How good is an E46 CS compared to the regular M3 and CSL?
Discussion
kazino said:
Does anyone have first hand experience of one of these rare beasts?
I've said it before and I'll say it again: the e46 CS is the best all-rounder I've owned. It's better than a standard e46 M3 in a few small ways, which add up to a noticeable difference, but not as focussed as a CSL - and subsequently is more usable as a daily driver.
kazino said:
Does anyone have first hand experience of one of these rare beasts?
What do you want it for? I've owned a CS and driven standard M3's and CSL's.
As a daily driver the little tweaks on a CS add up to a much better drive than the standard M3 without any compromises.
The CSL is significantly better than the CS as a driving tool but IMO too harsh for a daily driver.
I am very blessed to have a M3 CS Coupe with a BMW Manual Gearbox :-). The M3 CS over the regular E46 M3 Coupe has
M3 CSL steering rack; M3 CSL brake discs; M3 CSL steering whee in alcantra / suede; M3 CSL handbrake in Alcantra / suede; M-Track mode
I have driving experience of a regular E46 M3 Coupe which my old man used to have as a company car from 2004 - 2007 which has SMGII Drive Logic. The M3 CS has sharper steering, certainly feels more special partly due to its rarity as there are under 241 produced by BMW UK and based on the very excellent regular E46 M3 Coupe. I would highly recommend as an everyday car or just as a weekend toy (which is what I have mine for though you may want to consider the M3 CSL in that case). Compared to the regular M3 the M3 CS has better brakes but I haven't noticed much difference partly because my brake discs are quite worn.
The M3 CS so certainly feels special to me, very rare, great for everyday driving or weekend toy and can certainly give 996 Carrera 2s and other exotics a run for their money. Certainly doesn't feel out of place in expensive areas of London such as Kensington and Chelsea. In saying that you could easily with a little bit of savvy take a regular M3 Coupe and get the parts retrofitted to M3 CS spec but you would need to have a cheap M3 to begin with as is about £2-3k in parts to get up to spec.
I have to say the M3 CSL is my dream car. I would say if you want a weekend toy well worth considering. Doesn't have the everyday practicality of M3 or M3 CS .... Fixed bucket seats, light weight boot interior foam or whatever it is, noisy (but that's a good thing) .... Higher cost of CSL parts such as carbon fibre front splitters etc .... I had the pleasure of a test drive in a CSL once and didn't think it was loud enough but tbh was a while ago and I think the drive was not king enough. Have only ever heard good things about the M3 CSL.
Weekend toy toss up between M3 CSL and M3 CS though M3 CSL is feels special because so many changes over the regular M3 Coupe. M3 CS Coupe borrows a few parts from the M3 CSL but is what the M3 Coupe should have been from the outset according to some sources and is very highly rated by Evo :-)
Everyday car toss up between M3 Coupe and M3 CS. The standard M3 Coupe is very capable and highly rated though too.
Hope this may be of help to you :-)
M3 CSL steering rack; M3 CSL brake discs; M3 CSL steering whee in alcantra / suede; M3 CSL handbrake in Alcantra / suede; M-Track mode
I have driving experience of a regular E46 M3 Coupe which my old man used to have as a company car from 2004 - 2007 which has SMGII Drive Logic. The M3 CS has sharper steering, certainly feels more special partly due to its rarity as there are under 241 produced by BMW UK and based on the very excellent regular E46 M3 Coupe. I would highly recommend as an everyday car or just as a weekend toy (which is what I have mine for though you may want to consider the M3 CSL in that case). Compared to the regular M3 the M3 CS has better brakes but I haven't noticed much difference partly because my brake discs are quite worn.
The M3 CS so certainly feels special to me, very rare, great for everyday driving or weekend toy and can certainly give 996 Carrera 2s and other exotics a run for their money. Certainly doesn't feel out of place in expensive areas of London such as Kensington and Chelsea. In saying that you could easily with a little bit of savvy take a regular M3 Coupe and get the parts retrofitted to M3 CS spec but you would need to have a cheap M3 to begin with as is about £2-3k in parts to get up to spec.
I have to say the M3 CSL is my dream car. I would say if you want a weekend toy well worth considering. Doesn't have the everyday practicality of M3 or M3 CS .... Fixed bucket seats, light weight boot interior foam or whatever it is, noisy (but that's a good thing) .... Higher cost of CSL parts such as carbon fibre front splitters etc .... I had the pleasure of a test drive in a CSL once and didn't think it was loud enough but tbh was a while ago and I think the drive was not king enough. Have only ever heard good things about the M3 CSL.
