Out of warranty M cars?
Discussion
Hi All,
I would really love an M car, but the sort of car that I can afford would be up on the miles and out of warranty. Now, I am aware that in reading forums you are more exposed to negative stories that positive (not many people post how trouble free their car is being), so I try to take a balanced view. However, it seems that the costs associated with M cars are simply horrific. £2k bills seem not too uncommon and servicing seems very dear too.
I've got about £12k to spend (not yet - not looking to out the current car until Mayish) - is that enough to get me car that won't break me with failures?
Sorry to be so vague, but any thoughts on the matter would be greatly appreciated.
FF
I would really love an M car, but the sort of car that I can afford would be up on the miles and out of warranty. Now, I am aware that in reading forums you are more exposed to negative stories that positive (not many people post how trouble free their car is being), so I try to take a balanced view. However, it seems that the costs associated with M cars are simply horrific. £2k bills seem not too uncommon and servicing seems very dear too.
I've got about £12k to spend (not yet - not looking to out the current car until Mayish) - is that enough to get me car that won't break me with failures?
Sorry to be so vague, but any thoughts on the matter would be greatly appreciated.
FF
Any car, ///M or otherwise, could have a catastrophic failure days after you've bought it, and no-one can foresee which car that's going to happen to. Current price is no guarantee of lack of future bills.
At £12k, I'm guessing you're either looking at an e46 M3, or e39 M5.
However, you can mitigate your concerns somewhat by having the car professionally inspected, whether that's by taking it to a BMW dealer, a BMW specialist, or getting an independent engineer (RAC/AA, etc.). This 'should' at least give you some comeback if you find a hole in the floor a couple of days later, or you find the 5 litre engine is actually a 2 litre one.
The inspection can cover things like compression testing, coolant contamination (e.g. top-ups from tap water rather than distilled water can cause a limescale buildup in the thermostat, water pump, heater valves, etc.).
Even if the car was in warranty (and depending on which of the 3 levels of BMW warranty it was uner), if it had high miles there would be less & less you'd be able to claim on, and to some extent there'd be a wear & tear reduction on any bills for major components.
You could buy a £12k car and spend £12k on it in a year, or you could spend £0.
At £12k, I'm guessing you're either looking at an e46 M3, or e39 M5.
However, you can mitigate your concerns somewhat by having the car professionally inspected, whether that's by taking it to a BMW dealer, a BMW specialist, or getting an independent engineer (RAC/AA, etc.). This 'should' at least give you some comeback if you find a hole in the floor a couple of days later, or you find the 5 litre engine is actually a 2 litre one.
The inspection can cover things like compression testing, coolant contamination (e.g. top-ups from tap water rather than distilled water can cause a limescale buildup in the thermostat, water pump, heater valves, etc.).
Even if the car was in warranty (and depending on which of the 3 levels of BMW warranty it was uner), if it had high miles there would be less & less you'd be able to claim on, and to some extent there'd be a wear & tear reduction on any bills for major components.
You could buy a £12k car and spend £12k on it in a year, or you could spend £0.
There is a thread in this section about E39 M5s and from reading it they are pretty 'bulletproof'. Like all fast cars if you buy a good example and don't scrimp on maintaining it, you've got a better chance of it not going wrong. However, you could buy a minter and it have a catastrophic failure the next day. I'd say if you can't afford to run one, dont buy one, or try and get a decent aftermarket warranty. Good luck!
I've never had a warranty on any car that I have ever owned.
I like to keep a grand of unallocated savings in the bank, and a healthy gap on the credit card. Touching wood (oo er!), and keeping your fingers crossed never hurts either.
I run an E46 at the moment, and must admit that I have been hit in the wallet by one unexpected bill that took several hundred from the savings.
I'm in no position to consider cars that are likely to be new enough to carry an extended manufacturer warranty, and have yet to hear of a good aftermarket one that doesn't try and wriggle out of paying for absolutely anything.
My E46 is as brave as I am likely to get with a daily driver. I'd love to aim for a V10 M5 or M6 in a few years time when they fall in value, but all indications are that that would be considered financial suicide .... A VXR8 with some loud pipes and a supercharger might have to provide my next acoustic and power fix.
I like to keep a grand of unallocated savings in the bank, and a healthy gap on the credit card. Touching wood (oo er!), and keeping your fingers crossed never hurts either.
I run an E46 at the moment, and must admit that I have been hit in the wallet by one unexpected bill that took several hundred from the savings.
I'm in no position to consider cars that are likely to be new enough to carry an extended manufacturer warranty, and have yet to hear of a good aftermarket one that doesn't try and wriggle out of paying for absolutely anything.
My E46 is as brave as I am likely to get with a daily driver. I'd love to aim for a V10 M5 or M6 in a few years time when they fall in value, but all indications are that that would be considered financial suicide .... A VXR8 with some loud pipes and a supercharger might have to provide my next acoustic and power fix.
Oh Behave said:
There is a thread in this section about E39 M5s and from reading it they are pretty 'bulletproof'. Like all fast cars if you buy a good example and don't scrimp on maintaining it, you've got a better chance of it not going wrong. However, you could buy a minter and it have a catastrophic failure the next day. I'd say if you can't afford to run one, dont buy one, or try and get a decent aftermarket warranty. Good luck!
