E90 M3 handling quirks..?

[chunkychucky]

Hey guys, i'm going to fill you in on something that surprised me last weekend and would like any of you who have had similar experiences to pipe up!

I own a lovely E36 M3 evo and borrowed a friend's recently acquired E90 M3 saloon to take for a drive since I hadn't tried one but always fancied it. I was immediately impressed by the extra grunt and how much more tied down the car felt on the road (admittedly flowing a-roads, all within the speedlimits . All was good.

I then took the car to a ring road with dual-carriageway flowing between vraious roundabouts (for obvious reasons), came to the first roundabout in "M-mode" only for the DSC to bring proceedings to a halt! So along the next stretch I jabbed the DSC button to try and disengage it, although this did nothing. So my passenger did the same, with the same result. He then held the button down for between 2-3 seconds, and the DSC inactive light came up on the dashboard. I came off the sliproad and tested if the DSC was turned off (it was!), then headed back down the adjacent sliproad to head back in the direction I had just been. Now, this is where it went a bit wrong. I turned left onto the sliproad, gave it around half throttle, and all of a sudden the back was out at 45/50 degrees. I gathered it up, waited until the car was settled and again pointing straight ahead, again gave it half throttle, and it went a bit more wrong, with an excursion into the verge! I am struggling to comprehend what went wrong, as I have been driving very fast cars for the past 30 years, but the back end on this M3 when the DSC button had been fiddled with felt as if it was on ice, and I was wondering could this have done something strange to the electronic diff? Any help appreciated! And just to add to the confusion, I took my E36 down the exact same sliproad today in the exact same manner and nothing unexpected happened :/

Cheers,
Chuck

[waremark]

I am pretty shocked that you would treat a borrowed car in that way. Generally, the current M3 is extremely predictably and accurately driftable. I would expect there to be a significant difference between 286 and 414 bhp??

[Jespin]

Was thinking the same thing, bet you mate is well pleased... glad you're not one of mine!

[chunkychucky]

waremark said:

I am pretty shocked that you would treat a borrowed car in that way. Generally, the current M3 is extremely predictably and accurately driftable. I would expect there to be a significant difference between 286 and 414 bhp??

Last time I checked E36 M3 evo had 321bhp? Plus mine had the "press prep pack" from new which i have been informed from Munich yielded another 20-odd bhp from a blueprint. As for your shock, you are commenting without knowing the facts. A) the passenger was the owner of the car, who was encouraging the lurid driving, B) I owe him one as he kindly sent me skidding 30 feet down the road on my face a number of years ago, hospitalising me in a coma for 2 months leaving me with 18 months of trips to a Birmingham specialist, and C) he had done exactly the same thing a couple of days before. That last point is the specific reason I am posting this, as he had a piece of the plastic underbody moulding which had been torn off during his "off-road excursion", and since you have experience of the current M3's being so easily driftable, could you tell me would de-activating the dsc have caused the electronic M-diff to have a funny moment?

[Great Pretender]

waremark said:

I am pretty shocked that you would treat a borrowed car in that way. Generally, the current M3 is extremely predictably and accurately driftable. I would expect there to be a significant difference between 286 and 414 bhp??

Pistonheads: pointing the finger without having a fking clue, matters.

[cpufreak]

e9x M3 is very predictable, and driftable.

where the major difference in power delivery to a straight six powered M3, is the fact you've a big flat torque curve...as such its much keener and quicker to play the hooligan

This took a while to get used to compared to my previous CSL

Once its sideways, you can hold it there on the throttle... without needing the steering, as demonstrated here:

Edited by cpufreak on Wednesday 7th April 08:25

[Koing]

Great Pretender said:

waremark said:

I am pretty shocked that you would treat a borrowed car in that way. Generally, the current M3 is extremely predictably and accurately driftable. I would expect there to be a significant difference between 286 and 414 bhp??

Pistonheads: pointing the finger without having a fking clue, matters.

Standard!

It will be good to see what people reply with.

Koing

[Crusoe]

Could be the DSC hiding a issue with worn inside edges of the tyres, wrong pressure on one side etc.

[MC99]

Mine's been utterly predictable, talk to any of the instructors at Bedford who drive standard E92 M3s for their M3 masters, predictability is something they need as a prerequisite. As for the one you drove, hard to say.

[chunkychucky]

Great Pretender thankyou, they were just trying hi-jack the thread without knowing the full story and in no way assisting me!