Weekend toy toss up between M3 CSL and M3 CS though M3 CSL is feels special because so many changes over the regular M3 Coupe. M3 CS Coupe borrows a few parts from the M3 CSL but is what the M3 Coupe should have been from the outset according to some sources and is very highly rated by Evo :-)
Everyday car toss up between M3 Coupe and M3 CS. The standard M3 Coupe is very capable and highly rated though too.
Hope this may be of help to you :-)
thepony said:
I am very blessed to have a M3 CS Coupe with a BMW Manual Gearbox :-). The M3 CS over the regular E46 M3 Coupe has
M3 CSL steering rack; M3 CSL brake discs; M3 CSL steering whee in alcantra / suede; M3 CSL handbrake in Alcantra / suede; M-Track mode
I have driving experience of a regular E46 M3 Coupe which my old man used to have as a company car from 2004 - 2007 which has SMGII Drive Logic. The M3 CS has sharper steering, certainly feels more special partly due to its rarity as there are under 241 produced by BMW UK and based on the very excellent regular E46 M3 Coupe. I would highly recommend as an everyday car or just as a weekend toy (which is what I have mine for though you may want to consider the M3 CSL in that case). Compared to the regular M3 the M3 CS has better brakes but I haven't noticed much difference partly because my brake discs are quite worn.
The M3 CS so certainly feels special to me, very rare, great for everyday driving or weekend toy and can certainly give 996 Carrera 2s and other exotics a run for their money. Certainly doesn't feel out of place in expensive areas of London such as Kensington and Chelsea. In saying that you could easily with a little bit of savvy take a regular M3 Coupe and get the parts retrofitted to M3 CS spec but you would need to have a cheap M3 to begin with as is about £2-3k in parts to get up to spec.
I have to say the M3 CSL is my dream car. I would say if you want a weekend toy well worth considering. Doesn't have the everyday practicality of M3 or M3 CS .... Fixed bucket seats, light weight boot interior foam or whatever it is, noisy (but that's a good thing) .... Higher cost of CSL parts such as carbon fibre front splitters etc .... I had the pleasure of a test drive in a CSL once and didn't think it was loud enough but tbh was a while ago and I think the drive was not king enough. Have only ever heard good things about the M3 CSL.
Weekend toy toss up between M3 CSL and M3 CS though M3 CSL is feels special because so many changes over the regular M3 Coupe. M3 CS Coupe borrows a few parts from the M3 CSL but is what the M3 Coupe should have been from the outset according to some sources and is very highly rated by Evo :-)
Everyday car toss up between M3 Coupe and M3 CS. The standard M3 Coupe is very capable and highly rated though too.
Hope this may be of help to you :-)
How loud do you want your car? A CSL is certainly pretty high up on the dB scaleM3 CSL steering rack; M3 CSL brake discs; M3 CSL steering whee in alcantra / suede; M3 CSL handbrake in Alcantra / suede; M-Track mode
I have driving experience of a regular E46 M3 Coupe which my old man used to have as a company car from 2004 - 2007 which has SMGII Drive Logic. The M3 CS has sharper steering, certainly feels more special partly due to its rarity as there are under 241 produced by BMW UK and based on the very excellent regular E46 M3 Coupe. I would highly recommend as an everyday car or just as a weekend toy (which is what I have mine for though you may want to consider the M3 CSL in that case). Compared to the regular M3 the M3 CS has better brakes but I haven't noticed much difference partly because my brake discs are quite worn.
The M3 CS so certainly feels special to me, very rare, great for everyday driving or weekend toy and can certainly give 996 Carrera 2s and other exotics a run for their money. Certainly doesn't feel out of place in expensive areas of London such as Kensington and Chelsea. In saying that you could easily with a little bit of savvy take a regular M3 Coupe and get the parts retrofitted to M3 CS spec but you would need to have a cheap M3 to begin with as is about £2-3k in parts to get up to spec.
