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Ok, I want to discuss the most controversial subject amongst watch enthusiasts. The subject is PARNIS. Some WIS's see them as them as evil, and something only the devil will wear, whilst others appreciate them for what they are. Hands up, I fall in to the latter category. Parnis watches are almost solely homage, but are not fakes. That said, some say the business finance factories in China who do make replica watches. This doesn't bother me though, because I don't buy them. Parnis are a mushroom business, and that is to say they supply designs to various factories who are monitored by the Parnis QC control. The chances are that you can buy an identical watch on the internet for quite different companies. I have found a supplier who sells me a great product for a very good price, and also offers very good service. Those of you who don't like homage watches, or don't like Chinese goods, please look away, but please remember that a large percentage of your household goods are made in China, namely APPLE.
What other watch manufacturer can supply a watch to you with sapphire glass, a 120 click ceramic bezel, a 316L well finished case, a beautifully finished bracelet, and a Miyota auto movement for £82 ($100). Of course, like any manufacturer spec's vary, but the value for money is always outstanding. Parnis break the mould because what they offer is far to good for the dosh. Chinese production costs are far less than those in Europe, Japan, and the U.S, and this accompanied by their business plan to sell at volume with a low margin enables them to sell the product at more than a reasonable price. Of course, not supplying the box that only ends up in a cupboard also helps.
I own about 7 Parnis watches if you include Debert, Corgeut, and Bliger, which are their brands also. I am always amazed at the quality I get for the money. Of course, they don't meet the standards and quality of a luxury watch brand, but at 1% of the price what do you expect. I believe that a watch enthusiast on a budget really can't do better.
Anyway, the ball is in your court, so what do you think ?
What other watch manufacturer can supply a watch to you with sapphire glass, a 120 click ceramic bezel, a 316L well finished case, a beautifully finished bracelet, and a Miyota auto movement for £82 ($100). Of course, like any manufacturer spec's vary, but the value for money is always outstanding. Parnis break the mould because what they offer is far to good for the dosh. Chinese production costs are far less than those in Europe, Japan, and the U.S, and this accompanied by their business plan to sell at volume with a low margin enables them to sell the product at more than a reasonable price. Of course, not supplying the box that only ends up in a cupboard also helps.
I own about 7 Parnis watches if you include Debert, Corgeut, and Bliger, which are their brands also. I am always amazed at the quality I get for the money. Of course, they don't meet the standards and quality of a luxury watch brand, but at 1% of the price what do you expect. I believe that a watch enthusiast on a budget really can't do better.
Anyway, the ball is in your court, so what do you think ?
Do you work for Parnis or something? It's becoming a bit of a pet subject for you, isn't it? 
I had one, and as I said on another of your Parnis threads, it was really noisy. I have since learned that the enthusiast on a budget can do better, I'm afraid.
I'm not convinced that you always get the sapphire that they claim, and I would take issue with the suggestion that the bracelets are "beautifully finished".
However, many of the negatives only become apparent when compared to more expensive watches (I'm talking £2-300 here, not necessarily £2-3000), and so within the bubble in which Parnis et al reside, they are probably as you decsribe them.
If I was on a budget, rather than buying 2 or 3 Parnis or other mushroom brands, I'd be buying 1 Seiko, or Zodiac or something with a better reputation, and some brand history.
I accept that from there it's a slippery slope to spending £400-500 on a Steinhart, and from there to £1k, £2k and so on, but for me, that's the enjoyment in watches.
If you have half a dozen or so Parnis-alikes, then you've already spent enough to get one or two better watches. It just would have take longer to get them. Life shouldn't always be about instant gratification, IMO, and by researching the best way to spend a little more money, you'll open up another world of brands and options.
Given that the Parnis type stuff has effectively a zero resale value, I'd argue that, with patience, the watch enthusiast on a budget can indeed do better.
Sorry
I had one, and as I said on another of your Parnis threads, it was really noisy. I have since learned that the enthusiast on a budget can do better, I'm afraid.
