F10 M5 or F10 Alpina D5/B5 Bi Turbo ....

[Slippydiff]

I'm currently in a F30 330D MSport and clocking up 25k miles PA.
Whilst I still enjoy the 330D, I'm beginning to think I'd like something a bit more "grown up" (I'm 55) by grown up, I mean more comfortable, specifically more refined and better able to soak up our shocking road surfaces (my 330D runs on 18" wheels and non-runflats) and quieter/more refined overall, but not at the expense of handling finesse, don't get me wrong, the 330D is no scalpel, but is the F10 5 series going to be a "boat" in comparison ?

A 535D may be all that's required ? (possibly with a remap ?) and some non-runflat tyres, though I'm currently struggling to establish whether all F10 535D's are twin turbo, or "Twin Power" single turbo twin scroll/VTG ?

But part of me would like something different than a 535D, be that a F10 M5 with Competition pack or an Alpina B5/D5 Bi Turbo. Clearly these are all very different cars ...

Soooo, here goes (my budget is £35K + the inevitable budget creep) :

Competition pack :
https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...

https://www.dacemotorgroup.co.uk/search_page.php?l...

Non Competition Pack but has Akrapovic exhaust and a favorite colour combination :

https://www.premiercarsashford.co.uk/used-cars/bmw...

What's the F10 M5 like as daily driver ? Ridiculously heavy on fuel ? Likewise on consumables ? What does a BMW Insured warranty cost PM on a sub- 50K mile car ? I'm averse to running any modern BMW without a no-quibble BMW warranty, so the cost is important.
Is the F10 M5 merely a "barge" that's ferociously quick in a straight line, or does it do corners and retain its composure when things get twisty, quick AND undulating ?

Some reviews state that the Competition pack gives the standard car the steering/suspension it should have had from day one ? Others seem to indicate it leaves the suspension less suited to our now poorly maintained road surfaces. Your thoughts on whether or not this is the case, and whether the Competition pack equipped cars are worthwhile seeking out and paying extra for too would be appreciated.

https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/bmw/m5/first-...

And so to the Alpinas. I assume/appreciate parts will be more expensive and the cars more expensive to insure (my broker hates them, as do insurance companies if he's to be believed ...) and run ? Remember we're talking 25k miles PA.

Is the B5 a more usable, rarer, slightly slower M5 ? or something altogether different ?

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...

https://www.pistonheads.com/classifieds/used-cars/...

Is the D5 a far superior car to the 535D ?

http://blakedowncarcompany.co.uk/buy/bmw-alpina-d5...

Your thoughts and comments would be much appreciated. Many thanks in advance.

[Elysium]

No experience with the B5, but I have had an M5 as a daily driver for a couple of years now.

MPG is not as terrible as you might imagine. On a motorway run I will get 25+mpg, but around town it will be more like 16 mpg. Long term average will depend on the mix of driving, but I am getting around 20mpg.

BMW Warranty with Comprehensive cover is highly recommended. I have just renewed mine at £780 for the year (with £250 excess). I think it was about £83 a month for those who do not want to pay upfront.

Tyres are not bad, as they are not runflats. Michelin Supersports are the best at £200-250 per corner. You might still find some cars with the remains of the 5 yr service pack, but in any case service costs are not bad.

I'm not looking forward to a brake service as full brakes and pads all round is circa £2k. That said, you should get good mileage out of them, so it's not a regular cost.

You will get mixed thoughts on the competition pack. My car is the standard model as c-pack cars seemed rare when I was looking and had a hefty premium. I think that the LCI cars are worth targeting as the steering was improved and I think that narrows the gap to some extent.

Great cars, epic speed and comfort in equal measure.

[Slippydiff]

Perfect thanks Elysium, what mileage (now and when purchased) is your car ? Is yours an LCi ? Have you made any warranty claims yet ?

[Welshbeef]

Isn’t the D5 385bhp v the 535d 313bhp.

[Slippydiff]

Welshbeef said:

Isn’t the D5 385bhp v the 535d 313bhp.

https://www.alpina-automobiles.com/en/models/d3-biturbo/highlights/

[Elysium]

Slippydiff said:

Perfect thanks Elysium, what mileage (now and when purchased) is your car ? Is yours an LCi ? Have you made any warranty claims yet ?

My car is an LCI and was on about 20k when I bought it. I have put another 15k or so on it.

I have made one sizeable warranty claim. I’m not going to go into details, but I’ve definitively got my money’s worth and have seen first hand just how good the BMW warranty can be. The comprehensive cover, which allows claims up to the price you pay for the car is the one to go for, but I think it’s only available up to 60k mileage.