That would be the advice that I would officially pass to anyone in a "do as I say, not as I do" kind of way. I tend to lean towards the "one life, live it!" philosophy myself, however.
Thanks for the replies.
I ran an Audi TT for a while and it whacked me pretty hard (£700 for a clutch etc), but it didn't break me. I've got a Clio Cup at the moment, and touching wood it seems to not need attention every time I get in it (and obviously parts etc are cheaper) - the TT was falling apart in comparison!
I'm leaning towards an M5 but like M3's too, but I'll have to wait and see what's avaliable come purchasing time. I just wish that an M car was one that you could buy with your head AND your heart. I've been looking at 350z's too, which fits the head part, but not the heart so much! Plus, only two seats and if I was going to go that way then there are other cars to consider too (Boxster, VX220 etc).
Again, thanks for the advice.
FF
I ran an Audi TT for a while and it whacked me pretty hard (£700 for a clutch etc), but it didn't break me. I've got a Clio Cup at the moment, and touching wood it seems to not need attention every time I get in it (and obviously parts etc are cheaper) - the TT was falling apart in comparison!
I'm leaning towards an M5 but like M3's too, but I'll have to wait and see what's avaliable come purchasing time. I just wish that an M car was one that you could buy with your head AND your heart. I've been looking at 350z's too, which fits the head part, but not the heart so much! Plus, only two seats and if I was going to go that way then there are other cars to consider too (Boxster, VX220 etc).
Again, thanks for the advice.
FF
mat205125 said:
Oh Behave said:
There is a thread in this section about E39 M5s and from reading it they are pretty 'bulletproof'. Like all fast cars if you buy a good example and don't scrimp on maintaining it, you've got a better chance of it not going wrong. However, you could buy a minter and it have a catastrophic failure the next day. I'd say if you can't afford to run one, dont buy one, or try and get a decent aftermarket warranty. Good luck!
That would be the advice that I would officially pass to anyone in a "do as I say, not as I do" kind of way. I tend to lean towards the "one life, live it!" philosophy myself, however.
I tend to follow the same principles!
with £12k your best bet (imho) is spend £9-£10K on a facelift M5 and pocket £2k for maintenance which should be plenty to keep you going if you get the car properly inspected before you buy.
However - if you genuinely can't stomach the idea of spending c£400 on a service, an M car probably is going to be a painful experience for you (I'm assuming you can't service cars yourself! - which is an option if you're planning on a keeper and doing serious mileage)
The other advantage of E39 M5 is that they run on long service intervals of course (tho oil/fluid changes in between are usually sensible!)
what other cars have you been used to running??
However - if you genuinely can't stomach the idea of spending c£400 on a service, an M car probably is going to be a painful experience for you (I'm assuming you can't service cars yourself! - which is an option if you're planning on a keeper and doing serious mileage)
The other advantage of E39 M5 is that they run on long service intervals of course (tho oil/fluid changes in between are usually sensible!)
what other cars have you been used to running??
The E39 M5 will do circa 16k miles between services - interim service inbetween of course - but you will never only spend the service cost, there are always items that need attention and thats where it gets you.
As you mentioned a clutch, its around £600 for an M5, double that if you have chewed the flywheel.
As you mentioned a clutch, its around £600 for an M5, double that if you have chewed the flywheel.
i have a higher mileage E46 M3 (2005 model, 88k) and apart from the expensive servicing, needed a new steering rack and brake calliper in the last year -fortunately on BMW warranty. Also recently replaced broken rear coil springs (common E46 problem), RTABs and a radiator hose. As already said, for £12k i'd go for an E39 and save some £££ for paying service bills. If you go for an E46 buy one with a recent IN2 service that has been well looked after!
If looked after, these cars last well, most people who are in or drive mine are amazed it has covered 88k!
If looked after, these cars last well, most people who are in or drive mine are amazed it has covered 88k!
I think in reality I can't afford one of these, although if I do rethink then an M5 is the most likely choice. Shame really, as I have always been a fan but just can't understand how the costs are so high. I've run older cars and things break, but they are fixable and not so expensive and complex as to make it beyond the scope of a man with spanners etc.
The TT that I ran had some pretty big bills with it, and parts were expensive for what was, essentially, a MK4 golf in a party dress - but the M stuff is in a different league and I really do wonder who is going to be looking at say, and E60 M5 when it is 15 years old? A new exhaust will be more than the car is worth at this rate!
Makes a Noble look like a good choice...
The TT that I ran had some pretty big bills with it, and parts were expensive for what was, essentially, a MK4 golf in a party dress - but the M stuff is in a different league and I really do wonder who is going to be looking at say, and E60 M5 when it is 15 years old? A new exhaust will be more than the car is worth at this rate!
Makes a Noble look like a good choice...
968CSReading said:
M5Dave said:
Very nice E39 M5 just appeared on PH classifieds.
2000 'W' plate, 1 owner from new, 51k miles, full BMW history and BMW warranty for £12k.
You don't get many like that anymore.
Someone lend me £12K. It looks a nice car. 2000 'W' plate, 1 owner from new, 51k miles, full BMW history and BMW warranty for £12k.
You don't get many like that anymore.
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