Discussion
So having owned a 1M for 12 months i was kindly loaned an M135i for the day.I have to be honest and say that from everything i had read and heard i was a little bemused how BMW could offer this vehicle at such a relatively low price when it seemingly offered near 1M performance for a good 10k less.Im sure there were a few other 1M owners who may have felt the same.
Firstly let me make clear that it was never my intention to swap my 1M in for an M135i because personally i cannot abide the looks,i never liked the original 1 series breadvan and i certainly dont like this version either,not the prettiest thing around but then neither is the 1M,but what the 1M is is butch,and i like that,but thats just me and looks are a very personal thing.What i was really doing was trying to think ahead a little and imagine this engine/gearbox combo (the 8spd auto) in the 2 series coupe in 18 to 24 months time and at a similarish ie 30 to 35k ish price tag when i may be thinking of replacing my 1M after 3 years or so of ownership (altho im sure the 2M or M2 will be just around the corner then too just to cloud the issue.
Now unfortunately the loaner i had was a manual and i say unfortunately because honestly the way this car is it doesnt mate well with the manual imo,dont get me wrong its a good box,nothing wrong with it at all,its just that i cant help but feel that with the nature of this car it would lend itself much more to the 8spd flappy paddler.
The car is very electronic in feel by comparison to the 1M and for the softer much more everyday car that it is its all the better for it,hence why i feel the SMG would suit it even more.Even in sport plus mode this thing is way softer than a 1M,the engine power delivery is far more linear and progressive,it makes a nice sound but still as with the 1M a little too muted.And obviously its pretty rapid.It flows nicely and is damped very well for the crap UK roads that we have to contend with,it suffers the majority of surface horrors with great aplomb,steering feel is somewhat lacking with an artificial feel to it but well weighted.
On the day i had it it was cold and greasy but pushed hard mild understeer led the way leading into gently oversteer that was very controllable.You could feel the rubber and chassis flexing to let you lean on it through the bends,it probably inspired more confidence than the 1M in those conditions because its easier to drive.Its a great all round everyday package and i mean really great and for 30 k its an absolute bloody steal for a performance BMW. The only thing i didnt like was the slightly overly fussy cabin design,too much going on for my liking,yes the 1M is a bit boring inside but i just dont like all the different surface textures and raised angles everywhere.Also the whole cars feels narrow and long whereas the 1M feels almost square like around you.
But overall for me its just not exciting enough next to the 1M,on paper it seems closely matched but in reality they really are two very different cars.The 1M is so much more hardcore by comparison,in wet tricky conditions the M135i may well be faster on some roads but you wouldnt be having quite so much fun and in the dry the 1M is so pointy and sharp,next to the M135i it feels like a DTM racecar took a wrong turn off a track. The power delivery feels more brutal and it boosts harder especially when the overboost kicks in and you definitley feel the lack of throttle sharpness on the M135i compared to the M mode on the 1M.
On paper the performance difference is maybe only 5 to 10 % in terms of pure numbers but in the flesh it just feels so much more.The M135i is the better everyday car but
I bought my 1M for driver thrills and on that basis if these two vehicles had existed at my dealership on the sameday i would have signed for the 1M regardless of the price difference no questions asked.
Both great cars,just very different.
Firstly let me make clear that it was never my intention to swap my 1M in for an M135i because personally i cannot abide the looks,i never liked the original 1 series breadvan and i certainly dont like this version either,not the prettiest thing around but then neither is the 1M,but what the 1M is is butch,and i like that,but thats just me and looks are a very personal thing.What i was really doing was trying to think ahead a little and imagine this engine/gearbox combo (the 8spd auto) in the 2 series coupe in 18 to 24 months time and at a similarish ie 30 to 35k ish price tag when i may be thinking of replacing my 1M after 3 years or so of ownership (altho im sure the 2M or M2 will be just around the corner then too just to cloud the issue.