Apart from the issue that led to the claim, the car has been very reliable. But when something goes wrong it reminds you just how complicated the M5 is. Given these are now low £30k ish for a decent LCI car, you are getting some quite exotic engineering for the price.

This blog has some really interesting info on the clever bits:

http://m5carblog.blogspot.com/

It's a big car, but it shrinks around you and the way it tackles 'b' roads is incredible. Loads of front end grip and turn in, plus its one of the last cars with hydraulic PAS.

The amount of power will be a shock compared to a 330d or even a 535d. It's brutal in comparison.

Edited by Elysium on Thursday 6th September 23:59

[Welshbeef]

Elysium said:

My car is an LCI and was on about 20k when I bought it. I have put another 15k or so on it.

I have made one sizeable warranty claim. I’m not going to go into details, but I’ve definitively got my money’s worth and have seen first hand just how good the BMW warranty can be. The comprehensive cover, which allows claims up to the price you pay for the car is the one to go for, but I think it’s only available up to 60k mileage.

Apart from the issue that led to the claim, the car has been very reliable. But when something goes wrong it reminds you just how complicated the M5 is. Given these are now low £30k ish for a decent LCI car, you are getting some quite exotic engineering for the price.

This blog has some really interesting info on the clever bits:

http://m5carblog.blogspot.com/

It's a big car, but it shrinks around you and the way it tackles 'b' roads is incredible. Loads of front end grip and turn in, plus its one of the last cars with hydraulic PAS.

The amount of power will be a shock compared to a 330d or even a 535d. It's brutal in comparison.

Edited by Elysium on Thursday 6th September 23:59

It has nearly double the power of. E 535d and not far off 2.5 x the power of a 330d it should be a weapon

[pjv997]

Ran one for 6 years and 65,000 miles, bought as demonstrator and sold at beginning of this year.

I didn’t have any issues with mine. Michelin’s lasted forever considering the power and weight of the car. No brake discs required in 66,000 miles (depends on how car is treated of course) and no other issues of any note.

About 20mpg overall was as expected but mine liked to drink oil as some of them do - so a litre every 2,000 miles got a bit pricey.

Great daily and I really enjoyed pressing on when the opportunity arose. It’s no M2 or M3 down a winding country road because of the extra size and weight, but can still be placed accurately and there is fun to be had, plus it can play the comfortable cruiser (or autobahn monster) better than the smaller cars.

I’ve changed to an M6GC comp pack, so broadly the same car, as the overall package really suits my needs in a car.

[steakandchips]

Elysium said:

My car is an LCI and was on about 20k when I bought it. I have put another 15k or so on it.

I have made one sizeable warranty claim. I’m not going to go into details, but I’ve definitively got my money’s worth and have seen first hand just how good the BMW warranty can be. The comprehensive cover, which allows claims up to the price you pay for the car is the one to go for, but I think it’s only available up to 60k mileage.

Apart from the issue that led to the claim, the car has been very reliable. But when something goes wrong it reminds you just how complicated the M5 is. Given these are now low £30k ish for a decent LCI car, you are getting some quite exotic engineering for the price.

This blog has some really interesting info on the clever bits:

http://m5carblog.blogspot.com/

It's a big car, but it shrinks around you and the way it tackles 'b' roads is incredible. Loads of front end grip and turn in, plus its one of the last cars with hydraulic PAS.

The amount of power will be a shock compared to a 330d or even a 535d. It's brutal in comparison.

Edited by Elysium on Thursday 6th September 23:59

What’s the point in taking the time to respond to the OP when you omit the part about the issue that led to the claim? To paraphrase you, everything has been absolutely wonderful... although the car did suffer a major issue that led to a sizeable warranty claim. Nobody likes to admit they unwittingly bought a car with a major issue but isn’t the point of this thread to share the bad as well as the good?? So what was the issue?

[Elysium]

steakandchips said:

Elysium said:

My car is an LCI and was on about 20k when I bought it. I have put another 15k or so on it.

I have made one sizeable warranty claim. I’m not going to go into details, but I’ve definitively got my money’s worth and have seen first hand just how good the BMW warranty can be. The comprehensive cover, which allows claims up to the price you pay for the car is the one to go for, but I think it’s only available up to 60k mileage.

Apart from the issue that led to the claim, the car has been very reliable. But when something goes wrong it reminds you just how complicated the M5 is. Given these are now low £30k ish for a decent LCI car, you are getting some quite exotic engineering for the price.

This blog has some really interesting info on the clever bits:

http://m5carblog.blogspot.com/

It's a big car, but it shrinks around you and the way it tackles 'b' roads is incredible. Loads of front end grip and turn in, plus its one of the last cars with hydraulic PAS.

