M5 Touring (and a C63 AMG for the weekend)
Discussion
I had the pleasure this weekend of borrowing a new Mercedes C63 AMG from my dealer for two days. The C63 is a car I’d been toying with the idea of buying, and wanted to try one out and see if it could play the role of practical family car for me, my wife and my 3 boys. Ultimately the lack of room in the back meant the answer to that question was a “no”, but driving the car and contrasting it to my current M5 was certainly a lot of fun, so I thought I'd write up a summary of my thoughts and feelings from driving them both extensively back to back…
Engine
The engines in both cars are masterpieces in their own right. Start them up and it’s the C63 which is immediately the more charismatic with a deep gruff bark through the quad tail pipes. In contrast, starting the M5 is something of an anti-climax if you’ve psyched yourself up for immediate aural delights from the V10: the M car needs to be moving, and with some revs dialled in before its sound starts to please.
On the move in the AMG and it’s the sound and the torque from that hand built V8 which leave the most lasting memory. Accelerate hard from low a rolling start, and you’re pinned back in your seat, almost swearing your cheeks are being pulled back “rocket take-off” style as you revel in the sound of that wonderful V8. Power delivery is constant and linear, and doesn’t noticeably taper off even close to the 7200rpm red-line. It’s an addictive experience, and impossible not to laugh out loud and murmur “f*** this thing is fast” expletives under your breath.
The M5 on the other hand needs to be worked harder to make the same level of progress. But when you do, you’re rewarded with a higher-pitched but no less intoxicating V10 howl, and acceleration which is ballistic as the needle sweeps through the last 2-3k rpm towards the 8250rpm red-line. Which is ultimately faster? It really is too close to call. Balls out, wringing every last rev from the engine, I suspect the M5 might have the edge, especially at higher speeds. But for real-world usability when you’re not in the mood, you’d make swifter progress in the AMG.
Transmission
The transmission in the M5 attracts more than its fair share of criticism for being unrefined and jerky. Whilst there’s an element of truth in this – especially on full bore max-rpm upshifts in P500S mode - once you learn the nuances of the SMG-III box it really is possible to make smooth fast progress, both on the open road and around town.
But, get into the AMG and it’s still clear that the game has moved on. The MCT box is incredibly smooth on both downshift and max-attack upshift. It has 4 regular modes: comfort, sport, sport-plus and manual, plus RS: the latter is a mode for launch control starts, which out of respect for others property, I didn’t try. It’s eager to kick down and play, especially in the sport modes.
Maybe it’s because of the advances in transmission technology, or maybe it’s because of some other facet of the car, but despite it being a manual box it still feels much more natural to drive the AMG in auto mode. This is never the case with the M5, which is in manual mode before it’s left the garage.
Anyone with an other-half who dislikes driving the M5 because of the gearbox (like my wife) could find a good companion in the C63. It took a bit of cajoling to persuade Mrs Hedgeman to get behind the wheel as she was nervous about driving somebody-elses-60k-car, but 30 miles later she parked up next to my M5, got out of the Merc and said “I love it, that car is just sooo good to drive”.
Brakes
For road use, both cars offer strong progressive brakes. How they fare on a track with the kinetic energy of 2 tons moving at high speed to dissipate might be a different matter, but driven within the bounds of common-sense on the public highway, neither offer any cause for complaint.
Ride and Handling
Considering they’re fairly extreme sporting machinery, both cars ride well. The M5 with its dampers set to “comfort” offers the most cossetting ride over badly pock-marked roads and speed bumps, but you wouldn’t reject one over the other on comfort grounds alone. But get out of town and onto twisty A/B roads and some starker differences do start to appear. Whilst both cars hide their weight well, and feel agile for 2 ton beasts, it’s the M5 which does a noticeably better job of remaining fleet of foot when pressing on. In contrast, the C63 feels that bit more wooden in its responses.
