m3 evo track car suggestions
Discussion
new to pistons.....brought my self a mint e36 m3 evo 1996,stripped out an getting ready to track this summer! got me cage in from custom cages, racing seats now in. Now cutting dash to fit with dials etc.After that need to sort brakes a suspension out,but need some suggestions i dont want to skimp on this part of the car,i hope to do a few track days and do love speed ,just swapped wheels to 17" .getting a few opinions from friends but they dont run a m3.any suggestions would be helpfull,thanks
Congrats on the Evo - they are excellent cars. Head on over to e36coupe.com - lots of guys running E36 M3s as track cars, and plenty of discussion on brakes and suspension.
On the suspension side, KW Var 3 and Bilstein (PSS9s) seem to get good reviews, but there is a LOT of info on the forum.
If I were you, I'd use the car on track first (stripped with good-condition standard brakes will be really good anyway) then work out what you want from suspension (may not need all-singing fully adjustable if you're not going to play with the setup) and brakes (occasional track use you won't need uprated calipers, just quality discs (go for OEM) and uprated pads can work very well.
Whenever I'm considering suspension/brake upgrades, I weigh the cost against the price of a trackday/'Ring trip - as long as the car handles well, and the brakes can withstand what you want to do, I think the money is better spent on trackdays and/or driver training.
Also, it's worth upgrading rear top mounts if you're tracking it - look at the Rogue engineering kit - it's meant to be excellent.
On the suspension side, KW Var 3 and Bilstein (PSS9s) seem to get good reviews, but there is a LOT of info on the forum.
If I were you, I'd use the car on track first (stripped with good-condition standard brakes will be really good anyway) then work out what you want from suspension (may not need all-singing fully adjustable if you're not going to play with the setup) and brakes (occasional track use you won't need uprated calipers, just quality discs (go for OEM) and uprated pads can work very well.
Whenever I'm considering suspension/brake upgrades, I weigh the cost against the price of a trackday/'Ring trip - as long as the car handles well, and the brakes can withstand what you want to do, I think the money is better spent on trackdays and/or driver training.
Also, it's worth upgrading rear top mounts if you're tracking it - look at the Rogue engineering kit - it's meant to be excellent.
Edited by _Neal_ on Friday 12th March 16:17
mate like i said i am looking for any suggestions so thank you , i will def check out your advice,and check out the web site, this is all new to me and i have never done a track car befor,had a bad start with custom cages setting fire to my wire loom and there attutide was oh well thease things happen. so now i have sorted that after lots of headaches i can crack on with some help from friends who also track cars,cheers
Would be a long list & all depends on budget & yr skill etc etc, psss9, kw v3 well rated but not cheap & soft for hardcore tracking & felt the Bc racing inverteds at half the cost were as good, yet a pal feels he needs 4k worth of proflex as a min.
Brakes, pagid yellows & srf fluid & sort some cooling ducts may suit you, or you may want 3k of APs
Few golden rules, e30/e36/e46 need a lot of neg camber, or they eat front tyres on track, rear less of an issue imho, but still good.
Don't make it too noisy or you will only be able to track at a couple of places in uk & europe.
Don't use bonnet catches if you want to ring it- use aeros, or leave it alone if keeping stock bonnet.
Keep ya eye on oil temps, may need new cooler for tracking.
ARP rod bolts a very good idea.
Brakes, pagid yellows & srf fluid & sort some cooling ducts may suit you, or you may want 3k of APs
Few golden rules, e30/e36/e46 need a lot of neg camber, or they eat front tyres on track, rear less of an issue imho, but still good.
Don't make it too noisy or you will only be able to track at a couple of places in uk & europe.
Don't use bonnet catches if you want to ring it- use aeros, or leave it alone if keeping stock bonnet.
Keep ya eye on oil temps, may need new cooler for tracking.
ARP rod bolts a very good idea.
I would start with brakes, handlng & cockpit.
