M3 E46 or TVR Tamora
Discussion
Please help im having a huge dilema.....
Having owned a chimera before i loved the V8 and the in gear power, soft top and looks of of the car....although it was bloody unreliable
I have always fancied an M3 but i wonder if i will get bored of it after a couple of months - having just come from a lotus elise.
I'd love to go for a tamora but to be honest i s
t scared of the speed 6 engine going pop on me........the BMW has lots of appeal in terms of reliablity but i cant make up my mind.......Help!!!!!
Having owned a chimera before i loved the V8 and the in gear power, soft top and looks of of the car....although it was bloody unreliable
I have always fancied an M3 but i wonder if i will get bored of it after a couple of months - having just come from a lotus elise.
I'd love to go for a tamora but to be honest i s
t scared of the speed 6 engine going pop on me........the BMW has lots of appeal in terms of reliablity but i cant make up my mind.......Help!!!!!mat205125 said:
Only car, or second car? - only car (apart from Gilfreinds) but i would drive mine allt he time
Lots of miles, or weekend fun? Probaly about 18k a year maybe more
Fast refined and balanced, or noisy thug to soild your pants? quite like a thug! - the M3 seems a bit too refind (or am i wrong)?
Ever need a boot and seats? Need a boot for camping but thats about it the Tamora has a decent size boot.....although comming from an elise an glove box is a bonus!
Like tinkering? not particually
Me, personally? I'd take the M3 as my only car or maybe a 996.
cheersLots of miles, or weekend fun? Probaly about 18k a year maybe more
Fast refined and balanced, or noisy thug to soild your pants? quite like a thug! - the M3 seems a bit too refind (or am i wrong)?
Ever need a boot and seats? Need a boot for camping but thats about it the Tamora has a decent size boot.....although comming from an elise an glove box is a bonus!
Like tinkering? not particually
Me, personally? I'd take the M3 as my only car or maybe a 996.
rudeboymassive said:
mat205125 said:
Only car, or second car? - only car (apart from Gilfreinds) but i would drive mine allt he time
Lots of miles, or weekend fun? Probaly about 18k a year maybe more
Fast refined and balanced, or noisy thug to soild your pants? quite like a thug! - the M3 seems a bit too refind (or am i wrong)?
Ever need a boot and seats? Need a boot for camping but thats about it the Tamora has a decent size boot.....although comming from an elise an glove box is a bonus!
Like tinkering? not particually
Me, personally? I'd take the M3 as my only car or maybe a 996.
cheersLots of miles, or weekend fun? Probaly about 18k a year maybe more
Fast refined and balanced, or noisy thug to soild your pants? quite like a thug! - the M3 seems a bit too refind (or am i wrong)?
Ever need a boot and seats? Need a boot for camping but thats about it the Tamora has a decent size boot.....although comming from an elise an glove box is a bonus!
Like tinkering? not particually
Me, personally? I'd take the M3 as my only car or maybe a 996.
I'd suggest getting a drive in an M3 to clarify the third bold point ... and maybe get driven by an owner in one. The M3 will be more refined than a TVR, however you're maybe doing it an injustice to disregard it as a little boring / tame. Compared to a TVR it is a scalpel sharp tool, and one that you can have a lot of fun in - it would inevitably lack a lot of the pounding heart "f
king hell" moments that a TVR would when something happened that wasn't planned, yet arguably you could have more fun by planning your "Weh hey!!" moments for when YOU want them to happen.TVR's sound great, but an E46 (especially with CSL bits) really do sing ... All proper M engines do!
Edited by mat205125 on Thursday 8th January 15:41
I had a Tuscan. Now have an E36 M3 (my second one) and a 355.
The TVR was great (lots of fun, heaps of poke, gigantic boot) but I was always worried it would throw me in the bushes or (more likely) lunch its engine / gearbox / clutch at some point. Make no mistake, it will go pop but it will be fun up to that point. Then expensive.
Were it me, I'd opt for the M3 every time. Oh, and try an E36 and an E46. Same performance but different cars entirely.
My 2c...
ETA: My mate bought a 350Z recently and I quite liked that. The Brembo brakes are epic. M3 brakes are widely acknowledged as average at best.
The TVR was great (lots of fun, heaps of poke, gigantic boot) but I was always worried it would throw me in the bushes or (more likely) lunch its engine / gearbox / clutch at some point. Make no mistake, it will go pop but it will be fun up to that point. Then expensive.
Were it me, I'd opt for the M3 every time. Oh, and try an E36 and an E46. Same performance but different cars entirely.
My 2c...
ETA: My mate bought a 350Z recently and I quite liked that. The Brembo brakes are epic. M3 brakes are widely acknowledged as average at best.