Interior
Open the drivers door of the AMG and you’re greeted with very heavily bolstered front sports seats and a sporty looking half leather / half alcantara angular steering wheel. The seats are comfortable, though perhaps a little on the tight side for anyone with a larger frame. The driving position is good with a multitude of adjustments available to both seat and wheel. But once you’ve lived with the car for a little while, you do start to notice some of the less than top-notch fine detail. In particular, the quality of some of the plastics and the headlining feel decidedly low rent for such an expensive car car, and you can’t help but feel that a large portion of the £60k price is paying for what’s upfront under the bonnet.
The cabin on the M5 is a little less overtly sporting, but ultimately more comfortable and the quality of materials that bit higher. It’s the subtle details you appreciate here: multi-coloured M stitching on the thick leather wheel, the 8250rpm red-line and the like. And once you’re used to the head-up display on the M5, you do feel a little cheated driving anything without.
Rear seat accommodation – an important factor for me –is vastly better in the M5. In the AMG, the combination of it being a smaller car overall, and the large hard-backed front sports seats mean space is at premium both width-wise and for legs. With an 8 year old, a 6 year old and a 3 year old I need to fit a forward facing child seat and booster seat in the back. And whilst these seats will fit (just), and still leave enough room for the eldest child in the middle, there’s just not enough room for comfortable long-distance travelling. No problem in the M5 with plenty of room in the back for three.
Cabin technology is an area where the more modern AMG clearly wins. The sat-nav is much better and faster in the C63. Then there are the very nice safety features such as distance control to the car in front, and visible indicators (red triangle) in the wing mirrors if a car is in a potential blind spot. In contrast the i-drive on the late-2007 M5 feels clunky, and the sat-nav like something from almost a different age.
Verdict
These are two very special cars and owning either is a privilege. For my needs – something I use weekends only and which can comfortably fit a family of five, yet still be a delight to drive when pressing on – the M5 is still the car of choice. But I could easily understand how someone with slightly different needs could choose the AMG in preference, particularly as an everyday proposition where the better gearbox and torquier V8 engine might become key differentiators. Come Sunday afternoon and I was quite sad to hand the AMG back, and could certainly see myself owning a C63 one day.
Engine
The engines in both cars are masterpieces in their own right. Start them up and it’s the C63 which is immediately the more charismatic with a deep gruff bark through the quad tail pipes. In contrast, starting the M5 is something of an anti-climax if you’ve psyched yourself up for immediate aural delights from the V10: the M car needs to be moving, and with some revs dialled in before its sound starts to please.
On the move in the AMG and it’s the sound and the torque from that hand built V8 which leave the most lasting memory. Accelerate hard from low a rolling start, and you’re pinned back in your seat, almost swearing your cheeks are being pulled back “rocket take-off” style as you revel in the sound of that wonderful V8. Power delivery is constant and linear, and doesn’t noticeably taper off even close to the 7200rpm red-line. It’s an addictive experience, and impossible not to laugh out loud and murmur “f*** this thing is fast” expletives under your breath.
The M5 on the other hand needs to be worked harder to make the same level of progress. But when you do, you’re rewarded with a higher-pitched but no less intoxicating V10 howl, and acceleration which is ballistic as the needle sweeps through the last 2-3k rpm towards the 8250rpm red-line. Which is ultimately faster? It really is too close to call. Balls out, wringing every last rev from the engine, I suspect the M5 might have the edge, especially at higher speeds. But for real-world usability when you’re not in the mood, you’d make swifter progress in the AMG.
Transmission
The transmission in the M5 attracts more than its fair share of criticism for being unrefined and jerky. Whilst there’s an element of truth in this – especially on full bore max-rpm upshifts in P500S mode - once you learn the nuances of the SMG-III box it really is possible to make smooth fast progress, both on the open road and around town.
But, get into the AMG and it’s still clear that the game has moved on. The MCT box is incredibly smooth on both downshift and max-attack upshift. It has 4 regular modes: comfort, sport, sport-plus and manual, plus RS: the latter is a mode for launch control starts, which out of respect for others property, I didn’t try. It’s eager to kick down and play, especially in the sport modes.
