Thursday 18th February 12:48

WTF?? He's trying to find out as much information as possible about OTHER contacts, jobs, firms hiring, names of HR staff/recruiting managers etc. LOL what a chancer....

I'm still wondering whether I should reply to his email or just ignore it. I've come across a few other agencies like this, including one who took six weeks to contact my referees.