CPUFreak, beautiful slide, only really sort of proves i must be a bit of a muppet :S

I can clearly see that unless there was an error in my driving, there may well have been something wrong with the car, or either that some oil on the sliproad surface as that is all I can attribute for the car snapping sideways in such a violent manner.

Thanks for all the help guys, i'll ask my friend to check the tyre pressures/tread depths and see where we stand,

Chuck

[shunt]

cpufreak said:

without needing the steering

Ah - the 'handsfree' kit.

[MarkM3Evoplus]

Get a four wheel alignment check too.

[cpufreak]

chunkychucky said:

CPUFreak, beautiful slide, only really sort of proves i must be a bit of a muppet :S

I can clearly see that unless there was an error in my driving, there may well have been something wrong with the car, or either that some oil on the sliproad surface as that is all I can attribute for the car snapping sideways in such a violent manner.

thanks.

No the point I was making, is that the E9x M3, whilst it only has 100bhp more than an E36 M3 Evo/E46 M3, it has a shed load more torque low down... and thus its much easier to light up the rear tyres... and you need to be quick to catch it... once its caught you can modulate it on the throttle perfectly!

as you'll see from the video below, its quite easy to get it wrong, too

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gGs02COBk_o

[waremark]

chunkychucky said:

waremark said:

I am pretty shocked that you would treat a borrowed car in that way. Generally, the current M3 is extremely predictably and accurately driftable. I would expect there to be a significant difference between 286 and 414 bhp??

Last time I checked E36 M3 evo had 321bhp?

Apologies for that; I did not notice the 'Evo'. As to the owner of the car being in the passenger seat, that was a rather relevant fact for you not to mention! It seemed unlikely given that neither of you had bothered to find out how the controls worked (but then I am old enough to read instruction books). But of course the owner being happy with what you were doing does change matters.

You think the M3 has an electronic diff. Is that so? I am very ignorant about diffs, but I thought the M Diff was mechanical.

Anyway, everyone seems to agree on the key point, which is that in general these cars are extremely predictable. One further point is that in a straight line even on a wet surface they will take full power in second gear. So your experience seems to be down to surface or to condition of car/tyres.

[krallicious]

I had the rear step out very quickly off a roundabout in the wet on a 2nd to 3rd gear change. Nearside wheel pan up and pointed me towards the central reservation. I over corrected and the rear slide onto the nearside verge and just managed to gather up the car before pulling over to allow my arse to unclench itself.

This happen with the DCS on, not in M-mode either. It has never happen since and, although I am still trying to learn how to full control (slide) my car, from what I have discovered so far it is very predictable and forgiving.

[cpufreak]

waremark said:

You think the M3 has an electronic diff. Is that so? I am very ignorant about diffs, but I thought the M Diff was mechanical.

Anyway, everyone seems to agree on the key point, which is that in general these cars are extremely predictable. One further point is that in a straight line even on a wet surface they will take full power in second gear. So your experience seems to be down to surface or to condition of car/tyres.

The M-diff is mechanical. however it does allow for a variable amount of slip..

With regard to lighting the tyres up in a straight line... typically the rear end would wander toward the kerb in mine.. it was predictable... but I remember going across putney bridge once... it was wet.. and I accelerated relatively smartly away from the lights... and the rear end went left a little... the person who tried to undertake me backed off when they saw my rear end moving... needless to say I caught it, and brought it back in line... it is predictable.. and easy to catch... but it breaks away quicker than a previous generation M3.

[MC99]

mines done the same on putney bridge...heading north by anychance?

[Rags]

This could be one of you, I followed an M3 that had a dink in its rear bumper through putney. You had parked up off the high street and drove the opposite way to upper richmond road. Couple of months back. I was in a grey saloon.

O/T Who finds their e90 / e92 m3 not great at absorbing london roads. I find the ride more bumpy than i expected tbh.

Conversely, I took it down to the brighton last weekend and the flatter country roads made me love my car again!

[cpufreak]

MC99 said:

mines done the same on putney bridge...heading north by anychance?

yes!!

[cpufreak]

Rags said:

This could be one of you, I followed an M3 that had a dink in its rear bumper through putney. You had parked up off the high street and drove the opposite way to upper richmond road. Couple of months back. I was in a grey saloon.

O/T Who finds their e90 / e92 m3 not great at absorbing london roads. I find the ride more bumpy than i expected tbh.

Conversely, I took it down to the brighton last weekend and the flatter country roads made me love my car again!

mine was jerez black.


sold now... great car.... shame about the economy.