Maybe it’s because of the advances in transmission technology, or maybe it’s because of some other facet of the car, but despite it being a manual box it still feels much more natural to drive the AMG in auto mode. This is never the case with the M5, which is in manual mode before it’s left the garage.
Anyone with an other-half who dislikes driving the M5 because of the gearbox (like my wife) could find a good companion in the C63. It took a bit of cajoling to persuade Mrs Hedgeman to get behind the wheel as she was nervous about driving somebody-elses-60k-car, but 30 miles later she parked up next to my M5, got out of the Merc and said “I love it, that car is just sooo good to drive”.
Brakes
For road use, both cars offer strong progressive brakes. How they fare on a track with the kinetic energy of 2 tons moving at high speed to dissipate might be a different matter, but driven within the bounds of common-sense on the public highway, neither offer any cause for complaint.
Ride and Handling
Considering they’re fairly extreme sporting machinery, both cars ride well. The M5 with its dampers set to “comfort” offers the most cossetting ride over badly pock-marked roads and speed bumps, but you wouldn’t reject one over the other on comfort grounds alone. But get out of town and onto twisty A/B roads and some starker differences do start to appear. Whilst both cars hide their weight well, and feel agile for 2 ton beasts, it’s the M5 which does a noticeably better job of remaining fleet of foot when pressing on. In contrast, the C63 feels that bit more wooden in its responses.
Interior
Open the drivers door of the AMG and you’re greeted with very heavily bolstered front sports seats and a sporty looking half leather / half alcantara angular steering wheel. The seats are comfortable, though perhaps a little on the tight side for anyone with a larger frame. The driving position is good with a multitude of adjustments available to both seat and wheel. But once you’ve lived with the car for a little while, you do start to notice some of the less than top-notch fine detail. In particular, the quality of some of the plastics and the headlining feel decidedly low rent for such an expensive car car, and you can’t help but feel that a large portion of the £60k price is paying for what’s upfront under the bonnet.
The cabin on the M5 is a little less overtly sporting, but ultimately more comfortable and the quality of materials that bit higher. It’s the subtle details you appreciate here: multi-coloured M stitching on the thick leather wheel, the 8250rpm red-line and the like. And once you’re used to the head-up display on the M5, you do feel a little cheated driving anything without.
Rear seat accommodation – an important factor for me –is vastly better in the M5. In the AMG, the combination of it being a smaller car overall, and the large hard-backed front sports seats mean space is at premium both width-wise and for legs. With an 8 year old, a 6 year old and a 3 year old I need to fit a forward facing child seat and booster seat in the back. And whilst these seats will fit (just), and still leave enough room for the eldest child in the middle, there’s just not enough room for comfortable long-distance travelling. No problem in the M5 with plenty of room in the back for three.
Cabin technology is an area where the more modern AMG clearly wins. The sat-nav is much better and faster in the C63. Then there are the very nice safety features such as distance control to the car in front, and visible indicators (red triangle) in the wing mirrors if a car is in a potential blind spot. In contrast the i-drive on the late-2007 M5 feels clunky, and the sat-nav like something from almost a different age.
Verdict
These are two very special cars and owning either is a privilege. For my needs – something I use weekends only and which can comfortably fit a family of five, yet still be a delight to drive when pressing on – the M5 is still the car of choice. But I could easily understand how someone with slightly different needs could choose the AMG in preference, particularly as an everyday proposition where the better gearbox and torquier V8 engine might become key differentiators. Come Sunday afternoon and I was quite sad to hand the AMG back, and could certainly see myself owning a C63 one day.
Nice write up.
I tried and almost purchased an E63AMG saloon, which sounds very similar to the C63 you describe. Ultimately the decisive factors in going for another M5 for me were;
- the Merc felt a little more 'old man' if you understand me, both in feel and brand
- the Merc dealer was a shambles, made my local BMW appear amazing
Not very much in it really and I think it comes down to personal choice as both cars are great.