I have to say the M3 CSL is my dream car. I would say if you want a weekend toy well worth considering. Doesn't have the everyday practicality of M3 or M3 CS .... Fixed bucket seats, light weight boot interior foam or whatever it is, noisy (but that's a good thing) .... Higher cost of CSL parts such as carbon fibre front splitters etc .... I had the pleasure of a test drive in a CSL once and didn't think it was loud enough but tbh was a while ago and I think the drive was not king enough. Have only ever heard good things about the M3 CSL.
Weekend toy toss up between M3 CSL and M3 CS though M3 CSL is feels special because so many changes over the regular M3 Coupe. M3 CS Coupe borrows a few parts from the M3 CSL but is what the M3 Coupe should have been from the outset according to some sources and is very highly rated by Evo :-)
Everyday car toss up between M3 Coupe and M3 CS. The standard M3 Coupe is very capable and highly rated though too.
Hope this may be of help to you :-)
Don't worry about the "lightweight boot" either, another Clarkson myth that it can't hold any shopping. In saying that though, I'd agree with others that if you want a daily, get a standard M3 or CS. If you want a weekend toy, then buy a CSL
Leins said:
How loud do you want your car? A CSL is certainly pretty high up on the dB scale
Don't worry about the "lightweight boot" either, another Clarkson myth that it can't hold any shopping. In saying that though, I'd agree with others that if you want a daily, get a standard M3 or CS. If you want a weekend toy, then buy a CSL
Would be very nice to hear it reverberate through tunnels, bridges, narrow streets, etc would be how loud I would want it.Don't worry about the "lightweight boot" either, another Clarkson myth that it can't hold any shopping. In saying that though, I'd agree with others that if you want a daily, get a standard M3 or CS. If you want a weekend toy, then buy a CSL
I have a M3 CS Coupe, E46 323Ci Coupe and a E30 325i Sport Tech1.
Ironically the E30 is louder than the M3 ....
thepony said:
Would be very nice to hear it reverberate through tunnels, bridges, narrow streets, etc would be how loud I would want it.
I have a M3 CS Coupe, E46 323Ci Coupe and a E30 325i Sport Tech1.
Ironically the E30 is louder than the M3 ....
My E30 isn't particularly quiet, but the CSL can stop streets of people in their tracks if that's your thing. If it's just crawling along at low revs then it's not too bad, but then the SMG can get in a bit of a strop. I tend not to take it through city centres if I can help itI have a M3 CS Coupe, E46 323Ci Coupe and a E30 325i Sport Tech1.
Ironically the E30 is louder than the M3 ....
Pretty sure my M3 is louder than a CSL (not in a good way) and is SMG, and I'm not sure what you mean. The gearbox is fine for slow driving around town, and my car has never stopped streets unless I've been giving it the beans.
I wonder if I find life with the SMG easier because it's always in manual mode.
I wonder if I find life with the SMG easier because it's always in manual mode.
Leins said:
thepony said:
Would be very nice to hear it reverberate through tunnels, bridges, narrow streets, etc would be how loud I would want it.
I have a M3 CS Coupe, E46 323Ci Coupe and a E30 325i Sport Tech1.
Ironically the E30 is louder than the M3 ....
My E30 isn't particularly quiet, but the CSL can stop streets of people in their tracks if that's your thing. If it's just crawling along at low revs then it's not too bad, but then the SMG can get in a bit of a strop. I tend not to take it through city centres if I can help itI have a M3 CS Coupe, E46 323Ci Coupe and a E30 325i Sport Tech1.
Ironically the E30 is louder than the M3 ....
Leins said:
My E30 isn't particularly quiet, but the CSL can stop streets of people in their tracks if that's your thing. If it's just crawling along at low revs then it's not too bad, but then the SMG can get in a bit of a strop. I tend not to take it through city centres if I can help it
Has ur M3 CSL got a standard exhaust ?My E30 has some aftermarket exhaust and maybe the muffles in back box are worn out to give u some idea .... Of why is loud and reverberates a lot
The M3 CS gets a few glances when giving it some throttle from an aural point of view but has no where near the reverb of the E30 underneath a narrow bridge say. The M3 CS has a standard exhaust ....
I driven SMGII on a regular E46 M3 Coupe around town and have no real issues with it. I used to use Manual mode 99.9% of the time, Sport mode usually off for smoother driving and less kangarooing .... I was fine with gear changes .... I never liked any of the auto modes .... But thought SMGII was more fun going fast .... Where Manual Gearbox is more fun over a broad range of conditions such as driving fast and driving slow ....
