What is the best way to try an E46 M3 SMG?

[stuart-b]

I am looking to get an E46 M3 SMG (2003-2005) in the new year, but I am wondering what would be the best way to try it first? I don't want to rock up to a private buyer and expect them to let me drive it around.

I have never driven this model, having only driven tired old 320d/330d's in the E46 shape - which did not provide any indication how the M3 would be (I hope!).

I currently have an E92, and would probably keep this - so the M3 would be a weekend car.

There is also the chance I may work between two countries, 2 weeks on, 2 weeks off, so would have one car in each country.

I would consider the Z4M too but I think the M3 is a bit cheaper/more practical - Any ideas chaps?

[JsyM3]

Head to the classifieds and filter on "Trade" - They'll (hopefully) be less precious about it than a private seller so you should be able to take it out and get a better feel for it - Bare in mind the SMG takes some getting used to so have a good play with changing up at different revs and also with different "aggression" settings on the centre consol button. For the latter, most people stick to 4 or 5. I always drive mine in 5 as I want the fastest setting having come from a Golf GTI with a lovely DSG box.

Be sure to let it warm up properly too as it drives a bit cr@p until it's all up to temp. You'll notice the rev counter has a load of yellow lights around the outside which supposedly indicates the max you should rev until it's warmed up - These go out quite quickly but you'll notice the oil temp guage underneath won't have moved much. I find it's best to ignore the yellow lights and play safe (ie/ stay under 3.5-4k rpm) until the oil temp is up to about 90 (this is around the 11 o'clock position).

I just love how these are so Jekyll and Hyde - Below 4k rpm its a deep rumble, easy to use and live with. Above 4k rpm it rasps and begins to scream - Love love love

I bought mine in Jan this year after a lot of research so feel free to PM me if you have any questions

JsyM3

[jayemm89]

Stuart, where are you in the country?

My friend is selling his and would probably be happy to let you try it, or at least give you a very fair assessment of ownership/driving!

[stuart-b]

Thanks for the replies, Jay, will do.

I am not in the UK, but I may be 2 weeks a month within 6-12 months, not sure yet. I come back infrequently, but could arrange to try and get to an M3 meet in the summer.

Not looking to buy yet, planning for the backend of the year - but because I'm not often in the UK I have to plan very far in advance.

The E92 M3 is out of the question due to road tax and MPG - I can't justify a 4.0 V8!

[Leins]

JsyM3 said:

Head to the classifieds and filter on "Trade" - They'll (hopefully) be less precious about it than a private seller so you should be able to take it out and get a better feel for it - Bare in mind the SMG takes some getting used to so have a good play with changing up at different revs and also with different "aggression" settings on the centre consol button. For the latter, most people stick to 4 or 5. I always drive mine in 5 as I want the fastest setting having come from a Golf GTI with a lovely DSG box.

Be sure to let it warm up properly too as it drives a bit cr@p until it's all up to temp. You'll notice the rev counter has a load of yellow lights around the outside which supposedly indicates the max you should rev until it's warmed up - These go out quite quickly but you'll notice the oil temp guage underneath won't have moved much. I find it's best to ignore the yellow lights and play safe (ie/ stay under 3.5-4k rpm) until the oil temp is up to about 90 (this is around the 11 o'clock position).

I just love how these are so Jekyll and Hyde - Below 4k rpm its a deep rumble, easy to use and live with. Above 4k rpm it rasps and begins to scream - Love love love

I bought mine in Jan this year after a lot of research so feel free to PM me if you have any questions

JsyM3

Second fastest setting Although I wouldn't advise the OP to put it into S6 on a test drive!

[JsyM3]

Leins said:

Second fastest setting Although I wouldn't advise the OP to put it into S6 on a test drive!

Didn't want to overcomplicate matters by explaining the S6 option, and as you say, not advisable to use this on a test drive. S5 is brutal enough at full chat to give a good feel for how the SMG operates.

Although launch control off the dealership forecourt would be an entertaining way to start the test drive...

[Leins]

JsyM3 said:

Although launch control off the dealership forecourt would be an entertaining way to start the test drive...

Then throw the keys back to the dealer after and say "I think it's had a hard life!"


BTW OP, keep your foot in when changing in S5, and if it feels like there's a bit of a delay or you don't experience a bit of a thump out of it, then I would suggest it might be experiencing a bit of clutch slur. Easy enough fix, and not something I get as I disconnect the battery in mine quite frequently

Also, don't be expecting a nice smooth shift either, these aren't a DSG or autobox, it should almost feel like you're hurting the car in the higher shift speeds and takes a little bit of getting used to. Some people back off the accelerator to "help" avoid this sensation, but for me it's part of the appeal, and the car loves it

Edited by Leins on Monday 28th April 16:14

Edited by Leins on Monday 28th April 16:15

[JsyM3]

Leins said:

........of clutch slur. Easy enough fix, and not something I get as I disconnect the battery in mine quite frequently

Edited by Leins on Monday 28th April 16:15

Care to explain?? Is the clutch slur due to the "learning process" the gearbox does - In which case, doesn't the reset procedure (N, pull and hold + & -) sort this?

[Leins]

JsyM3 said:

Care to explain?? Is the clutch slur due to the "learning process" the gearbox does - In which case, doesn't the reset procedure (N, pull and hold + & -) sort this?

