Windows in airliners

[Willy Nilly]

Is there any reason why planes have windows other that to let the passengers see out? I read a book about the A380 and seem to remember it saying that windows were a bit of a problem. So why not have a little camera mounted in the outer skin opposite each row of seats and have a nice big screen instead of a window? You could even have channels which showed the cockpit view and a camera underneath so you could see what you are flying over?

[RobDickinson]

Other than too see out?

[Simpo Two]

I'll stick to windows thanks.

There may well be a motion sickness issue too.

[edcs]

Windows are easier to see through from the outside too. Particularly useful for rescue crews...

[HoHoHo]

I flew to Sharm earlier this year and our window seat had no window (was a Monarch Airbus of some description).

Apparently becuase it's in line with the turbine blades (seems odd however that was the excuse Monarch gave) and if you fly without a window it totally fks you up!

You know what's happening by your inner ear telling you, you see the fusalage moving to the left, right, up and down and in fact have a greater sense of movement.

But it's horrible and I don't want to experience that again.

[anonymous-user]

HoHoHo said:

Apparently becuase it's in line with the turbine blades (seems odd however that was the excuse Monarch gave) and if you fly without a window it totally fks you up!

I expect, but don't know 100%, it's because other operators had a toilet or galley on the aircraft type you were on. Monarch however opted to add another few rows of seats instead.

[IforB]

That's a load of tosh about the turbine blades. If it was a turbo prop, then yes, it's true, but a jet shouldn't need it.

I apologise for one of my colleagues telling you a load of bunk.

El Stovey, we run all of our aircraft under their maximum capacity, our 320's have 174 seats, 321's have 214. We could ram an extra row in if we wanted, but it would knacker the pitch of the seats even more.

You could fit seats in a freighter and ignore windows, but I can't imagine many people wanting to fly like that though!

[longshot]

HoHoHo said:

Apparently becuase it's in line with the turbine blades (seems odd however that was the excuse Monarch gave)

If a turbine blade made it out of the case and into the fuselage, you'd have bigger things to worry about.

Infact, I wonder if an aircraft window would hold up a blade for longer than the fuselage skin?

[odyssey2200]

Why are the windows always so bloody low down?

You would have to be a midget to be able to see out of them without getting a terminal neck ache.

dyswidt?

[anonymous-user]

IforB, I've just flown Monarch for the first time to Lanzarote and back. I've done a fair bit of flying in my time, but my god the seat spacing on those flights was bonkers!

I'm only 5'10" and my knees were touching the seat in front, digging in the wire frame for the magazines and safety card unless I sat with my legs completely apart. When I went to put the table down to eat some nosh I had to recline my seat as my stomach wouldn't let the thing come down (I'm not THAT fat), the woman sat next to me who was a 6 footer couldn't sit with her legs straight and had to move to another extra legroom seat.

Blew my mind.

[Geneve]

Wasn't window design a contributory factor in the airframe fatigue that blighted early Comets?

[SpeckledJim]

Geneve said:

Wasn't window design a contributory factor in the airframe fatigue that blighted early Comets?

IIRC square-cut window apertures focused stresses at their corners, and cracked. Hundreds and hundreds of people died.

Now windows have large-radius corners.

[onyx39]

Don't the Yanks use C5's as troop carriers, surely no windows in there?

[edcs]

SpeckledJim said:

IIRC square-cut window apertures focused stresses at their corners, and cracked. Hundreds and hundreds of people died.

Now windows have large-radius corners.

They were also supposed to be bonded and riveted. It was too difficult to do that so they bodged them in with a few rivets and then wondered why they started to fall apart.

[Eric Mc]

Geneve said:

Wasn't window design a contributory factor in the airframe fatigue that blighted early Comets?

The fatal flaw in the one Comet where they recovered sufficient wreckage to determine the cause of the break up (G-ALYP) wasn't actually in a window. It was in the ADF aerial aperture in the roof. However, the Comet that failed under test in the water tank at Farnborough (G-ALYU) suffered a fatigue failure of a passenger cabin window.

So, it was obvious that the fundamental design of the apertures (for windows, doors and aerials) in the Comet 1 were fatally flawed.

Since the Comet 1 disasters, I cannot think of a single structural failure of an airliners cause by a window failing.

[Eric Mc]

SpeckledJim said:

Geneve said:

Wasn't window design a contributory factor in the airframe fatigue that blighted early Comets?

IIRC square-cut window apertures focused stresses at their corners, and cracked. Hundreds and hundreds of people died.

Now windows have large-radius corners.

Hundreds were most definitely not killed. The Comet 1 was not a very big aeroplane by modern standards. Two Comet 1s were definitely lost due to fatigue failures. One other was PROBABLY lost due to the same cause. The total number of fatalities in these three crashes came to 99.

[SpeckledJim]

Eric Mc said:

SpeckledJim said:

Geneve said:

Wasn't window design a contributory factor in the airframe fatigue that blighted early Comets?

IIRC square-cut window apertures focused stresses at their corners, and cracked. Hundreds and hundreds of people died.

Now windows have large-radius corners.

Hundreds were most definitely not killed. The Comet 1 was not a very big aeroplane by modern standards. Two Comet 1s were definitely lost due to fatigue failures. One other was PROBABLY lost due to the same cause. The total number of fatalities in these three crashes came to 99.

In my orthopaedic shoes I stand corrected.

[Engineer1]

odyssey2200 said:

Why are the windows always so bloody low down?

You would have to be a midget to be able to see out of them without getting a terminal neck ache.

dyswidt?

This is a good question, I assume there will be an engineering reason

[V41LEY]

Eric Mc said:

Since the Comet 1 disasters, I cannot think of a single structural failure of an airliners cause by a window failing.

There were no fatalities as I recall but remember that BA plane where the windscreen had been incorrectly refitted with 'screws' too short which failed under pressurisation and the pilot was sucked out but saved by his co-pilot who held onto his ankles until they were able to land.

Re windows on planes - always check seat guru.com to check that your seat has a window. Some plane configurations mean there is not always a window seat on your row.
Lots of other useful stuff as well.

[FourWheelDrift]

Vickers Viscounts were sold on their big windows, they were still being flow in the 21st century in Africa.