I'm not convinced that you always get the sapphire that they claim, and I would take issue with the suggestion that the bracelets are "beautifully finished".
However, many of the negatives only become apparent when compared to more expensive watches (I'm talking £2-300 here, not necessarily £2-3000), and so within the bubble in which Parnis et al reside, they are probably as you decsribe them.
If I was on a budget, rather than buying 2 or 3 Parnis or other mushroom brands, I'd be buying 1 Seiko, or Zodiac or something with a better reputation, and some brand history.
I accept that from there it's a slippery slope to spending £400-500 on a Steinhart, and from there to £1k, £2k and so on, but for me, that's the enjoyment in watches.
If you have half a dozen or so Parnis-alikes, then you've already spent enough to get one or two better watches. It just would have take longer to get them. Life shouldn't always be about instant gratification, IMO, and by researching the best way to spend a little more money, you'll open up another world of brands and options.
Given that the Parnis type stuff has effectively a zero resale value, I'd argue that, with patience, the watch enthusiast on a budget can indeed do better.
Sorry
Doofus said:
Do you work for Parnis or something? It's becoming a bit of a pet subject for you, isn't it?
I had one, and as I said on another of your Parnis threads, it was really noisy. I have since learned that the enthusiast on a budget can do better, I'm afraid.
I'm not convinced that you always get the sapphire that they claim, and I would take issue with the suggestion that the bracelets are "beautifully finished".
However, many of the negatives only become apparent when compared to more expensive watches (I'm talking £2-300 here, not necessarily £2-3000), and so within the bubble in which Parnis et al reside, they are probably as you decsribe them.
If I was on a budget, rather than buying 2 or 3 Parnis or other mushroom brands, I'd be buying 1 Seiko, or Zodiac or something with a better reputation, and some brand history.
I accept that from there it's a slippery slope to spending £400-500 on a Steinhart, and from there to £1k, £2k and so on, but for me, that's the enjoyment in watches.
If you have half a dozen or so Parnis-alikes, then you've already spent enough to get one or two better watches. It just would have take longer to get them. Life shouldn't always be about instant gratification, IMO, and by researching the best way to spend a little more money, you'll open up another world of brands and options.
Given that the Parnis type stuff has effectively a zero resale value, I'd argue that, with patience, the watch enthusiast on a budget can indeed do better.
Sorry
LOL. If you think I work for Parnis, you have the WONG person. Agree, Steinhart, or even Chris Ward are better watches. As it happens I own a CW C60-600 Trident, and it's a lovely watch. My observations are made on value for money, NOT total quality. With regards to resale value, you couldn't be more wrong. Have a look on eBay at the resale prices and you will see that they are incredible. I genuinely wish you were right that better watches can be bought at the same prices. My purchasing power is limited, and I have spent many an hour trying to get similar spec watches at the same sort of prices. Whilst I like brands such as Seiko, and own a couple myself, what you get for the money doesn't get anywhere close. Of course, if you don't like them that is entirely your choice. I was a great fan of Kia cars well before the public realised how good they are, I would like to think my judgement in the watch world is similar, but who knows ?I had one, and as I said on another of your Parnis threads, it was really noisy. I have since learned that the enthusiast on a budget can do better, I'm afraid.
I'm not convinced that you always get the sapphire that they claim, and I would take issue with the suggestion that the bracelets are "beautifully finished".
However, many of the negatives only become apparent when compared to more expensive watches (I'm talking £2-300 here, not necessarily £2-3000), and so within the bubble in which Parnis et al reside, they are probably as you decsribe them.
If I was on a budget, rather than buying 2 or 3 Parnis or other mushroom brands, I'd be buying 1 Seiko, or Zodiac or something with a better reputation, and some brand history.
I accept that from there it's a slippery slope to spending £400-500 on a Steinhart, and from there to £1k, £2k and so on, but for me, that's the enjoyment in watches.
If you have half a dozen or so Parnis-alikes, then you've already spent enough to get one or two better watches. It just would have take longer to get them. Life shouldn't always be about instant gratification, IMO, and by researching the best way to spend a little more money, you'll open up another world of brands and options.
