M5 Tourer vs mapped 535d Tourer shocker!

[ecain63]

Today i got a bit of a shock! This morning i met up with a fellow PHer and his mate to convoy up to Silverstone for the Ferrari SS. They turned up in a 535d Tourer (mapped) and as you do, we compared odds and sods before setting off. We sat at a steady cruise until we got to the M40 Northbound where i decided it was time to have a little play.

Result: Even though there was no doubt the M5 was significantly quicker the margin between the two cars was a lot less than i could have imagined.

Now im home and having averaged 19mpg over 240 miles today im asking myself if the M5 is really worth the extra expense. The only thing keeping me going is the sound of that V10 and its superior handling. A mapped 850bhp RS6 might be my only hope if these dervs get any faster.

[mmm-five]

ecain63 said:

Today i got a bit of a shock! This morning i met up with a fellow PHer and his mate to convoy up to Silverstone for the Ferrari SS. They turned up in a 535d Tourer (mapped) and as you do, we compared odds and sods before setting off. We sat at a steady cruise until we got to the M40 Northbound where i decided it was time to have a little play.

Result: Even though there was no doubt the M5 was significantly quicker the margin between the two cars was a lot less than i could have imagined.

Now im home and having averaged 19mpg over 240 miles today im asking myself if the M5 is really worth the extra expense. The only thing keeping me going is the sound of that V10 and its superior handling. A mapped 850bhp RS6 might be my only hope if these dervs get any faster.

Just remember that your transmission/diff/driveshafts will take the power of the V10 all day long, whereas the 535D with the torque limiter removed will break one of them within 10,000 miles and BMW will tell the owner to FRO when they come to claim a warranty repair.

Anyway, you could always strap a supercharger on your's

[rassi]

This was the exact reason I sold my E39 M5 last year, as the cost of maintaining an increasingly smaller accelerative advantage over various TDIs didn't compute any more. Hence why I went through a quick succession of MB C220 (horrid engine and 5 speed auto) and X3 35D (great engine and better 6 speed auto) in the last 12 months.

But ultimately even the X3 got boring, and lacking that intimate driver interface that a truely great car has. So, I am back in an M5 (E60 this time) and even if this means that my MPG will be 50 % worse, road tax a whopping 2400 euro rather than 800 euro, my passion is cars. At present I am willing to pay that, and even if there is no discernible difference at normal motorway speeds between say a 535D and an M5, the M5 is an occasion every single time you drive it - the 535d is not, even if it is a good car. The torque monster TDIs are generally one trick ponies and not something you would take out an early Sunday morning on your favourite road.

You will always find a faster car than yours, but it is also about how your car communicates with you, the sounds it makes, the many small details that makes it special. If the M5 Tourer doesn't check these boxes anymore, time to move on.

[ecain63]

Said blast from the eyes of the 535d: Actually, from their angle the M5 leaves quite a gap, more so than i remembered in my mirrors. Sounds good too.

http://s532.photobucket.com/albums/ee321/Neil-dm5/...

[R5YUP]

rassi said:

But ultimately even the X3 got boring, and lacking that intimate driver interface that a truely great car has. So, I am back in an M5 (E60 this time) and even if this means that my MPG will be 50 % worse, road tax a whopping 2400 euro rather than 800 euro, my passion is cars. At present I am willing to pay that, and even if there is no discernible difference at normal motorway speeds between say a 535D and an M5, the M5 is an occasion every single time you drive it - the 535d is not, even if it is a good car. The torque monster TDIs are generally one trick ponies and not something you would take out an early Sunday morning on your favourite road.

You will always find a faster car than yours, but it is also about how your car communicates with you, the sounds it makes, the many small details that makes it special. If the M5 Tourer doesn't check these boxes anymore, time to move on.

Yep exactly. Having to address cash calls for my wedding I sold a C2S that I'd had for 3 years and loved. I still have a 330i mSport Touring for the labrador - but as superb as this car is, it's far from 'special'. And that's the thing with Porsches and M cars..... They're special..... and sometimes you don't realise that until they're gone......

I miss them big time. Don't do it!!

What's worse is that now I'm finding it doubly difficult to justify getting back into something nice, which means I'm still fannying around trying to work out what to buy next and committing to it...... Agghhh!

[DanX5]

You pulled well clear in short run and presumably the m5 performance at non-legal speeds would give greater margin?

I guess that the 535d with map has ability to pull like a train though, so presumably quite easy to catch the m5 on the hop if m5 not in right gear / revs?

Console yourself in the fact the you are driving an estate with a v10 which is quite frankly bonkers!

Got a car fund burning a hole in pocket at the moment and been looking for the 'right' late plate e61 m5 or a c63 ppp estate but both are thin on the ground. Pretty sure prices of both have firmed up, and to be honest the m5 looks comparatively better value and loved the one that I test drove, just concerned that not so practical as c63 and dare I say it more 'fragile'.

Looked at the autocar roadtest reports and whilst c63 (no ppp) quicker to 60, the m5 gets ahead once into 3 figures..

Decisions, decisions!!