For the record to the previous poster the M3 CSL is supposed to be much much louder than M3 or M3 CS Coupe because of the induction noise I believe rather than the exhaust ....
Edited by thepony on Tuesday 20th November 02:56
thepony said:
Has ur M3 CSL got a standard exhaust ?
My E30 has some aftermarket exhaust and maybe the muffles in back box are worn out to give u some idea .... Of why is loud and reverberates a lot
The M3 CS gets a few glances when giving it some throttle from an aural point of view but has no where near the reverb of the E30 underneath a narrow bridge say. The M3 CS has a standard exhaust ....
I driven SMGII on a regular E46 M3 Coupe around town and have no real issues with it. I used to use Manual mode 99.9% of the time, Sport mode usually off for smoother driving and less kangarooing .... I was fine with gear changes .... I never liked any of the auto modes .... But thought SMGII was more fun going fast .... Where Manual Gearbox is more fun over a broad range of conditions such as driving fast and driving slow ....
For the record to the previous poster the M3 CSL is supposed to be much much louder than M3 or M3 CS Coupe because of the induction noise I believe rather than the exhaust ....
Yep, car is standard, but that's a different exhaust set-up to the normal M3, plus there's no MAF. SMGII in the CSL runs different software settings to a standard M3 too I believe. Always use manual in S4-S6 when warm with Sport on for better throttle response, but it's just not a car that's particularly happy around town, especially having to deal with traffic, speed ramps, etc.My E30 has some aftermarket exhaust and maybe the muffles in back box are worn out to give u some idea .... Of why is loud and reverberates a lot
The M3 CS gets a few glances when giving it some throttle from an aural point of view but has no where near the reverb of the E30 underneath a narrow bridge say. The M3 CS has a standard exhaust ....
I driven SMGII on a regular E46 M3 Coupe around town and have no real issues with it. I used to use Manual mode 99.9% of the time, Sport mode usually off for smoother driving and less kangarooing .... I was fine with gear changes .... I never liked any of the auto modes .... But thought SMGII was more fun going fast .... Where Manual Gearbox is more fun over a broad range of conditions such as driving fast and driving slow ....
For the record to the previous poster the M3 CSL is supposed to be much much louder than M3 or M3 CS Coupe because of the induction noise I believe rather than the exhaust ....
Edited by thepony on Tuesday 20th November 02:56
Edited by Leins on Tuesday 20th November 10:26
Go with the best possible M3 in your budget I would say unless you really want a CS for the rarity factor and the few extra items unique to the CS (I do and it just has to be in Interlagos Blue though!).
However, if I come across a really nice standard M3 I would still seriously consider that too.
However, if I come across a really nice standard M3 I would still seriously consider that too.
I've had 2 normal E46 M3's and currently own a CS.
The CS is just a bit more special than a cooking M3. I was sceptical at first. I focussed on what I was losing, cruise control, phone and stereo controls from the steering wheel, rather than what I was gaining. Initially the alcantara wheel was a little tacky (sorted with a steam clean) and the car didn't feel any quicker than a normal M3, but then neither does a CSL, in my experience.
However, little by little the overall package grew on me. The steering rack is more direct than a standard car and it feels so much better. The brakes, helped by braided hoses in my case, are about as good as standard M3 brakes get. The exhaust note seems a little harder edged which may be down to the headers (are they the same as a CSL?), but overall, it just feels like a great package.
I've owned some nice cars, but without a doubt, my CS is at the top of the list. It will be a sad day when it goes, but I'll have been chuffed to have owned such a fabulous car.
The CS is just a bit more special than a cooking M3. I was sceptical at first. I focussed on what I was losing, cruise control, phone and stereo controls from the steering wheel, rather than what I was gaining. Initially the alcantara wheel was a little tacky (sorted with a steam clean) and the car didn't feel any quicker than a normal M3, but then neither does a CSL, in my experience.
However, little by little the overall package grew on me. The steering rack is more direct than a standard car and it feels so much better. The brakes, helped by braided hoses in my case, are about as good as standard M3 brakes get. The exhaust note seems a little harder edged which may be down to the headers (are they the same as a CSL?), but overall, it just feels like a great package.
I've owned some nice cars, but without a doubt, my CS is at the top of the list. It will be a sad day when it goes, but I'll have been chuffed to have owned such a fabulous car.
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