Edited by Cactussed on Thursday 8th January 16:29
I would avoid the tuscan as their engines are so weak. There suspension is also under developed and this results in very poor body control ie firm but underdamped for the kind of car they are. I often go for runs out with TVR drivers and it is hilarious watching them bob about and bottom out on every bad bump.
Personally I would go for M Coupe if practicallity not an issue. I enjoyed having my E46 M3 CSL but found the steering a little bland and the SMG just too uninvolving. Unltimately I would go for a nice 993 or 996 if you want something a little bit more special for runs out but the M3 would be a better quicker car all round.
Personally I would go for M Coupe if practicallity not an issue. I enjoyed having my E46 M3 CSL but found the steering a little bland and the SMG just too uninvolving. Unltimately I would go for a nice 993 or 996 if you want something a little bit more special for runs out but the M3 would be a better quicker car all round.
Being a former Tamora owner I thought I'd pipe up. I loved and hated it. Had problems as every TVR owner has. The engine is great when it works (although doesn't often and needs constant rebuilding). It will cost more in the long and you won't be able to enjoy using as often as you want. Any Speed Six TVR will be worse than your Chim. I replaced the Tamora with a BMW Z4M Coupe. It's rare like TVR's and is just as quick as a Tamora with the M3 straight six engine. Really reliable and with my Hayward and Scott sports exhaust sounds fantastic too.
Chris
Chris
I think you've probably answered your own question when you said 18k miles p.a.
The Speed Six engine will cost you an absolute fortune over that time. It will quickly go out of tune, and you'll be left with an expensive noise.
All M3s respond well to a little bit of fettling, so you'll be able to get a very pointy, nippy car that sounds great fairly easily.
The Speed Six engine will cost you an absolute fortune over that time. It will quickly go out of tune, and you'll be left with an expensive noise.
All M3s respond well to a little bit of fettling, so you'll be able to get a very pointy, nippy car that sounds great fairly easily.
Chris_S said:
I replaced the Tamora with a BMW Z4M Coupe. It's rare like TVR's and is just as quick as a Tamora with the M3 straight six engine. Really reliable and with my Hayward and Scott sports exhaust sounds fantastic too.
I saw you earlier, I think, pulling out of the station car park 
Tell me about the exhaust..
Edited by john_p on Thursday 8th January 17:27
The TVR boys will tell you what bunch of jessies we all are but consider this:
The Tamora is a £15k car. In reality though, you need a spare pot of at least £10k in the event of the worst. Now, to some people, the sacrifice is worth it for the sense of occasion you get and I can perfectly understand that. However, most of us do not have pots of cash lying in wait for your TVR Power or Racing Green invoice for an engine rebuild and quite rightly so.
I have done a fair amount of research on the Tamora in particular as I happen to think it's the most rounded Tivver of the lot. But despite going in with my eyes open etc etc, all I could garner from the myriad of posts in the SP6 forum was the stench of doom and gloom.
I would love a TVR and thus decided that I was going to do it and sod the consequences. However, the feedback I received, was that these cars will, quite literally end you if they go wrong. Where's the fun in that? Where's the sense of occasion as you sit by the roadside with a very stroppy girlfriend? And where's the satisfaction in having a car sat permanently immobilised in your garage with an electric fault?
The M3 on the other hand is a complete package. Yes every middle manager and his corporate dog has one, but there is a reason for that. They are epic cars. If like me, faults drive you potty, then a TVR will send you to the Priory. Every single person I have ever spoken to who has either owned or experienced one, has told me how unreliable they are. Now on the basis that I live in an apartment and have no heated double garage with a lift and a plethora of power tools, DIY maintenance is impossible. What would I do if my TVR failed to unlock or start in the morning and I couldn't get to work?
You have to be extremely dedicated to own one, or have one as your second or third car. With a high annual mileage, to run one as an only car would be suicide. I doubt even the TVR boys would contest that. Their price point is deceiving. In reality, a TVR is as expensive to run as many a supercar and many, dare I say it, are far less fun to drive. Scary yes, but fun? Depends on how you like your eggs I guess.
Now I understand you - the OP, is battle hardened after many miles spent in an Elise and I dare say that the little Lotus has occasionally thrown it's toys out of the pram. However, a head gasket or failed window mechanism is one thing, a spun half shell and an ejected rod, is quite another...
Consider also, that the throttle bodies on the SP6 need to be rebalanced every 2000 miles or so. With your mileage you'd have to get that done 9 times a year assuming of course the throttle pots themselves weren't worn. I could go on, but I think you get the idea.