Given that the Parnis type stuff has effectively a zero resale value, I'd argue that, with patience, the watch enthusiast on a budget can indeed do better.
Sorry
I didn't say that you could get better for the same price, because at that price, everything is low quality. What I said was that intsead of buying two or three watches that you continually have to justify with VFM diatribes on the internet, you could buy one decent watch which other watch minded peple will appreciate.
You're the one who opened this thread with "what are your thoughts?". When I give them, you can't tell me I'm wrong because a) you asked for comments and b) I'm not.
You're the one who opened this thread with "what are your thoughts?". When I give them, you can't tell me I'm wrong because a) you asked for comments and b) I'm not.
TiggerBits said:
LOL. If you think I work for Parnis, you have the WONG person. Agree, Steinhart, or even Chris Ward are better watches. As it happens I own a CW C60-600 Trident, and it's a lovely watch. My observations are made on value for money, NOT total quality. With regards to resale value, you couldn't be more wrong. Have a look on eBay at the resale prices and you will see that they are incredible. I genuinely wish you were right that better watches can be bought at the same prices. My purchasing power is limited, and I have spent many an hour trying to get similar spec watches at the same sort of prices. Whilst I like brands such as Seiko, and own a couple myself, what you get for the money doesn't get anywhere close. Of course, if you don't like them that is entirely your choice. I was a great fan of Kia cars well before the public realised how good they are, I would like to think my judgement in the watch world is similar, but who knows ?
There's a strange beauty in someone denying they work for a Chinese company misspelling wrong to WONG.TimLambert7 said:
TiggerBits said:
LOL. If you think I work for Parnis, you have the WONG person. Agree, Steinhart, or even Chris Ward are better watches. As it happens I own a CW C60-600 Trident, and it's a lovely watch. My observations are made on value for money, NOT total quality. With regards to resale value, you couldn't be more wrong. Have a look on eBay at the resale prices and you will see that they are incredible. I genuinely wish you were right that better watches can be bought at the same prices. My purchasing power is limited, and I have spent many an hour trying to get similar spec watches at the same sort of prices. Whilst I like brands such as Seiko, and own a couple myself, what you get for the money doesn't get anywhere close. Of course, if you don't like them that is entirely your choice. I was a great fan of Kia cars well before the public realised how good they are, I would like to think my judgement in the watch world is similar, but who knows ?
There's a strange beauty in someone denying they work for a Chinese company misspelling wrong to WONG.
Paul Drawmer said:
Do Parnis do anything original?
Yes, but not many. I have one of their divers watches. The watch pictured below has AR sapphire, a Miyota auto movement, is 200m WR, a nicely crafted 316L stainless case, 120 click ceramic bezel which turns like a top quality watch, guilloche dial, and a solid well fitting strap. £82 delivered. 
tDoofus said:
I didn't say that you could get better for the same price, because at that price, everything is low quality. What I said was that intsead of buying two or three watches that you continually have to justify with VFM diatribes on the internet, you could buy one decent watch which other watch minded peple will appreciate.
You're the one who opened this thread with "what are your thoughts?". When I give them, you can't tell me I'm wrong because a) you asked for comments and b) I'm not.
That's a decent argument, but the fact is spending three times as much on a watch doesn't give me a watch three times better. When I buy a watch I look at the specification. I already own a few dearer watches, and they are very nice, but in reality the additional amount I paid for them was never actually worth it. I own a very nice Parnis homage to a Panerai power reserve. To be honest it's quite faultless and comes on a beautiful strap. It cost me £70. I have the opportunity to buy a 14 year old genuine Panerai of the same model at a bargain price of £1500. Whilst this is a bargain, and the watch of course is better than my Parnis, but it certainly isn't 25 times better. I will give you an another example, but this time not a watch. I have just ordered a new mobile phone because my present one is dying. I did my research and read the reviews, and as a result bought a fairly high spec'd Chinese phone for £83. A Samsung or HTC with the same spec would cost about £500. I spent most of my working life in the retail industry, and if there is one thing I learned, it's you DON'T get what you pay for. My companies own brand merchandise was significantly better value for money than the branded merchandise we also sold.You're the one who opened this thread with "what are your thoughts?". When I give them, you can't tell me I'm wrong because a) you asked for comments and b) I'm not.
