Jeremey Clarkson says the M2 is quicker than an M4

[Juber]

Is that actually true?

https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...

[aponting389]

Ive read that article before, and just read it again, and I cant see where he says the M2 is quicker?

[aponting389]

OK just read it for a third time and spotted it! As i recall an US test timed it quicker than an M4 on track too, back to back also.

[jimbooo]

good review and I don't doubt any of the points he makes. As to whether its faster than an M4 I think that would all depend on circumstances.

put average Joe in an M2 and an M4 and send him off to lap a racetrack and I'm 100% sure the M2 would give back better times. As Jeremy said its basic and simplified (not necessarily a bad thing). I've not actually driven an M2 but do own an M4 and although the M4 is blisteringly fast in the right "trained" hands it can bite you in the arse very very easily. I've managed to send it sideways at around 90mph by redlining 3rd then changing to 4th in DCT level 3 and all sport + modes as i was on a slight bend. The gear change is so ferocious it will unsettle the car completely if you pull the shift paddle at the wrong time (mines a DCT). that wouldn't happen in an M2 because quite simply its a manual and has a more sensible set up without all the multitude of settings.

What that means is you become wary of the M4/M3 and treat it with respect so hammering it "balls to the wall" is reserved for hot sunny days and only when you've had a heavy dose of confidence building meditation.

I used to have an M135 prior to the M4 and i can honestly say that when hammering around my local B roads with unpredictable camber, undulations etc etc the M135 was faster, purely because it was incapable of killing me as easily as the M4 so i had the confidence to hammer it around everywhere.

However with an experienced or trained driver behind the wheel of both cars i think they would be very similar on a track in terms of times and traffic light drag races would likely go to the M4 if you can get the power down without lighting up the rears.

Personally I'm changing my car in about 6 months and will get another M4 comp pack. For me its not all about the performance, i daily drive it and all the tech and far superior interior mean a lot to me personally. The M2's interior to me looks exactly like the M135, cheap and plastic and not somewhere i want to spend time in on a daily basis.

So Jeremy isn't wrong, if someone wants a really fast and fun car and isn't bothered about all the buttons, soft leather and 20K's worth of potential build options then the M2 is the better car. For me thought its not even on the radar.

anyway - just my opinion and went off on a ramble there a bit, quiet day at work and all that

[JMBMWM5]

Juber said:

Is that actually true?

https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/the-clarkson...

More bks from Clarkson

[AW10]

According to fastestlap.com the M2 is indeed quicker around the Hockenheim short circuit 1:12.2 vs 1:12.8. But at the RIng the times are 7:58 vs 7:52.

But does it really matter?

[ftypical]

So people pay a lot of attention to this kind of thing, along with such as Carbon roofs, leather dashboards, and whether it has a bunch of options they'll never use as a means of expressing that they can afford it. Harry Enfield touched on this phenomenon with one of his characters...

[Wills2]

I was overtaken the other day by a VW Passat travelling at 90mph on the motorway he was comfortably quicker than me doing 75mph in my M3.

Seriously I have no idea why people get so het up about what is faster than what, take an M2, M4, a 911, a Golf R and a nutter in an old battered 5k WRX on a point to point run in the dales and they will all arrive within seconds of each other with the nutter in the WRX probably leading the way, regardless of the ring times.

[bennyboysvuk]

jimbooo said:

The M2's interior to me looks exactly like the M135, cheap and plastic and not somewhere i want to spend time in on a daily basis.

I don't mind the interior per se, but the lack of M-button on the steering wheel and the fact the M2 weighs nearly as much as the M4, when I feel the M2 should be reasonably lighter puts me off of the M2, as well as the fact the engine is very similar to the M135i, but with different fake noise. A second hand M4 looks like far better value.

Edited by bennyboysvuk on Friday 4th August 12:45

[Pioneer]

Wills2 said:

I was overtaken the other day by a VW Passat travelling at 90mph on the motorway he was comfortably quicker than me doing 75mph in my M3.

Seriously I have no idea why people get so het up about what is faster than what, take an M2, M4, a 911, a Golf R and a nutter in an old battered 5k WRX on a point to point run in the dales and they will all arrive within seconds of each other with the nutter in the WRX probably leading the way, regardless of the ring times.

Great post. The nutter always wins as long as he has a bit of push under the bonnet. On a track it's a different matter but how often is that, not enough to sway a purchase for a dd. I've often been whipped by fast cars in my weekend car simply because I'm not interested in risking my investment, endangering other road users or having my license taken away. This country does not lend itself to the driving these cars are capable of.

