I'm being 'head hunted' at the moment...
Discussion
...and I'd be grateful for a point of view from employers on here.
The situation is this:
I work in a small(ish) industry where everybody knows everybody and moving between companies is not unheard of. Good people quite often follow the bigger contracts around. The company who are after me are direct competitors to one of the products that I manage, and have been mentioned in countless meetings in the current company.
Anyway, would you prefer an employee be honest with you and tell you that he's been approached? With the thinking that on a professional point of view his feelings are 60/40 in terms of going, but on a personal (think work life balance) point of view his mind is pretty much made up to leave.
Now I'm not sure what talking with them will do, they won't offer more money and if they do it won't matter too much to me. They can't say don't travel as much as I then won't be doing my job to the fullest. Essentially all I can do is soften the shock to them (I've not mentioned I want to leave) and try and maintain my bridges with them by being honest.
As an employer, what would you prefer? How would you feel if they told you this and ended up staying? Or for that matter, leaving...
The situation is this:
I work in a small(ish) industry where everybody knows everybody and moving between companies is not unheard of. Good people quite often follow the bigger contracts around. The company who are after me are direct competitors to one of the products that I manage, and have been mentioned in countless meetings in the current company.
Anyway, would you prefer an employee be honest with you and tell you that he's been approached? With the thinking that on a professional point of view his feelings are 60/40 in terms of going, but on a personal (think work life balance) point of view his mind is pretty much made up to leave.
Now I'm not sure what talking with them will do, they won't offer more money and if they do it won't matter too much to me. They can't say don't travel as much as I then won't be doing my job to the fullest. Essentially all I can do is soften the shock to them (I've not mentioned I want to leave) and try and maintain my bridges with them by being honest.
As an employer, what would you prefer? How would you feel if they told you this and ended up staying? Or for that matter, leaving...
In a similar positionas you at the moment, just waiting to hear back following 2nd meeting with prospective C.O.O.
My take on this has been not to say anything at the moment, until if you are lucky and offer is made, you can then evaluate that offer against your current package and assuming youve done your homework on prospective employer then you will be able to make an informed decision.
If that does happen then I will tell my director, I will also make it clear that they came looking for me not the other way around, I am happy where I am, but opportunities do come up and its up to the individual to explore or decline, however your current employer should not be too offended if you tell him the right way, it can also make for interesting negotiations re salary etc where you currently are, if they value you, if not and they cant compete they will let you go, whether thats straight away ie gardening leave, or work your notice will depend on many factors, but if they shove you out the door straight away having cleared your desk of personal items then you know they didnt take it too well. But you have already said that people move around on the big contracts in your industry so they should really be surprised.
At the end of the day you have to do whats best for you and if you have one your family, but dont burn bridges with your existing employer before you know for definite.
My take on this has been not to say anything at the moment, until if you are lucky and offer is made, you can then evaluate that offer against your current package and assuming youve done your homework on prospective employer then you will be able to make an informed decision.
If that does happen then I will tell my director, I will also make it clear that they came looking for me not the other way around, I am happy where I am, but opportunities do come up and its up to the individual to explore or decline, however your current employer should not be too offended if you tell him the right way, it can also make for interesting negotiations re salary etc where you currently are, if they value you, if not and they cant compete they will let you go, whether thats straight away ie gardening leave, or work your notice will depend on many factors, but if they shove you out the door straight away having cleared your desk of personal items then you know they didnt take it too well. But you have already said that people move around on the big contracts in your industry so they should really be surprised.
At the end of the day you have to do whats best for you and if you have one your family, but dont burn bridges with your existing employer before you know for definite.
I am a director of a recruitment business which regularly head hunts candidates.
In my experience (including being head hunted myself) I would secure your position first before informing your director. Make a decision and if you choose to leave get a contract in your hand first...
Do not tell a colleague or anyone you think you can trust, there's nothing worse than hearing one of your staff are leaving from somebody else.
Other things to be aware of are contractual obligations which could impact your new role- are there legal covenants written into your contract which will restrict you doing business with existing clients etc?