In comparison, the M3 feels like a big car and quite vague and remote when you drive it normally. However, show it a decent bit of road and neither the Tivver or the Elise will see which way you went. Fit a set of decent coilovers and a big brake kit and either will have a job catching you on track. For reference, my low budget E36 M3 with coilovers and some other mods, managed to better the time round the Nurburgring of a T350 with a 4.0 Red rose conversion and nitron coilivers. I am by no means racing driver either. That in itself speaks volumes about what you get with a TVR. The M3 on the other hand just gets on quietly with the job of being awesome.
In summary, any TVR is an event to drive. But to own? I'd take the M3 any day
The Tamora is a £15k car. In reality though, you need a spare pot of at least £10k in the event of the worst. Now, to some people, the sacrifice is worth it for the sense of occasion you get and I can perfectly understand that. However, most of us do not have pots of cash lying in wait for your TVR Power or Racing Green invoice for an engine rebuild and quite rightly so.
I have done a fair amount of research on the Tamora in particular as I happen to think it's the most rounded Tivver of the lot. But despite going in with my eyes open etc etc, all I could garner from the myriad of posts in the SP6 forum was the stench of doom and gloom.
I would love a TVR and thus decided that I was going to do it and sod the consequences. However, the feedback I received, was that these cars will, quite literally end you if they go wrong. Where's the fun in that? Where's the sense of occasion as you sit by the roadside with a very stroppy girlfriend? And where's the satisfaction in having a car sat permanently immobilised in your garage with an electric fault?
The M3 on the other hand is a complete package. Yes every middle manager and his corporate dog has one, but there is a reason for that. They are epic cars. If like me, faults drive you potty, then a TVR will send you to the Priory. Every single person I have ever spoken to who has either owned or experienced one, has told me how unreliable they are. Now on the basis that I live in an apartment and have no heated double garage with a lift and a plethora of power tools, DIY maintenance is impossible. What would I do if my TVR failed to unlock or start in the morning and I couldn't get to work?
You have to be extremely dedicated to own one, or have one as your second or third car. With a high annual mileage, to run one as an only car would be suicide. I doubt even the TVR boys would contest that. Their price point is deceiving. In reality, a TVR is as expensive to run as many a supercar and many, dare I say it, are far less fun to drive. Scary yes, but fun? Depends on how you like your eggs I guess.
Now I understand you - the OP, is battle hardened after many miles spent in an Elise and I dare say that the little Lotus has occasionally thrown it's toys out of the pram. However, a head gasket or failed window mechanism is one thing, a spun half shell and an ejected rod, is quite another...
Consider also, that the throttle bodies on the SP6 need to be rebalanced every 2000 miles or so. With your mileage you'd have to get that done 9 times a year assuming of course the throttle pots themselves weren't worn. I could go on, but I think you get the idea.
In comparison, the M3 feels like a big car and quite vague and remote when you drive it normally. However, show it a decent bit of road and neither the Tivver or the Elise will see which way you went. Fit a set of decent coilovers and a big brake kit and either will have a job catching you on track. For reference, my low budget E36 M3 with coilovers and some other mods, managed to better the time round the Nurburgring of a T350 with a 4.0 Red rose conversion and nitron coilivers. I am by no means racing driver either. That in itself speaks volumes about what you get with a TVR. The M3 on the other hand just gets on quietly with the job of being awesome.
In summary, any TVR is an event to drive. But to own? I'd take the M3 any day
Best mate's recent car history:
1. E36 M3 Evo
2. E36 M3 Evo
3. E46 M3
4. TVR Tuscan S
5. TVR Sagaris
6. E46 M3
The Tuscan was clearly a drunken Friday car that set fire to itself on the driveway.
The Sagaris was awesome until it a) went on a rolling road and b) needed £3k of work at a "minor" service at 18 months old.
Owning a TVR is an event, in the same way as standing under an errupting volcano. Great noise, great excitement, ultimately kills you.
1. E36 M3 Evo
2. E36 M3 Evo
3. E46 M3
4. TVR Tuscan S
5. TVR Sagaris
6. E46 M3
The Tuscan was clearly a drunken Friday car that set fire to itself on the driveway.
The Sagaris was awesome until it a) went on a rolling road and b) needed £3k of work at a "minor" service at 18 months old.
Owning a TVR is an event, in the same way as standing under an errupting volcano. Great noise, great excitement, ultimately kills you.
I saw you earlier, I think, pulling out of the station car park
Tell me about the exhaust..
[/quote]
Hi John,
If it was today it wasn't me (unless it was her-in-doors driving it). I was in my RS4 today. My Z4MC is Silver/grey. Coming out of a TVR the Z4M Coupe was a bit too quiet. I also used to have an M3 CSL in the past so I felt the need for more noise. The exhaust is great, nice base and still has a metalic edge and gets louder as the revs rise. Still fine and not a bother on motorway cruise.