Now unfortunately the loaner i had was a manual and i say unfortunately because honestly the way this car is it doesnt mate well with the manual imo,dont get me wrong its a good box,nothing wrong with it at all,its just that i cant help but feel that with the nature of this car it would lend itself much more to the 8spd flappy paddler.
The car is very electronic in feel by comparison to the 1M and for the softer much more everyday car that it is its all the better for it,hence why i feel the SMG would suit it even more.Even in sport plus mode this thing is way softer than a 1M,the engine power delivery is far more linear and progressive,it makes a nice sound but still as with the 1M a little too muted.And obviously its pretty rapid.It flows nicely and is damped very well for the crap UK roads that we have to contend with,it suffers the majority of surface horrors with great aplomb,steering feel is somewhat lacking with an artificial feel to it but well weighted.
On the day i had it it was cold and greasy but pushed hard mild understeer led the way leading into gently oversteer that was very controllable.You could feel the rubber and chassis flexing to let you lean on it through the bends,it probably inspired more confidence than the 1M in those conditions because its easier to drive.Its a great all round everyday package and i mean really great and for 30 k its an absolute bloody steal for a performance BMW. The only thing i didnt like was the slightly overly fussy cabin design,too much going on for my liking,yes the 1M is a bit boring inside but i just dont like all the different surface textures and raised angles everywhere.Also the whole cars feels narrow and long whereas the 1M feels almost square like around you.
But overall for me its just not exciting enough next to the 1M,on paper it seems closely matched but in reality they really are two very different cars.The 1M is so much more hardcore by comparison,in wet tricky conditions the M135i may well be faster on some roads but you wouldnt be having quite so much fun and in the dry the 1M is so pointy and sharp,next to the M135i it feels like a DTM racecar took a wrong turn off a track. The power delivery feels more brutal and it boosts harder especially when the overboost kicks in and you definitley feel the lack of throttle sharpness on the M135i compared to the M mode on the 1M.
On paper the performance difference is maybe only 5 to 10 % in terms of pure numbers but in the flesh it just feels so much more.The M135i is the better everyday car but
I bought my 1M for driver thrills and on that basis if these two vehicles had existed at my dealership on the sameday i would have signed for the 1M regardless of the price difference no questions asked.
Both great cars,just very different.
Absolutely, but why the need to call it an M when it isn't? It's very obviously been designed to appeal to a wider audience who want a softer option than an M, that makes a better everyday car. Absolutely no problem with that, and the comments from buyers on this forum mention things like a good car for commuting, better option in London, good for dogs 
, etc... BUT M is supposed to be for the harder-edged, thrilling cars that ARE harder to live with, aren't designed to be used in traffic, are expensive to run, need effort (and revs!) to extract the best from, BUT owners are prepared to pay this price for the thrilling performance on offer when the opportunities arise. Personally the M135 leaves me cold, but then I like my cars be quick, edgy, noisy, and an event to drive, the V10 in the E60 is exhilarating in the same way the flat plane v8 was in my 355. For pootling around, my 535D was much easier than the M5 but that's too completely miss the point. I think BMW need to work on strengthening the M brand not diluting it. As the recent Autocar review of the M135 pointed out the M135 is much closer to a regular 1 series than it is to an M. So BMW stop milking the M!
, etc... BUT M is supposed to be for the harder-edged, thrilling cars that ARE harder to live with, aren't designed to be used in traffic, are expensive to run, need effort (and revs!) to extract the best from, BUT owners are prepared to pay this price for the thrilling performance on offer when the opportunities arise. Personally the M135 leaves me cold, but then I like my cars be quick, edgy, noisy, and an event to drive, the V10 in the E60 is exhilarating in the same way the flat plane v8 was in my 355. For pootling around, my 535D was much easier than the M5 but that's too completely miss the point. I think BMW need to work on strengthening the M brand not diluting it. As the recent Autocar review of the M135 pointed out the M135 is much closer to a regular 1 series than it is to an M. So BMW stop milking the M!StuH said:
Absolutely, but why the need to call it an M when it isn't? It's very obviously been designed to appeal to a wider audience who want a softer option than an M, that makes a better everyday car. Absolutely no problem with that, and the comments from buyers on this forum mention things like a good car for commuting, better option in London, good for dogs , etc... BUT M is supposed to be for the harder-edged, thrilling cars that ARE harder to live with, aren't designed to be used in traffic, are expensive to run, need effort (and revs!) to extract the best from, BUT owners are prepared to pay this price for the thrilling performance on offer when the opportunities arise. Personally the M135 leaves me cold, but then I like my cars be quick, edgy, noisy, and an event to drive, the V10 in the E60 is exhilarating in the same way the flat plane v8 was in my 355. For pootling around, my 535D was much easier than the M5 but that's too completely miss the point. I think BMW need to work on strengthening the M brand not diluting it. As the recent Autocar review of the M135 pointed out the M135 is much closer to a regular 1 series than it is to an M. So BMW stop milking the M!
