Sit On fishing kayak for river use with dog...

[Tiggsy]

After a kayak that the (small) dog can sit on too - seems a sea fishing type set up may be ideal as they have large rear sections for fishing gear (or dog beds!)

Are these things best picked up almost new off the bay or is there a benefit in the latest model new?

And I assume longer = faster - I don't need a "nimble" boat, I'm going up and down the Thames, so just go long for fast and stable in a straight line?

[RikJonAtk]

I've used the solid plastic sea kayaks on holiday and never find them particularly stable tbh. The practicalities of a dog and fishing gear in one boggles my brain entirely.

I spent two weeks in a fibreglass Canoe over in algonquin and that was great... Canoe > Kayak for what you want imho.

[Athlon]

Frenzy's are very stable, I have never been chucked off yet and I get into some big swells. Maybe a bit small for fishing but Ocean Kayak do some fishing specific yaks.

[Equus]

Any fishing SoT kayak will have a 'tank well' behind the seat that's designed to take a milk-crate sized tackle box, and they are designed to be stable fishing platforms at sea, so you'd have no problems with stability in the Thames. I've got an Ocean Kayaks 'Torque' (which comes fitted with an electric trolling motor, if you want to be lazy). It's my third sea fishing kayak, and I've yet to get wet unintentionally.

They're not the fastest or most maneuverable things, though, but yes, longer hulls are usually faster.

How big is your dog, though? I guess a fishing SoT would be ok up to smallish labrador size, but it's not going to be terribly comfortable for bigger dogs than that - and it depends how patient/steady you dog is as to whether they will settle in the back, or get restless.

Bear in mind that SoT's have 'scuppers' (basically holes that run through the hull to self-drain them) so the floor of tankwell would normally be wet. You can get 'scupper bungs' to block the holes up, though, if you want to try to keep the area dry. Not advisable if you're going to sea, as it risks the tankwell being swamped by waves, but again you should be fine on the Thames.


A Canadian style open canoe might be a better bet, though - Griff Rhys Jones seemed to manage fine with his labrador, when he did his TV series on British rivers.

[robm3]

If you fancy going longer distances I can recommend the Hobie Outback or Revolution 13 with Mirage Drive system.

We had two of these, used to put the kids behind us and used them all over the Pittwater and Sydney Harbour, plenty of space for the dog too.


https://www.hobie.com/au/en/kayaks/mirage-outback/

Here's the only video I could find of us on them, pretty average video sorry. They're pretty quick when you get going though, much faster than normal paddling, pretty similar to riding a bike actually.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VmgB1CBb6DM

Cut to about 1.04 in to see the speed.

Edited by robm3 on Monday 10th July 10:28

[Ean218]

We bought an Ocean Kayak Malibu XL second hand via Ebay a few years ago, It was about half new price and came with back supports and paddles,

The other half and I just use it for paddling up the Thames with our Jack Russell. He is very happy sat/stood up front and always gets a wave from passing boats and has starred in many a foreign tourist's snaps in Windsor.

It is very stable on the river, we have never got wet accidentally, although the dog does get annoyed at reflections on the water and jumps in after them. He can swim well but he also has a dog bouyancy aid with a handle sewn on the back so we can reach in and get him back onboard.

[mcdjl]

Whereabouts on the Thames? The boat and kit you'd need near Windsor is quite different to what i'd suggest for near Maidstone.

[2gins]

Yes, because Maidstone is about 15 miles from the Thames ...

[mcdjl]

2gins said:

Yes, because Maidstone is about 15 miles from the Thames ...

Nice afternoons paddle that.
Ok, the boat I'd want for Windsor is different to what I'd want for central London, which is different again to that beyond Dagenham.

[RobM77]

Some of the early SoT kayaks were built with performance in mind, mirroring sit in kayaks, but the vast majority of SoT kayaks you'll see for sale now are extremely stable and designed for family use or fishing, both of which require stability above performance. Generally, stability is given by the width, so look for that. The other thing to consider is how high the kayak sits in the water; SoT kayaks sit very high, which increases their roll centre and harms stability. Two factors are at play here: the so called 'dry ride' and people's weight. With regard to the former, manufacturers design kayaks for use in warm climates where people paddle in everyday clothes, so they design them to sit high to keep people's arses dry, which is annoying if you don't mind the odd splash and would rather be more stable sitting down lower! Regarding the latter, many kayaks are designed for a 100kg person with 10kg of fishing stuff, so if you're 70kg when you get on one you'll sit much higher in the water, again reducing stability.