S
I tried and almost purchased an E63AMG saloon, which sounds very similar to the C63 you describe. Ultimately the decisive factors in going for another M5 for me were;
- the Merc felt a little more 'old man' if you understand me, both in feel and brand
- the Merc dealer was a shambles, made my local BMW appear amazing
Not very much in it really and I think it comes down to personal choice as both cars are great.
S
[quote=Hedgeman]Rear seat accommodation – an important factor for me –is vastly better in the M5. In the AMG, the combination of it being a smaller car overall, and the large hard-backed front sports seats mean space is at premium both width-wise and for legs. With an 8 year old, a 6 year old and a 3 year old I need to fit a forward facing child seat and booster seat in the back. And whilst these seats will fit (just), and still leave enough room for the eldest child in the middle, there’s just not enough room for comfortable long-distance travelling. No problem in the M5 with plenty of room in the back for three.
Nice write up - in relation to the back seat space we also have a 5 series taking care of the family transport duties (and exactly the same seating arrangement). We strugle to fit our kids in it; my 8 year old just about squeezes between the 2 car seats. That said rather this than drive an mpv!
Nice write up - in relation to the back seat space we also have a 5 series taking care of the family transport duties (and exactly the same seating arrangement). We strugle to fit our kids in it; my 8 year old just about squeezes between the 2 car seats. That said rather this than drive an mpv!
magnum555 said:
Excellent review thanks for sharing. Wouldn't the E63 have been a better comparison in terms of size?
I thought that, but........ Probably best to compare the C63 and the M5 at the moment as prices are roughly the same, unless you were to compare the M5 with the previous shape E AMG which was intended as its direct rival but that comparison has been done to death with BMW coming out on top every time. The only other car to be compared with the C63 would be the B7 RS4 Avant but thats old hat now (and quite slow lol) and as there wont be an M3 Tourer as a direct alternative there is no point looking at BMW for inspiration. Hence, probably the best comparison against the M5 currently is the C63 based on shape, performance and price. New Merc E63 AMG only really has the RS6 Avant to look up to as BMW WILL NOT be knocking out any F10 M5 Tourers.Eddie
Fantastic write-up of 2 cars I'm also looking at (would have been nice if you'd had an RS4 Avant for a bit too!).
I'd be interesting to understand a bit more around relative running costs of these cars too. I'm not averse to high servicing & maintenance bills as such but I'm now consolidating down to 1 car, which means the missus will be using it during the week for work..... which is a 20 mile round trip through slowish town-type traffic.
She used to moan a bloody bucket full about the amount of petrol she'd have to put in the M3 & 911 (c.22mpg), which I then semi rescued by getting a GTI for her and the dog - which was signficantly better.
I could probably get away with something on par with the the 911 - but these both seem signifcantly worse in slow traffic (mid teens??), which to be frank would mean I'd probably have to subsidise her petrol!!!!
Also, how many miles are people getting out of the rears on these - I've heard the C63 can barely leave the drive without needing a net set of boots! M5 any better?
Cheers
RS
I'd be interesting to understand a bit more around relative running costs of these cars too. I'm not averse to high servicing & maintenance bills as such but I'm now consolidating down to 1 car, which means the missus will be using it during the week for work..... which is a 20 mile round trip through slowish town-type traffic.
She used to moan a bloody bucket full about the amount of petrol she'd have to put in the M3 & 911 (c.22mpg), which I then semi rescued by getting a GTI for her and the dog - which was signficantly better.
I could probably get away with something on par with the the 911 - but these both seem signifcantly worse in slow traffic (mid teens??), which to be frank would mean I'd probably have to subsidise her petrol!!!!
Also, how many miles are people getting out of the rears on these - I've heard the C63 can barely leave the drive without needing a net set of boots! M5 any better?
Cheers
RS
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