I think you make a fair point but BMW are very smart in the fact they haven't actually come out to clearly state what the "M" stands for. In the past it was generally assumed that it stood for motorsport but as an ethos BMW haven't clearly outlined this which suits them. All sorts of people have an affinity for the "M" brand because they maybe looking for what you've stated about (hard, edgy, revvy etc) but I know others think of M as just the best, the pinnacle, the fastest, better than RS, the best road cars, the best road/track cars, wolf in sheeps clothing, luxury etc etc, etc... BUT M is supposed to be for the harder-edged, thrilling cars that ARE harder to live with, aren't designed to be used in traffic, are expensive to run, need effort (and revs!) to extract the best from, BUT owners are prepared to pay this price for the thrilling performance on offer when the opportunities arise. Personally the M135 leaves me cold, but then I like my cars be quick, edgy, noisy, and an event to drive, the V10 in the E60 is exhilarating in the same way the flat plane v8 was in my 355. For pootling around, my 535D was much easier than the M5 but that's too completely miss the point. I think BMW need to work on strengthening the M brand not diluting it. As the recent Autocar review of the M135 pointed out the M135 is much closer to a regular 1 series than it is to an M. So BMW stop milking the M!If BMW came out and defined what M stood for it might stop appealing to certain sectors of the market and that's why I think M at the moment just stands for great marketing. I personally don't care what it stands for as long as they keep making great cars like the 1M and M135i.
There is no confusion - M stands for Motorsport - http://www.bmw-motorsport.com/en/index.html
The M135 is just cynical marketing that appeals to the same people that put M badges on 318's. Those that don't understand the M heritage. It's the very opposite of being subtle and Q car. It's an attempt to be something it isn't - "fur coat and no knickers"
The M135 is undoubtedly a great car, and given it's price, great value for money, but it isn't an M. The 1M is an M as the OP very eloquently explained.
The M135 is just cynical marketing that appeals to the same people that put M badges on 318's. Those that don't understand the M heritage. It's the very opposite of being subtle and Q car. It's an attempt to be something it isn't - "fur coat and no knickers"
The M135 is undoubtedly a great car, and given it's price, great value for money, but it isn't an M. The 1M is an M as the OP very eloquently explained.
Ok then, yes M is for motorsport if you're taking it literally. In that case what exactly is motorsport about the 1M?
I love M cars and the whole heritage and yes M in the road car sense is fur coat and no knickers. I agree M cars are relatively more involving and visceral but a Clio cup or Integra R is arguably even more so, it doesn't mean any of these are race cars for the road deserving of any motorsport accolade.
I think the fact we're having this debate proves that "M" has contrasting meaning to different owners, if the ethos was set in stone BMW wouldn't have the balls to make an X5/6M(otorsport).
I love M cars and the whole heritage and yes M in the road car sense is fur coat and no knickers. I agree M cars are relatively more involving and visceral but a Clio cup or Integra R is arguably even more so, it doesn't mean any of these are race cars for the road deserving of any motorsport accolade.
I think the fact we're having this debate proves that "M" has contrasting meaning to different owners, if the ethos was set in stone BMW wouldn't have the balls to make an X5/6M(otorsport).