The amount of power will be a shock compared to a 330d or even a 535d. It's brutal in comparison.

What’s the point in taking the time to respond to the OP when you omit the part about the issue that led to the claim? To paraphrase you, everything has been absolutely wonderful... although the car did suffer a major issue that led to a sizeable warranty claim. Nobody likes to admit they unwittingly bought a car with a major issue but isn’t the point of this thread to share the bad as well as the good?? So what was the issue?

I said I would not go into the details.

You don't need to know which bits failed in order to understand the point I made, which is that, despite it's attractive used pricing, the F10 M5 is a particularly complex and highly engineered car. It's not like buying a normal used 5 series.

My direct experience is that things can very easily go wrong, that fixing them can be very expensive and that (in my case at least) the BMW extended warranty was incredibly worthwhile.

[Welshbeef]

Elysium said:

I said I would not go into the details.

You don't need to know which bits failed in order to understand the point I made, which is that, despite it's attractive used pricing, the F10 M5 is a particularly complex and highly engineered car. It's not like buying a normal used 5 series.

My direct experience is that things can very easily go wrong, that fixing them can be very expensive and that (in my case at least) the BMW extended warranty was incredibly worthwhile.

What would have been the repair bill been/that warranty paid for?

Also bloody lucky - as I’m assuming it would have written the car off.

[Elysium]

Welshbeef said:

What would have been the repair bill been/that warranty paid for?

£10k plus

[Welshbeef]

Elysium said:

Welshbeef said:

What would have been the repair bill been/that warranty paid for?

£10k plus

Ouch. /phew.

[Eddieslofart]

You specify comfort, as would i ( Same age)

The M5 will not approach an Alpina in this respect. It’s why Alpina exist. Their suspension is black magic.

And 90% of the time, it’s all you need.

[steakandchips]

Elysium said:

£10k plus

Surely you agree that anyone reading a thread about buying a second hand F10 M5 would be interested in what could cause a £10k plus failure in a second hand F10 M5?

Not sure why you would be embarrassed. You're anonymous!

Reminds me of the guys on the discount threads going out of the way to brag about getting really great deals and then refusing to give a single detail. Isn't this forum all about sharing exactly that kind of information?

[Elysium]

steakandchips said:

Elysium said:

£10k plus

Surely you agree that anyone reading a thread about buying a second hand F10 M5 would be interested in what could cause a £10k plus failure in a second hand F10 M5?

Not sure why you would be embarrassed. You're anonymous!

Reminds me of the guys on the discount threads going out of the way to brag about getting really great deals and then refusing to give a single detail. Isn't this forum all about sharing exactly that kind of information?

The point is that there are many issues that could lead to a £10k plus bill on a used F10 M5.

There is plenty of information out there regarding the specific problem I had. I am certainly not embarrassed about it, but, as I have said more than once, I am not going to go into the details here.

[Welshbeef]

steakandchips said:

Elysium said:

£10k plus

Surely you agree that anyone reading a thread about buying a second hand F10 M5 would be interested in what could cause a £10k plus failure in a second hand F10 M5?

Not sure why you would be embarrassed. You're anonymous!

Reminds me of the guys on the discount threads going out of the way to brag about getting really great deals and then refusing to give a single detail. Isn't this forum all about sharing exactly that kind of information?

It will not be the gearbox bombproof

A glance online shows that there can be high oil consumption from not driving he car hard in its early life resulting in ruined engine.
However an M5 F10 engine will be way way more than £10k (remember the thread about a Golf R with ruined engine that was £6-8k fitted ... an M5 engine is wager is towards the £30k territory fitted


Maybe the turbos were lunched.

Maybe he or previous owner modified it a lot of drove it like it was stolen.

Who knows - it’s up to Ellison to share more or direct to a thread where he has already given said info.

[bmwmike]

steakandchips said:

Isn't this forum all about sharing exactly that kind of information?

Apparently not

[Welshbeef]

bmwmike said:

steakandchips said:

Isn't this forum all about sharing exactly that kind of information?

Apparently not

He must have his reasons- maybe it’s an issue that would impact its future resale value so keeping quiet about it might not put off potential buyers. I’m cynical and likely utterly wrong.

[Eddieslofart]

Welshbeef said:

He must have his reasons- maybe it’s an issue that would impact its future resale value so keeping quiet about it might not put off potential buyers. I’m cynical and likely utterly wrong.

Man said he won’t be discussing it, why keep trying to chip away at it.

He’s given a decent review for the op of life with an M5, pretty civil of him, no ?