[Mark83]

About 2% of my mileage is on track so I can cope if X is 0.xx seconds faster round a certain track.

[Wills2]

Pioneer said:

Wills2 said:

I was overtaken the other day by a VW Passat travelling at 90mph on the motorway he was comfortably quicker than me doing 75mph in my M3.

Seriously I have no idea why people get so het up about what is faster than what, take an M2, M4, a 911, a Golf R and a nutter in an old battered 5k WRX on a point to point run in the dales and they will all arrive within seconds of each other with the nutter in the WRX probably leading the way, regardless of the ring times.

Great post. The nutter always wins as long as he has a bit of push under the bonnet. On a track it's a different matter but how often is that, not enough to sway a purchase for a dd. I've often been whipped by fast cars in my weekend car simply because I'm not interested in risking my investment, endangering other road users or having my license taken away. This country does not lend itself to the driving these cars are capable of.

Indeed, quoting lap times produced by professional racing drivers on clear race tracks and then expecting a similar out come on a public road when you're driving, is like buying the same golf clubs as Tiger Woods and expecting to beat everyone and go round in 65 shots.

It isn't going to happen!

[VerySideways]

Wills2 said:

Indeed, quoting lap times produced by professional racing drivers on clear race tracks and then expecting a similar out come on a public road when you're driving, is like buying the same golf clubs as Tiger Woods and expecting to beat everyone and go round in 65 shots.

Just quoting because I love the analogy. Had me in stitches! Happy Friday

[anonymous-user]

jimbooo said:

<snip> it can bite you in the arse very very easily. I've managed to send it sideways at around 90mph by redlining 3rd then changing to 4th in DCT level 3 and all sport + modes as i was on a slight bend. The gear change is so ferocious it will unsettle the car completely if you pull the shift paddle at the wrong time (mines a DCT).
<snip>

That sounds terrifying. I had an e92 m3 few years ago and did something similar when the car only a few weeks ago. On holiday in Dorset, country roads, nice and quiet. Was with my wife so was driving in what I would describe as a spirited way rather than trying to drive "fast". I'd upped the settings to see what it was like with the faster gear changes etc but kept the minimum level of traction control on.

I wasn't even going that fast (may 45-50 mph) but pressed the throttle too hard out of a corner after changing gear - the car slewed sideways, going completely onto the other side of the road. At the time I genuinely couldn't understand why it had happened as I wasn't trying to drive *that* fast.

Overall, very stupid of me. Learnt my lesson fortunately with no damage to anyone or anything.

[skeeterm5]

In my experience it really doesn't matter what you drive or ride there is always somebody faster, that might because they have talent, a better car/bike or indeed a faster car/bike.

How fast you are is 90% about your skill/bravery/stupidity and 10% about the performance stats of any vehicle you read on the internet.

[SantaBarbara]

James May was always the more I intelligent one out of the three of them, I thought?

[JagerT]

Doubt if there's much difference,one motorway's much the same as another.

[jimbooo]

EddieSteadyGo said:

I wasn't even going that fast (may 45-50 mph) but pressed the throttle too hard out of a corner after changing gear - the car slewed sideways, going completely onto the other side of the road. At the time I genuinely couldn't understand why it had happened as I wasn't trying to drive *that* fast.

in not sure what the gearbox is like in the previous models but in the M4/curent M3 you dont need to lift off the throttle to change gear so if you picture me peddle to the floor at the top of third, flip the paddle to 4th (still with foot to floor) thats when the danger comes if in sp+ and gear change level 3. because you are already flat out on the pedal it changes so fast into 4th that it jolts you in your seat.

do that on cold tyres and on any sort of bend and its going to go sideways.

I learned to respect it pretty quickly after that lol.

[Max Maxasson]

jimbooo said:

do that on cold tyres and on any sort of bend and its going to go sideways.

While the DSC can't account for idiotic driving it does its best by using data from the various sensors (in particular the yaw sensor) to anticipate the unsettling of the chassis during D3/S3 shifts at wide throttle in a turn....by modulating the shift speed and reducing torque to the rear wheels.

[jimbooo]

Max Maxasson said:

While the DSC can't account for idiotic driving it does its best by using data from the various sensors (in particular the yaw sensor) to anticipate the unsettling of the chassis during D3/S3 shifts at wide throttle in a turn....by modulating the shift speed and reducing torque to the rear wheels.

very clever - i didn't realise that. although i have to say for my car (2016 non comp pack) it doesnt seem to help much.
I appreciate it may have been an idiotic manoeuvre but i was only 2 weeks into the M4 from the M135 and didnt appreciate just how big a jump it was. Learned a lesson that day!