Hayward & Scott
Handcrafted Stainless steel BS304 in 18/16 SWG mandrel bent without any necking on the bends
It is ighter helping to reduce the centre of gravity and improve handling and performance
It allows the S54 engine to breath better and is independently proven to increase BHP
The same drone free user friendliness at low speeds but full on visceral rasp at high revs, exactly how a perfomance exhaust should be.
Here's a vid of Andy Sixspeed's car. I have the same exhaust but he also has the Gruppe M induction. It's the exhaust you really hear:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=krSPw4SmR6Y
Chris
Tell me about the exhaust..
Edited by john_p on Thursday 8th January 17:27
[/quote]
Hi John,
If it was today it wasn't me (unless it was her-in-doors driving it). I was in my RS4 today. My Z4MC is Silver/grey. Coming out of a TVR the Z4M Coupe was a bit too quiet. I also used to have an M3 CSL in the past so I felt the need for more noise. The exhaust is great, nice base and still has a metalic edge and gets louder as the revs rise. Still fine and not a bother on motorway cruise.
Hayward & Scott
Handcrafted Stainless steel BS304 in 18/16 SWG mandrel bent without any necking on the bends
It is ighter helping to reduce the centre of gravity and improve handling and performance
It allows the S54 engine to breath better and is independently proven to increase BHP
The same drone free user friendliness at low speeds but full on visceral rasp at high revs, exactly how a perfomance exhaust should be.
Here's a vid of Andy Sixspeed's car. I have the same exhaust but he also has the Gruppe M induction. It's the exhaust you really hear:
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=krSPw4SmR6Y
Chris
dan101smith said:
Best mate's recent car history:
1. E36 M3 Evo
2. E36 M3 Evo
3. E46 M3
4. TVR Tuscan S
5. TVR Sagaris
6. E46 M3
The Tuscan was clearly a drunken Friday car that set fire to itself on the driveway.
The Sagaris was awesome until it a) went on a rolling road and b) needed £3k of work at a "minor" service at 18 months old.
Owning a TVR is an event, in the same way as standing under an errupting volcano. Great noise, great excitement, ultimately kills you.
Interesting you mention that.1. E36 M3 Evo
2. E36 M3 Evo
3. E46 M3
4. TVR Tuscan S
5. TVR Sagaris
6. E46 M3
The Tuscan was clearly a drunken Friday car that set fire to itself on the driveway.
The Sagaris was awesome until it a) went on a rolling road and b) needed £3k of work at a "minor" service at 18 months old.
Owning a TVR is an event, in the same way as standing under an errupting volcano. Great noise, great excitement, ultimately kills you.
I was behind a Sag' on a recent hoon in my M3 and was surprised at a) the amount of blue smoke coming from both tailpipes and b) that it was not gaining any ground on me whatsoever.
I think the phrase once uttered, that all TVRs sold were customer development mules, is quite apt, if a little harsh.
to put it in a nut shell, yes u will get very bored of the E46 M3 and quick!! It really is a and nice car! I have one, lol
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
to put it in a nut shell, yes u will get very bored of the E46 M3 and quick!! It really is a and nice car! I have one, lol
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
M3stann said:
to put it in a nut shell, yes u will get very bored of the E46 M3 and quick!! It really is a and nice car! I have one, lol
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
I don't think that a TVR is a driver's car. It is far too unpredictable for that, in the same way I don't class an AC Cobra as a driver's car.But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
They are loud, lairy, reasonably quick, but not a true driver's car. No comparison with the Noble you also mention.
M3stann said:
to put it in a nut shell, yes u will get very bored of the E46 M3 and quick!! It really is a and nice car! I have one, lol
But really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
With respect, that is bBut really is a boring car!! Middle aged suit wearing never driven a real drivers car!! Imho...
Not meaning to affend anyone honestly!! Jst my view from most of the drivers I see and the way they drive!!
I'm keeping mine, but only as a family car, and either getting a noble
Or t350,
P.s with prices now as low as 10k very soon going to become a young chavs car!!
ks.I didn't say I think the tvr is a real drivers car!! Pls read again!!
I said the people I have come across that own M3's don't drive well at all!! And think they are the top dog on the road!!
And I do 40k a year so see alot... As I said it was imho!!
And pls trust me when I said about the chavs!! For 10k that will get u a M3 u can't even get the other chav dream a focus rs turbo! Lol
I said the people I have come across that own M3's don't drive well at all!! And think they are the top dog on the road!!
And I do 40k a year so see alot... As I said it was imho!!
And pls trust me when I said about the chavs!! For 10k that will get u a M3 u can't even get the other chav dream a focus rs turbo! Lol
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