Note that there is such a thing as a SoT designed for fishing, with the various attachments for your rod/s etc that you'd find useful.

Lastly, do consider the weight of the kayak and the height of the roof of your car. Many of the fishing specific SoTs are very heavy (getting on for 30kg, or even more than that!), and unless you have a particularly low car, such as a 3 series, Golf R, or an older car built before the SUV craze, you may struggle to lift it on and off the roof without injury, and carry it into the garage/shed for storage. Longer kayaks can be difficult to manoeuvre into and out of storage too.

Edited by RobM77 on Monday 10th July 16:21

[RDBx]

robm3 said:

If you fancy going longer distances I can recommend the Hobie Outback or Revolution 13 with Mirage Drive system.

Edited by robm3 on Monday 10th July 10:28

To second this, spent a few hours sea fishing of Pembrokeshire this weekend on a Hobie with mirage drive. Brilliant bit of kit and quick. Really relaxing not using your arms, only downside is needing to be careful in the shallows due to the propulsion method.

[robm3]

RDBx said:

robm3 said:

If you fancy going longer distances I can recommend the Hobie Outback or Revolution 13 with Mirage Drive system.

Edited by robm3 on Monday 10th July 10:28

To second this, spent a few hours sea fishing of Pembrokeshire this weekend on a Hobie with mirage drive. Brilliant bit of kit and quick. Really relaxing not using your arms, only downside is needing to be careful in the shallows due to the propulsion method.

Once you've tried it you'll never paddle again.

The mechanics are fascinating, holding a paddle in front of you takes stamina, then using your arm muscles to propel the boat is extra effort.
Now think about the size of your leg muscles in comparison to arm, and you're in a sitting position (no effort), then you start to push and the speed is unreal.

Hobie had a video of a World Champion Kayaker paddling against one of their designers in a 'kayak tug of war', the Hobie guy was just laughing and talking as the World Champion tried his hardest. Brilliant stuff!

Oh Found It!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0rvFdLdplA

[mcdjl]

robm3 said:

Once you've tried it you'll never paddle again.

The mechanics are fascinating, holding a paddle in front of you takes stamina, then using your arm muscles to propel the boat is extra effort.
Now think about the size of your leg muscles in comparison to arm, and you're in a sitting position (no effort), then you start to push and the speed is unreal.

Hobie had a video of a World Champion Kayaker paddling against one of their designers in a 'kayak tug of war', the Hobie guy was just laughing and talking as the World Champion tried his hardest. Brilliant stuff!

Oh Found It!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0rvFdLdplA

Thats not so much to do with muscle sizes as physcics: with the normal paddle theres a 'long' time the blades aren't in the water, where as with the mirage the blades are constantly producing power. To paddle effectively normally you should actually put most of the effort through your stomach (core) and also use your legs. As the video shows, it won't help win the tug of war though!

[RobM77]

mcdjl said:

robm3 said:

Once you've tried it you'll never paddle again.

The mechanics are fascinating, holding a paddle in front of you takes stamina, then using your arm muscles to propel the boat is extra effort.
Now think about the size of your leg muscles in comparison to arm, and you're in a sitting position (no effort), then you start to push and the speed is unreal.

Hobie had a video of a World Champion Kayaker paddling against one of their designers in a 'kayak tug of war', the Hobie guy was just laughing and talking as the World Champion tried his hardest. Brilliant stuff!

Oh Found It!!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0rvFdLdplA

Thats not so much to do with muscle sizes as physcics: with the normal paddle theres a 'long' time the blades aren't in the water, where as with the mirage the blades are constantly producing power. To paddle effectively normally you should actually put most of the effort through your stomach (core) and also use your legs. As the video shows, it won't help win the tug of war though!

Of course, it depends what you want: transport or sport. When I used to kayak I did it partly because I wanted a workout that used and built different muscles to the usual running, cycling and walking.

[mcdjl]

RobM77 said:

Of course, it depends what you want: transport or sport. When I used to kayak I did it partly because I wanted a workout that used and built different muscles to the usual running, cycling and walking.

I want fun!