Looking after number one in the first instance will not impact your ability to leave on amicable terms.
In my experience (including being head hunted myself) I would secure your position first before informing your director. Make a decision and if you choose to leave get a contract in your hand first...
Do not tell a colleague or anyone you think you can trust, there's nothing worse than hearing one of your staff are leaving from somebody else.
Other things to be aware of are contractual obligations which could impact your new role- are there legal covenants written into your contract which will restrict you doing business with existing clients etc?
Looking after number one in the first instance will not impact your ability to leave on amicable terms.
I was approached before xmas in similar fashion, and although the industry is large, its fairly incestuous.
I had 3 meetings with said company, agreed terms, had contract in hand, and then informed previous place, I was similar to you in that I didn't think they were going to offer more money as the company are poor in terms of staff retention, so I said that I had been approached and had agreed a new role, I had said that I had accepted, that was really it.
In most ways its easier than actually looking for a job!
Last but not least I think it was somebody on here said the following "if a company needed to cut you loose do you really think they would be thinking about how not to upset you as much as you're thinking about them?"
Or words to that effect, I would bet i they needed to make cuts then it would be done, look after number one is very cliche but 100% accurate in my book.
I had 3 meetings with said company, agreed terms, had contract in hand, and then informed previous place, I was similar to you in that I didn't think they were going to offer more money as the company are poor in terms of staff retention, so I said that I had been approached and had agreed a new role, I had said that I had accepted, that was really it.
In most ways its easier than actually looking for a job!
Last but not least I think it was somebody on here said the following "if a company needed to cut you loose do you really think they would be thinking about how not to upset you as much as you're thinking about them?"
Or words to that effect, I would bet i they needed to make cuts then it would be done, look after number one is very cliche but 100% accurate in my book.
Edited by okgo on Thursday 6th January 15:41
Thanks for the replies, I think my willingness to talk to my employer before the contract was on the table was due to the fact that I'm caught up in a little bit of a power struggle internally. One of our business units (who are direct competition to the company who want me!) are pushing my director to dedicate me to their cause.
So in the back of my head, it's very complex for me to sit in these discussions whilst I know that I could up and leave after agreeing to a reshuffle. So this leads me to think be honest up front could be a good thing to do. To agree to the reshuffle and a couple of weeks later say "Thanks, but I'm off" could be worse...
It's also a fair point that the company could let me go at a moments notice and wouldn't think too hard about the effects.
So in the back of my head, it's very complex for me to sit in these discussions whilst I know that I could up and leave after agreeing to a reshuffle. So this leads me to think be honest up front could be a good thing to do. To agree to the reshuffle and a couple of weeks later say "Thanks, but I'm off" could be worse...
It's also a fair point that the company could let me go at a moments notice and wouldn't think too hard about the effects.
So you could, in theory, with a bit of effort, become an essential part of the business unit at your existing firm, becoming almost indispensable, delivering the goods, able to write your own cheques etc etc?
Is there any chance the newco knows that and is trying to get you, not because they need you, but to stop you working for their competition? I mean if they are large enough to absorb your salary costs when compared to the loss of profit they may suffer if you get the existing firms business unit fully functioning?
Is there any chance the newco knows that and is trying to get you, not because they need you, but to stop you working for their competition? I mean if they are large enough to absorb your salary costs when compared to the loss of profit they may suffer if you get the existing firms business unit fully functioning?
GuinnessMK said:
So you could, in theory, with a bit of effort, become an essential part of the business unit at your existing firm, becoming almost indispensable, delivering the goods, able to write your own cheques etc etc?
Yes, that could be possible, but I'm not sure the current company would think like that. Only me sticking my neck on the line would show that and get a few more years experience under my belt would help. To put it in context they let the sales manager for the biggest market just walk out after being with the company for most of its life, why they would treat me any differently would be beyond me.GuinnessMK said:
Is there any chance the newco knows that and is trying to get you, not because they need you, but to stop you working for their competition? I mean if they are large enough to absorb your salary costs when compared to the loss of profit they may suffer if you get the existing firms business unit fully functioning?