This whole M debate is a bit sad really.
I've ordered one. Not because it has M in the name but because for the money it simply can't be beaten. They could have called it Jeff and I'd still have bought one.
It isn't just a standard 1 series. It isn't an M Sport. It isn't an M car. So what is it?
I've ordered one. Not because it has M in the name but because for the money it simply can't be beaten. They could have called it Jeff and I'd still have bought one.
It isn't just a standard 1 series. It isn't an M Sport. It isn't an M car. So what is it?
Interesting that not so long ago threads regarding the 1M were saying that it shouldn't be classed as an M car as it was turbocharged. Obviously those that commented hadn't driven one.
I love my 1M which is also my daily driver, but appreciate the M135i as it looks like a remarkable achievement for the money
I love my 1M which is also my daily driver, but appreciate the M135i as it looks like a remarkable achievement for the money
t8cmf said:
Is the 1M classed as a "proper" M car?
I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
Because of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M1I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
I don't think it's considered a proper "M" car, but somewhere between an "M-Sport" version and an "M" car, but haven't read anything official about how it's placed so may be corrected.
craigb84 said:
This whole M debate is a bit sad really.
I've ordered one. Not because it has M in the name but because for the money it simply can't be beaten. They could have called it Jeff and I'd still have bought one.
It isn't just a standard 1 series. It isn't an M Sport. It isn't an M car. So what is it?
The best hot hatch on the market I've ordered one. Not because it has M in the name but because for the money it simply can't be beaten. They could have called it Jeff and I'd still have bought one.
It isn't just a standard 1 series. It isn't an M Sport. It isn't an M car. So what is it?
terryb said:
Interesting that not so long ago threads regarding the 1M were saying that it shouldn't be classed as an M car as it was turbocharged. Obviously those that commented hadn't driven one.
I love my 1M which is also my daily driver, but appreciate the M135i as it looks like a remarkable achievement for the money
Have to confess I was one of those. Just think M should be NA. However, rather than being guilty of something I hate seeing on PHeads, I went and got a test drive so that I'd driven a car I was criticizing! Of course, having driven one I now think they're great I love my 1M which is also my daily driver, but appreciate the M135i as it looks like a remarkable achievement for the money
.......and most definitely an M.StuH said:
Have to confess I was one of those. Just think M should be NA. However, rather than being guilty of something I hate seeing on PHeads, I went and got a test drive so that I'd driven a car I was criticizing! Of course, having driven one I now think they're great .......and most definitely an M.
Well said that man .......and most definitely an M.xr287 said:
t8cmf said:
Is the 1M classed as a "proper" M car?
I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
Because of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M1I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
I don't think it's considered a proper "M" car, but somewhere between an "M-Sport" version and an "M" car, but haven't read anything official about how it's placed so may be corrected.
Pugland53 said:
xr287 said:
t8cmf said:
Is the 1M classed as a "proper" M car?
I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
Because of this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BMW_M1I only ask as the M car monikers are M3, M5 and M6. Why is it 1M as opposed to M1?
I don't think it's considered a proper "M" car, but somewhere between an "M-Sport" version and an "M" car, but haven't read anything official about how it's placed so may be corrected.
From Autocar - "A halfway house. Nearly, but not quite, an M-car. A midway compromise between the standard range and a full-blown product.
That’s what the M135i looks like being on paper, and that’s what it turns out to be in practice: a car that retains the mainstream 1-series range’s sensible appeal, but with the wick turned up to cast a larger glow than you’d expect of a regular model.
This is a very entertaining and enjoyable car. It’s a compromise that works as well. This is an entertaining, enjoyable car.
Inevitably, however, the lack of bespoke M division engineering and components leaves the M135i feeling far more like a conventional BMW than an M product: of the two paths, the normal 1-series is the one to which the M135i remains closer.
Nevertheless, this is a fine driving companion and a car with both a spectacular set of performance numbers and a determinedly alluring price."
Edited by StuH on Sunday 2nd December 21:29
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