Brakes:
Standard EVO discs & calipers are OK for tracking but you will need uprated fluid and pads. Stick with oem floating evo discs, dont go for ebc drilled or anything like that as they are one peice and not as good. Std pads will overheat and fade, standard fluid will also overheat. Even a stripped M3 is still quite heavy, Performance Friction 01 compound are a good hard pad, other swear by Pagid RS29. Motul RBF 600 is good fluid. Also consider upgrading the brake lines to stainless steel braided lines. Improved brake cooling is a good idea, ducting air from the bumper ducts to the rear of the discs and remove the backing plates. Try these upgrades and see how you go, eventually you may want to go full big brake kit but not essential to start with.
Handling:
Make sure all your bushes are sound and consider upgrading to polybuhes, any dodgy bushes will make your handling erratic. Also get a 4 wheel alignment done by a recommended specialist.
You will probably find std suspension a bit soft, upgrading will depend on your wallet I've run with BC coilovers for a year and have been happy with them. GAZ gold are slightly more expensive next step up with better choice of spring rates, or you can go the whole hog with £3K worth of intrax or similar..
Good Tyres are essential, R888s are one of the best road legal much more grip than most road tyres -quite expensive and can wear quite quickly. Hankook and Kumho also do good tyres. Invest in a good tyre pressure guage and read up on hot/cold pressures - correct pressures will give you good handling and less wear.
An Xbrace from cabriolet is a good upgrade, stiffens up the front end more than a strut brace, depends on how extensive your cage is of course. Also look at rear suspension top mounts, new coilovers may come with top mounts but also worth adding re-inforcing lates from the Z3
Theres plenty other things to add, stiffer arbs, high ratio steering rack, once youve done the basics.
Cockpit:
If your fitting race seats and a cage presume your adding harnesses. Take care where/how you mount the harnesses, getting it wrong can do serious damage to back or nether regions. Theres some very specific requirements for harness angles, placement, fixing, etc
Steering wheel ? You will probably want a race wheel as the std is a bit thin/large/slippy
Again the list can go on to suit your budget/time
also if not done already an oil change with good oils, consider doing gearbox and diff oils as well as the engine.
An air filter upgrade with cold air intake is simple to do and sounds good, probably marginal power gain though.
Probably best thing to do is get out on track, get some drving done and see what you feel needs improved.
Another good forum is bmwtrackzone.com, lots of journals to read up on.
Good luck and post up some pictures !
John
Brakes:
Standard EVO discs & calipers are OK for tracking but you will need uprated fluid and pads. Stick with oem floating evo discs, dont go for ebc drilled or anything like that as they are one peice and not as good. Std pads will overheat and fade, standard fluid will also overheat. Even a stripped M3 is still quite heavy, Performance Friction 01 compound are a good hard pad, other swear by Pagid RS29. Motul RBF 600 is good fluid. Also consider upgrading the brake lines to stainless steel braided lines. Improved brake cooling is a good idea, ducting air from the bumper ducts to the rear of the discs and remove the backing plates. Try these upgrades and see how you go, eventually you may want to go full big brake kit but not essential to start with.
Handling:
Make sure all your bushes are sound and consider upgrading to polybuhes, any dodgy bushes will make your handling erratic. Also get a 4 wheel alignment done by a recommended specialist.
You will probably find std suspension a bit soft, upgrading will depend on your wallet I've run with BC coilovers for a year and have been happy with them. GAZ gold are slightly more expensive next step up with better choice of spring rates, or you can go the whole hog with £3K worth of intrax or similar..
Good Tyres are essential, R888s are one of the best road legal much more grip than most road tyres -quite expensive and can wear quite quickly. Hankook and Kumho also do good tyres. Invest in a good tyre pressure guage and read up on hot/cold pressures - correct pressures will give you good handling and less wear.
An Xbrace from cabriolet is a good upgrade, stiffens up the front end more than a strut brace, depends on how extensive your cage is of course. Also look at rear suspension top mounts, new coilovers may come with top mounts but also worth adding re-inforcing lates from the Z3
Theres plenty other things to add, stiffer arbs, high ratio steering rack, once youve done the basics.
Cockpit:
If your fitting race seats and a cage presume your adding harnesses. Take care where/how you mount the harnesses, getting it wrong can do serious damage to back or nether regions. Theres some very specific requirements for harness angles, placement, fixing, etc
Steering wheel ? You will probably want a race wheel as the std is a bit thin/large/slippy
Again the list can go on to suit your budget/time
also if not done already an oil change with good oils, consider doing gearbox and diff oils as well as the engine.