When I buy a watch I look at the following (A) it's specification (B) it's design (C) it's value for money (D) can I afford it. If after that it meets all the criteria, I may then look at the name on the dial. I consider myself a watch enthusiast, not a brand enthusiast. That said, there are many types of watch collector, and I wouldn't dream of deriding someone who only wished to buy luxury brand watches, because that's where they get their pleasure from. Nor would I condone someone for only ever wanting to own Timex or Casio watches.
TiggerBits said:
That's a decent argument, but the fact is spending three times as much on a watch doesn't give me a watch three times better. When I buy a watch I look at the specification. I already own a few dearer watches, and they are very nice, but in reality the additional amount I paid for them was never actually worth it. I own a very nice Parnis homage to a Panerai power reserve. To be honest it's quite faultless and comes on a beautiful strap. It cost me £70. I have the opportunity to buy a 14 year old genuine Panerai of the same model at a bargain price of £1500. Whilst this is a bargain, and the watch of course is better than my Parnis, but it certainly isn't 25 times better. I will give you an another example, but this time not a watch. I have just ordered a new mobile phone because my present one is dying. I did my research and read the reviews, and as a result bought a fairly high spec'd Chinese phone for £83. A Samsung or HTC with the same spec would cost about £500. I spent most of my working life in the retail industry, and if there is one thing I learned, it's you DON'T get what you pay for. My companies own brand merchandise was significantly better value for money than the branded merchandise we also sold.
When I buy a watch I look at the following (A) it's specification (B) it's design (C) it's value for money (D) can I afford it. If after that it meets all the criteria, I may then look at the name on the dial. I consider myself a watch enthusiast, not a brand enthusiast. That said, there are many types of watch collector, and I wouldn't dream of deriding someone who only wished to buy luxury brand watches, because that's where they get their pleasure from. Nor would I condone someone for only ever wanting to own Timex or Casio watches.
You talk about 'value for money' as if it's an empirical measure. It's not. It's subjective. you say "the fact is spending three times as much on a watch doesn't give me a watch three times better." By what measure? Again, this is subjective.When I buy a watch I look at the following (A) it's specification (B) it's design (C) it's value for money (D) can I afford it. If after that it meets all the criteria, I may then look at the name on the dial. I consider myself a watch enthusiast, not a brand enthusiast. That said, there are many types of watch collector, and I wouldn't dream of deriding someone who only wished to buy luxury brand watches, because that's where they get their pleasure from. Nor would I condone someone for only ever wanting to own Timex or Casio watches.
If you're happy to wear a watch which elicits no response from anyone who isn't interested, and the wrong response from anyone who is, then fine., its your dime.
Certain watches have registered (and theoretically protected) design elements, and the Panerai Luminor is one of them. You're happy to wear one, and yet in an earlier post, you said you don't buy replicas. Well yours may not say Panerai on the dial, but the design of the case, the crown guard, the dial and the hands are direct rip-offs, pure and simple. We can talk for days about whether a Steinhart Ocean One is a rip-off of a Rolex Submariner, and whether the Rolex ripped off something else before that, but the fact is that the case shape, and the style of hands aren't Rolex registered designs.
I own two retail companies, and I can tell you, without a shadow of a doubt, that you are wrong to say that you don't get what you pay for. That doesn't mean some things aren't more expensive than they ought to be, but if you try to buy an alternative to some of our stuff for a third of the price, you will regret it, and I have customer feedback telling me just that.
If the value for money for Parnis is so high, then why do you still own more expensive watches? This is a genuine question. Why not sell those, and buy more Parnii? Why do you keep them?
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