Others will know more about this than me, as my understanding is that disconnecting the battery completely resets it, which I do regularly anyway, however...

Yes, I believe it comes from the system learning, and backing off the throttle when changing is what causes this. I think the procedure of holding back the paddles only results in some sort of a "soft" reset, but to do it properly one of the following is required:

- disconnect battery, as mentioned
- dealer can perform a "full" reset
- drive it harder, with your foot in on changes, for a while

I'm sure someone with much better tech knowledge than myself will be along in a while to explain better though

Slightly OT, but many suspect the CSL used against the M235i in the recent AutoExpress showdown might have been suffering from this, as the journo complained of slow changes in S6. For me they're the other side of brutal

Although I've not much experience of the latest DSGs so maybe it's just that instead

[stuart-b]

Is this what you mean? seems brutal! - you can see the camera shake. This doesn't damage the clutch/gearbox? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk-y49VAZ7k

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x7YG7VMQABE

Also, first video, he seems to do this without it being warmed up properly!?

[Leins]

stuart-b said:

Is this what you mean? seems brutal! - you can see the camera shake. This doesn't damage the clutch/gearbox? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fk-y49VAZ7k

Also, he seems to do this without it being warmed up properly!?

Car looks warmed up to me, as you can see the yellow "indicator" lights in the rev range have disappeared, which can take a good few miles of driving (they always have one yellow left on). But yes, that's S6 for you, it's fairly savage

I've never been too sure on the whole SMG warming up thing myself. I tend to use S3 when cold, then when warmed up go to S5 or occasionally S6 and keep my foot in. And I tried "auto" mode once and it was predictably awful

This is why I think people don't like or understand SMGII, it really only makes sense when you really drive the car IMO, which is what an M3 is all about for me. Many complain that it feels agricultural and unfriendly, and it can take a little time to learn, but for me it's never boring. I can guarantee that the first time you experience a full-bore S6 shift the last thing it will feel like is using a PlayStation controller

[stuart-b]

Great CSL vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3jVhsI26O4

Suppose the next question is, can the normal M3 can have that air intake and exhaust set up? Couldn't live without aircon/radio

[stuart-b]

Leins said:

Car looks warmed up to me, as you can see the yellow "indicator" lights in the rev range have disappeared, which can take a good few miles of driving (they always have one yellow left on). But yes, that's S6 for you, it's fairly savage

I've never been too sure on the whole SMG warming up thing myself. I tend to use S3 when cold, then when warmed up go to S5 or occasionally S6 and keep my foot in. And I tried "auto" mode once and it was predictably awful

This is why I think people don't like or understand SMGII, it really only makes sense when you really drive the car IMO, which is what an M3 is all about for me. Many complain that it feels agricultural and unfriendly, and it can take a little time to learn, but for me it's never boring. I can guarantee that the first time you experience a full-bore S6 shift the last thing it will feel like is using a PlayStation controller

Interesting - I liked the Z4 35is DSG, but it didn't feel that solid - the car had done 30,000km and it was already vibrating under heavy load (clutch?).
It was also jerky, but the auto mode was excellent, albeit boring. Under full acceleration the gear change was instant.

I think I'm more interested in SMG - it has this feel of "having to learn to get the best experience", which I like. The new DSG is press a button, foot down, that's it.

[Leins]

Yep, carbon airbox & Alpha-N is the first alteration I would make to an E46 M3. However, and this is just my own personal preference, I didn't want to change the exhaust on mine as I believe it takes something away from all the induction noise

You'll be doing pretty well to find a CSL out there without both the radio and aircon btw!

[JsyM3]

stuart-b said:

I think I'm more interested in SMG - it has this feel of "having to learn to get the best experience", which I like. The new DSG is press a button, foot down, that's it.

Having gone "backwards" in terms of tech, having previously owned and loved a DSG Golf GTI, the SMG takes getting used to but it is much more engaging. The DSG is easy which, looking back, makes it a bit boring. Very effective, but boring.

It will feel raw, brutal and a bit agricultural but I love it for it.

Passengers in my DSG Golf were impressed by the changes at full chat - Passengers in my M3 are left speechless...

[stuart-b]

Leins said:

Yep, carbon airbox & Alpha-N is the first alteration I would make to an E46 M3. However, and this is just my own personal preference, I didn't want to change the exhaust on mine as I believe it takes something away from all the induction noise

You'll be doing pretty well to find a CSL out there without both the radio and aircon btw!

Very expensive mods! Found this: http://www.geoffsteel.co.uk/shop/e46-csl-carbon-ai... I assume it can be fitted, mapped, and tweaked for ~£1800 all in? Plus exhaust puts this mod list up to £2.5k already - not a cheap modding toy this car! Evolve want £3500 for the SMG, airbox, mapping, etc!!!

[Leins]

^^^ Not much experience of those particular airboxes, but once you hear the induction roar from an S54 breathing through a big carbon intake there's no going back

[stuart-b]

I also saw the ESS supercharger - this car will be a slippery modding slope!

[pidsy]

in the market for an M3 too. was wondering about the SMG box.

[JsyM3]

pidsy said:

was wondering about the SMG box.

Fire away with your questions... I'm sure, if they haven't been answered already, you will get the answers you need or can at least be pointed in the right direction.