An air filter upgrade with cold air intake is simple to do and sounds good, probably marginal power gain though.
Probably best thing to do is get out on track, get some drving done and see what you feel needs improved.
Another good forum is bmwtrackzone.com, lots of journals to read up on.
Good luck and post up some pictures !
John
I have been running a stripped and caged 328i for the last two years and have just started tracking my M3 Evo. In fact, Thursday at Cadwell was the first.
I ran GAZ GHA coilovers on the 328 which I think are a good budget option but now have Bilstein PSS9 Clubsport on the M3. They are a revelation and I highly recommend them. They took the kerbs much better than the GAZ and provided quite unreal amounts of traction on corner exit, although the LSD is partly accountable. Even though the 328 was near 300 kgs lighter, I lapped only a second slower in the M3 and looking at datalogs, it was because of the brakes.
Brakes wise, another vote for Performance Friction. I've used Z rated (fast road), 97 and 01 compound race pads in the 328 and was running Z rated in the M3 on Thursday. I also have PF 2 piece discs on the M3. The Z rated coped well on the M3 but being used to the race pads, they didn't provide enough friction for my liking. I now have 06 pads ready to go in. These are good if you will be using your car on the road as well as track but it sounds like you won't be due to the level of prep. However, if you are, be wary of the 97 and 01 compounds for eating your discs and body paint if they aren't up to temp i.e. in road driving.
I ran GAZ GHA coilovers on the 328 which I think are a good budget option but now have Bilstein PSS9 Clubsport on the M3. They are a revelation and I highly recommend them. They took the kerbs much better than the GAZ and provided quite unreal amounts of traction on corner exit, although the LSD is partly accountable. Even though the 328 was near 300 kgs lighter, I lapped only a second slower in the M3 and looking at datalogs, it was because of the brakes.
Brakes wise, another vote for Performance Friction. I've used Z rated (fast road), 97 and 01 compound race pads in the 328 and was running Z rated in the M3 on Thursday. I also have PF 2 piece discs on the M3. The Z rated coped well on the M3 but being used to the race pads, they didn't provide enough friction for my liking. I now have 06 pads ready to go in. These are good if you will be using your car on the road as well as track but it sounds like you won't be due to the level of prep. However, if you are, be wary of the 97 and 01 compounds for eating your discs and body paint if they aren't up to temp i.e. in road driving.
just want to say a big thank you for all your suggestions, they will def help and i will be taking the advice, regarding the seats and harneses i had them fitted by mate who has a company who specialises in racing, i was concerned of back problems due to 2 back opps from racing bikes (track days lol)I went for cobra pro seats with 4 point harneses and have a smaller stearing wheel to be fitted with quick release boss to be welded on, cheers lads best regards richard
Yes I did, harnesses are all set up according to me and in the correct location. The full roll cage cost me £862 inc. vat. Fitting was an extra £800 approx of which i ended up getting back after a few months and many arguments over the phone, due to the muppets setting my wire loom on fire. I must say I would never use custom cages again as there attitude stunk!
dan101smith said:
iguana said:
Don't use bonnet catches if you want to ring it- use aeros, or leave it alone if keeping stock bonnet.
Are you not allowed bonnet catches at the Ring?http://z8.invisionfree.com/Northloop/index.php?sho...
Have a read of that thread, lots more safety bits been discussed, roll cage padding must have door cards etc, to be honest we hear these horror stories each yr ref, but 1300 odd ring miles last yr in my caged stripped track car & ive never ben stopped or noise tested, I would comply with all the above tho, daft not to.
I'd def not run bonnet pins tho, go for aerocatches.
Dan you coming on April 'ring track day?
Must say I'm seriously impressed with the Bilstein PSS9's, bought my Evo with them already fitted and they seem great so far. I can't compare them to stock/other E36 setups as I've never tried another E36, but purely on a ride comfort/composure and quality comparison with the 500 quid generic coilovers on my S13 they're a country mile ahead. I've yet to try them on track (waiting for the 'ring trip in a few months) but combined with the Federal RSR rubber on mine the dry grip feels endless.
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