How would you sort this mess out at work?
Discussion
Right I'll try and keep this short and sweet but Basically my Firm wants to send me to a course which will be 1 day a week for 3 years. They have paid £400 for the first year of the course and they want me to sign a Contract which meanns I can't leave the firm for 4 years. However I've got cold feet and I don't wanna go to the course. How can I tell them with out risking my Job? I enjoy working but I work along side my boss'es, so I don't want to turn the relationship sour.
Could someone advise me the best way to approach the situation?
Thanks all
.
Could someone advise me the best way to approach the situation?
Thanks all
. Flanders. said:
Right I'll try and keep this short and sweet but Basically my Firm wants to send me to a course which will be 1 day a week for 3 years. They have paid £400 for the first year of the course and they want me to sign a Contract which meanns I can't leave the firm for 4 years. However I've got cold feet and I don't wanna go to the course. How can I tell them with out risking my Job? I enjoy working but I work along side my boss'es, so I don't want to turn the relationship sour.
Could someone advise me the best way to approach the situation?
Thanks all.
Reference the other thread.Could someone advise me the best way to approach the situation?
Thanks all
. Get an AK-47, take it to work under a large raincoat.
Shoot your colleagues, bosses, and anyone else you can find.
Wait for the police stand-off, take out a few of them, and finish yourself off with the gun.
It's the only way.....
O.k. so I'm kidding.
The trouble is that the company has given you an ultimatum. They're probably not competent enough to realise that they have. Undoubtedly they would deny it. To my mind there's no way out of it though. It's an ultimatum.
Tell them you don't really want to do the training course, but that you don't want to leave or be fired. Ask them what other options there are. If there aren't any, then it's clear that it's an ultimatum.
At that point you have to decide if you're going to go with or against it. If you're going to go against it, do it properly. Work to rule, do as much as you can to get out. Prepare to be redundant.
Do you not want to do the course because it ties you to the company for 4 years, or is there another reason?
If it's the former, I would agree to attend the course, but not sign the contract. I would argue that it is somewhat unreasonable.
I would also seek advice as to the legality (from an employment perspective) of backing you into a corner like that.
If it's the former, I would agree to attend the course, but not sign the contract. I would argue that it is somewhat unreasonable.
I would also seek advice as to the legality (from an employment perspective) of backing you into a corner like that.
henrycrun said:
Consider asking for the contract to be modified so that if you do leave, you will reimburse them all or part of the course fee ?
I'd have thought that's what the contract already says.I mean, what else are they going to do if you do leave? Send Interpol after you?
I don't think so.
henrycrun said:
Consider asking for the contract to be modified so that if you do leave, you will reimburse them all or part of the course fee ?
They want £1200 plus interest if I leave before the 4 years is over. The reason I don't want to do it is because I'm not sure I could stand being at the company that long. There is a huge amount of Politics with-in the Firm. I also feel like I'm used as a Scape goat when things go wrong. I can cope with all that for the time being as the money isn't bad. However I couldn't put up with it for too long. Shall I tell the situation as it is? Surely being an Employer they can expect these things to happen from time to time?
If it's the firm pushing the course, I wouldn't be paying a penny: "I would love to do the course, but who knows what the future will hold and a £1200 commitment isn't wise at my salary level".
The last course I did which I pushed for, I agreed to a 12 month 'tie in' where I would have to pay back a percentage of the course fees (decreasing by 1/12th each month) if I left within 1 year of the course end.
The last course I did which I pushed for, I agreed to a 12 month 'tie in' where I would have to pay back a percentage of the course fees (decreasing by 1/12th each month) if I left within 1 year of the course end.
Edited by Stevenj214 on Sunday 25th July 19:53
To be honest, I'd be over the moon if my employer wanted to tie me into working for them for another 4 years in the current climate.
If you're OK with taking the course but not with being tied to them for so long, could you not suggest paying for the course yourself via salary sacrifice?
If you're OK with taking the course but not with being tied to them for so long, could you not suggest paying for the course yourself via salary sacrifice?
Say a relative's got a progressive disease and you may need to move closer to them at some point in the future, so although you'd like to do it the tie-in is too much of a burden as you're not sure you can keep your side of the deal.
If you don't do it are you placing yourself in the firing line if they do redundancies though?
If you don't do it are you placing yourself in the firing line if they do redundancies though?
They're asking you to commit to them for four years, but are they going to commit to you for the same amount of time?
If they are, make sure it's writen into a new contract that should they wish to terminate your employment they have to compensate you financially.
It works both ways, if they want you to commit for the four years, they should also.
If they can guarantee you work for that amount of time I woud go for it.
If they are, make sure it's writen into a new contract that should they wish to terminate your employment they have to compensate you financially.
It works both ways, if they want you to commit for the four years, they should also.
If they can guarantee you work for that amount of time I woud go for it.
Edited by Oxygen Thief on Sunday 25th July 21:09
The way my company handles this is that any course you are expected to attend as part of your employment is fully covered by the company.
Any course that an employee requests in order to develop themselves further comes with a repayment agreement, so if you leave during the first year after completing the course you re-pay 50% of the fee, within 2 years, 25% of the fee etc.
Signing a contract tying you to the company for 4 years is un-enforceable in law. Nobody can foresee what will happen in the next 4 years.
Any course that an employee requests in order to develop themselves further comes with a repayment agreement, so if you leave during the first year after completing the course you re-pay 50% of the fee, within 2 years, 25% of the fee etc.
Signing a contract tying you to the company for 4 years is un-enforceable in law. Nobody can foresee what will happen in the next 4 years.
I used to work for a company that made LGV drivers sign a similar indemnity if they left. We knew it was pretty close to legally unenforceable
The logic is as follows - to avoid a £1200.00 fine you HAVE to work for your employer for four years. Forcing someone to work against their will is illegal(slavery) Demanding money in return for providing work is also illegal so the chances of a successful court case are pretty marginal - I'd sleep easy at night
The logic is as follows - to avoid a £1200.00 fine you HAVE to work for your employer for four years. Forcing someone to work against their will is illegal(slavery) Demanding money in return for providing work is also illegal so the chances of a successful court case are pretty marginal - I'd sleep easy at night
anonymous said:
[redacted]
All part of the risk you take as an employer.If you're not confident that you can create an environment where the employee will want to stay and develop voluntarily then it's a bit counterproductive to try to force them to stay. They'll go sooner later.
It would be different in two cases:
1) Employee hasn't yet joined, and you give them the choice: we'll take you on and train you, but we need you to commit (although still unenforcable)
2) Employee has the choice of doing the course or not
Neither are true in this case.
As has been said its unenforcable anyway. Just sign it but make sure you ask what the pay rise will be once you qualify.
Also you need to take into consideration that it may be one day a week but it may also encroach (sp) into your weekends and evenings so if you dont feel that your going to be able to knuckle down on the course you may wish to find a new job before you fail the first year..
Also you need to take into consideration that it may be one day a week but it may also encroach (sp) into your weekends and evenings so if you dont feel that your going to be able to knuckle down on the course you may wish to find a new job before you fail the first year..
Could you decline the course on grounds that you have a lot on in your personal life etc. Don't want to take on too much..would benifit more next year when you've another years experiance / learning on the job (or other BS)?
I also think they would struggle to get the money out of you if you left.
I also think they would struggle to get the money out of you if you left.
NDT said:
anonymous said:
[redacted]
All part of the risk you take as an employer.This seems to happen with the dross on minimum wage, but for the rest of us, a company needs to invest in its employees largely for its own benefit and certainly not solely the benefit of the employee. Start hanging training courses round their necks and it doesn't help the company.
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