[cheddar]

ecain63 said:

Said blast from the eyes of the 535d: Actually, from their angle the M5 leaves quite a gap, more so than i remembered in my mirrors. Sounds good too.

http://s532.photobucket.com/albums/ee321/Neil-dm5/...

You mullered that diesel.

[ecain63]

DanX5 said:

You pulled well clear in short run and presumably the m5 performance at non-legal speeds would give greater margin?

I guess that the 535d with map has ability to pull like a train though, so presumably quite easy to catch the m5 on the hop if m5 not in right gear / revs?

Console yourself in the fact the you are driving an estate with a v10 which is quite frankly bonkers!

Got a car fund burning a hole in pocket at the moment and been looking for the 'right' late plate e61 m5 or a c63 ppp estate but both are thin on the ground. Pretty sure prices of both have firmed up, and to be honest the m5 looks comparatively better value and loved the one that I test drove, just concerned that not so practical as c63 and dare I say it more 'fragile'.

Looked at the autocar roadtest reports and whilst c63 (no ppp) quicker to 60, the m5 gets ahead once into 3 figures..

Decisions, decisions!!

I wouldnt say the M5 is that fragile to be honest. If well looked after its pretty bomb proof. Gearbox is very strong, engines are really strong and the build is more than up to the job of lasting the term. That said, ive read that the AMG can literally be driven into the ground and it'll still run fine.

[Contigo]

ecain63 said:

Said blast from the eyes of the 535d: Actually, from their angle the M5 leaves quite a gap, more so than i remembered in my mirrors. Sounds good too.

http://s532.photobucket.com/albums/ee321/Neil-dm5/...

Jeez Eddie you raped the 535d! Honestly if you think he had anything on you then keep watching that. Remember the old "objects in the rear view mirror may appear...". Keep the V10, he will only be think the opposite to you and that is that he wanted an M5. If he drives like that all the time he will be averaging low 20's too!

[Terminator X]

Mmm V10 vs dirty diesel, not really a tough choice diesels are fast in any gear of course but get a decent performance car in the right gear and none of them stand a chance.

TX.

[metsta]

special cars indeed, cost more but worth more and life is for living. in the past week or so i have transported about £1000 worth of wood from Wickes on the roof of the M5, its been a great work horse. 2 adults / 3 kids to holland a few weeks ago ws awesome, i thought that my old D4 was the ultimate family car, and the cayenne turbo i had was the best uber family wagon, wrong. the e61 m5 is the answer. so much so the 911 isnt getting any miles at all. keep it!

[AreOut]

I can't see anything shocking there, mapped 535i with LPG would be a little faster than 535d and still be more economical.

[ecain63]

As i said, it looks better from his angle, 'objects in the rear view mirror etc.....'. The 5 stays!!

[StuH]

I'm surprised at you of all people ecain! I came from a mapped 535D to the M5.

Great all-round car that the 535d was, at the end of the day it's just dull, and once the novelty of the torque wears off its just not an M in any way. Plus I averaged mid 20's MPG.

You have to make the most of cars like the e60/61 whilst you still can. 10 years from now nothing like them will exist.

[0836whimper]

For the millionth time, the 'greatness' of a car is not measured by it's ability to keep ahead of TDI's on a dual carriageway.
Who cares if a 535d is quicker than an M car in a straight line. Doesn't make your M5 less special and fun to drive.
Handling, throttle response, sound, all part of the X factor. It's many many car lengths ahead by those measurements.

I once had a 330d and was tempted to map it. Then bought an M3 and the penny dropped forever.

[cheddar]

0836whimper said:

For the millionth time, the 'greatness' of a car is not measured by it's ability to keep ahead of TDI's on a dual carriageway.
Who cares if a 535d is quicker than an M car in a straight line. Doesn't make your M5 less special and fun to drive.
Handling, throttle response, sound, all part of the X factor. It's many many car lengths ahead by those measurements.

I once had a 330d and was tempted to map it. Then bought an M3 and the penny dropped forever.

Coming from a Honda S2000 to a 123d, I did the opposite.

Horses courses etc.......

[Alpinestars]

cheddar said:

Coming from a Honda S2000 to a 123d, I did the opposite.

Horses courses etc.......

That's probably because the S2000 is one of the most overrated (pause for thought, is it actually rated at all?) ever.

[AreOut]

actually its the roadster with highest quality and fun ever possible for that amount of money

[cheddar]

AreOut said:

actually its the roadster with highest quality and fun ever possible for that amount of money

I dare say that the fun per pound roadster accolade would go to the MX5.

S2000 might have had that extraordinary 9000rpm 120 bhp/litre engine and whipcrack gearchange but everything else - cabin, chassis, steering, packaging - was mediocre.

Back on topic - the 5 series Touring combination of big capacity force fed derv or twangy high revving M5 power is compelling either way, brilliant all rounders the pair of them.

[Diderot]

cheddar said:

ecain63 said:

Said blast from the eyes of the 535d: Actually, from their angle the M5 leaves quite a gap, more so than i remembered in my mirrors. Sounds good too.

http://s532.photobucket.com/albums/ee321/Neil-dm5/...

You mullered that diesel.