I'd say it would be the other way around, the current co are very cash rich, make stupid money and have a position in the industry (in terms of penetration) that nobody else can really match. They could afford to just keep me on the payroll.The new company, I very much doubt would just take me on in that manner, the role I would take me on in that manner. If that makes sense.
Didn't mean to sound negative, just having been approached myself a couple of times, once to set up a direct competitor, I'd always want to do a bit of background before committing.
Sounds like you have it all under control.
As others have said, wait until you have the new job in writing, cast iron etc etc, then talk to the original company.
Best of luck!
Sounds like you have it all under control.
As others have said, wait until you have the new job in writing, cast iron etc etc, then talk to the original company.
Best of luck!
I do not recommend that you talk to your existing employer prior to making the decision. As soon as you have made up your mind, you should inform everyone as soon as possible. It sounds a bit as if you are negotiating for more money if you go in with the open decision. (I have a lot of experience in executive management, (my last corporate job I had a reporting staff of 10,000).)
The reality is that companies know that people come and go, and the important thing is to be honest and straightforward and to make sure you tidy up your current job as well as you can. Even if they are disappointed to lose you, they will understand if you are making a move to advance your career.
The reality is that companies know that people come and go, and the important thing is to be honest and straightforward and to make sure you tidy up your current job as well as you can. Even if they are disappointed to lose you, they will understand if you are making a move to advance your career.
“..As an employer, what would you prefer?”
I would want to know aspa so I could act on it, perhaps I have been too busy to understand how important you were to my organisation and therefore this would be a gentle reminder. I would rather have time to react and construct a appropriate save package than be faced with you standing in my offcie with a resignation letter saying you are going to leave in a month
If you wait for the offer before acting you will find yourself in a pretty urgent situation were you will be under a lot of pressure from the head hunter and new co to accept their offer quickly …little time for your current employer to respond ….
I would want to know aspa so I could act on it, perhaps I have been too busy to understand how important you were to my organisation and therefore this would be a gentle reminder. I would rather have time to react and construct a appropriate save package than be faced with you standing in my offcie with a resignation letter saying you are going to leave in a month
If you wait for the offer before acting you will find yourself in a pretty urgent situation were you will be under a lot of pressure from the head hunter and new co to accept their offer quickly …little time for your current employer to respond ….
So, I've just been sent an offer letter. Going to need to make a decision in the morning, the timing is horrible as we are going away on a team building trip the weekend after next!
At the moment I only have an offer letter, which I don't feel is good enough to resign on (unless others here know different about the legality of an offer letter).
At the moment I only have an offer letter, which I don't feel is good enough to resign on (unless others here know different about the legality of an offer letter).
qureshia said:
“..As an employer, what would you prefer?”
I would want to know aspa so I could act on it, perhaps I have been too busy to understand how important you were to my organisation and therefore this would be a gentle reminder. I would rather have time to react and construct a appropriate save package than be faced with you standing in my offcie with a resignation letter saying you are going to leave in a month
If you wait for the offer before acting you will find yourself in a pretty urgent situation were you will be under a lot of pressure from the head hunter and new co to accept their offer quickly …little time for your current employer to respond ….
Then one might be tempted to say that you haven't been doing a very good job of using your 'assets' to their best effect, hence why that person is looking to leave.I would want to know aspa so I could act on it, perhaps I have been too busy to understand how important you were to my organisation and therefore this would be a gentle reminder. I would rather have time to react and construct a appropriate save package than be faced with you standing in my offcie with a resignation letter saying you are going to leave in a month
If you wait for the offer before acting you will find yourself in a pretty urgent situation were you will be under a lot of pressure from the head hunter and new co to accept their offer quickly …little time for your current employer to respond ….
From an employer's perspective your comments make eminent sense, but the reality is that they're purely selfish and aimed at making life easier for yourself. If that person was key to your organisation then a bit of investment in time and effort beforehand (perhaps by *making* the time to recognise who was key to the organisation and might be at risk of being head-hunted) might have prevented the situation from arising in the first place, or at least mitigated the consequences.
Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff