Learn to Sail - "Lazy"
Discussion
I fancy learning to sail a small dinghy/craft.
I tried a while ago but it was on a Laser Pico I think. Had to get a wetsuit on and spent more time falling in than sailing. I'm too old and decrepit for that s***e now. What Id like is a more stable boat where you sit at the back and just slide from side to side and use the tiller. Ideally that stable that a wetsuit not really needed. Not after racing speeds just a nice leisurely bimble round.
Is such a thing available? Is that what a wayfarer is basically? What should I be looking for when trying to track down a course of that nature?
Thanks
I tried a while ago but it was on a Laser Pico I think. Had to get a wetsuit on and spent more time falling in than sailing. I'm too old and decrepit for that s***e now. What Id like is a more stable boat where you sit at the back and just slide from side to side and use the tiller. Ideally that stable that a wetsuit not really needed. Not after racing speeds just a nice leisurely bimble round.
Is such a thing available? Is that what a wayfarer is basically? What should I be looking for when trying to track down a course of that nature?
Thanks
Are you planning on solo, or with a crew? Also where do you want to use it? Sea or rivers / lakes?
Any dinghy, including Wayfarer is capable of capsize, though some are more stable than others.
There are many older boats around that are too tired for racing but perfectly capable of bimbling. They are remarkably cheap, i think. If you are on your own then something light enough to handle easily on shore is important.
My experience of starter boats was a very long time ago but a Mirror is lightish, short and low powered (therefore less likely to tip you in).
Any dinghy, including Wayfarer is capable of capsize, though some are more stable than others.
There are many older boats around that are too tired for racing but perfectly capable of bimbling. They are remarkably cheap, i think. If you are on your own then something light enough to handle easily on shore is important.
My experience of starter boats was a very long time ago but a Mirror is lightish, short and low powered (therefore less likely to tip you in).
Edited by Duke Caboom on Thursday 23 July 09:59
No such thing as staying dry in a dinghy. At least not as a beginer anyway 
But yes a pico is designed to get you wet (well, sort of), there are plenty of more dry boats around.
Are you thinking of doing it on you own? That might change your selection of boat. Others might think differently but if single handing I would look at something smaller than a wayfarer. Maybe a mirror or a bosun?
Not that I am not an expert - it is 30 years since I really sailed a dinghy though I did take a bosun out a few years ago in very gusty winds and to my surprise I managed to stay reasonably dry
But yes a pico is designed to get you wet (well, sort of), there are plenty of more dry boats around.
Are you thinking of doing it on you own? That might change your selection of boat. Others might think differently but if single handing I would look at something smaller than a wayfarer. Maybe a mirror or a bosun?
Not that I am not an expert - it is 30 years since I really sailed a dinghy though I did take a bosun out a few years ago in very gusty winds and to my surprise I managed to stay reasonably dry
brman said:
No such thing as staying dry in a dinghy. At least not as a beginer anyway
But yes a pico is designed to get you wet (well, sort of), there are plenty of more dry boats around.
Are you thinking of doing it on you own? That might change your selection of boat. Others might think differently but if single handing I would look at something smaller than a wayfarer. Maybe a mirror or a bosun?
Not that I am not an expert - it is 30 years since I really sailed a dinghy though I did take a bosun out a few years ago in very gusty winds and to my surprise I managed to stay reasonably dry
Sorry brman - i wrote the same as you in an edit to my original post and now it looks like you copied me, when in fact we said the same thing interdependently. But yes a pico is designed to get you wet (well, sort of), there are plenty of more dry boats around.
Are you thinking of doing it on you own? That might change your selection of boat. Others might think differently but if single handing I would look at something smaller than a wayfarer. Maybe a mirror or a bosun?
Not that I am not an expert - it is 30 years since I really sailed a dinghy though I did take a bosun out a few years ago in very gusty winds and to my surprise I managed to stay reasonably dry
Anyway, OP, that's two votes for a Mirror.
Not sure a Mirror fits the bill TBH, but I do realise they can be de-powered to make them less tippy but that also makes them slow.
What's the budget, as something like a Character Boats Lytham Pilot is a nice, easy, and stable small boat to bimble about in and as the company name implies, it has an interesting history and some pleasing character to it.
https://www.characterboats.co.uk/lytham-pilot-12-6...
What's the budget, as something like a Character Boats Lytham Pilot is a nice, easy, and stable small boat to bimble about in and as the company name implies, it has an interesting history and some pleasing character to it.
https://www.characterboats.co.uk/lytham-pilot-12-6...
Cheers all, there's no budget as yet. Just want to have a few goes and see if I get on with it or not. Learn/Hire.
It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
Edited by CopperBolt on Thursday 23 July 12:46
CopperBolt said:
Cheers all, there's no budget as yet. Just want to have a few goes and see if I get on with it or not. Learn/Hire.
It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
Wetsuit for course as you learn the capsize drill, which means wet times. It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
Edited by CopperBolt on Thursday 23 July 12:46
There is a school at Muddyford (shoresports)and Christchurch, good place to learn in the harbour, but the run is not much fun
CopperBolt said:
Cheers all, there's no budget as yet. Just want to have a few goes and see if I get on with it or not. Learn/Hire.
It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
As you are a short distance from the Mudeford sailing club, I would join them as there must be a plethora of members only too willing to take you out as crew and teach you the ropes/talk all things dinghy and would be the first step towards deciding what you want.It would be just me for learning. Then maybe later be able to take one extra person with me for a cruise round say.
Would most courses expect you to wear a wetsuit then? Even with a "dry" boat?
Im in Dorset near Hengistbury Head if that helps anyone.
The Lytham Pilot looks just the thing, long term that I could see myself in, if I can learn to sail etc.
Thanks
Edited by CopperBolt on Thursday 23 July 12:46
http://www.mudefordsc.org/html/learning_to_sail.ht...
Not all members will be racers so have a word with their club sec to get a realistic viewpoint of what they're about. You'll learn a lot by being part of a club.
HTH
If you don't want to get an occasional dunking, why do you want a dinghy?
Even non-racing dinghy sailor risk getting a dip from time to time.
President of the dinghy cruising association getting wet:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-rJH9D_908&t=...
He's very experienced dinghy sailor, who has written books on the subject.
The best way to avoid getting a dunking is to carry a large lump of lead with you.
Even non-racing dinghy sailor risk getting a dip from time to time.
President of the dinghy cruising association getting wet:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-rJH9D_908&t=...
He's very experienced dinghy sailor, who has written books on the subject.
The best way to avoid getting a dunking is to carry a large lump of lead with you.
Look for an old Flying 15 perhaps - got some lead to keep you upright but still a dinghy feel.
Either that, or learn to sail a little better, and get a Wayfarer. Once you've got a rough idea what you are doing, in under 20 knots of breeze you're not particularly likely to have much of an incident in a Wayfarer, they are very stable.
Either that, or learn to sail a little better, and get a Wayfarer. Once you've got a rough idea what you are doing, in under 20 knots of breeze you're not particularly likely to have much of an incident in a Wayfarer, they are very stable.
In a small craft the risk of capsize is always there, and they have low sides which allows spray and water to come over. They're not built for keeping you dry!
Sounds like what you're really after is a trailer sailor, something 19-23ft, with a weighted keel, some enclosed cabin space, cockpit at the back etc.
Something a lot more like this (First 20)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3iFyo41IQQ
Than this (Lazer 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF2eK6sCOrI
Sounds like what you're really after is a trailer sailor, something 19-23ft, with a weighted keel, some enclosed cabin space, cockpit at the back etc.
Something a lot more like this (First 20)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3iFyo41IQQ
Than this (Lazer 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF2eK6sCOrI
Condi said:
In a small craft the risk of capsize is always there, and they have low sides which allows spray and water to come over. They're not built for keeping you dry!
Sounds like what you're really after is a trailer sailor, something 19-23ft, with a weighted keel, some enclosed cabin space, cockpit at the back etc.
Something a lot more like this (First 20)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3iFyo41IQQ
Than this (Lazer 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF2eK6sCOrI
I agree but as this is the internet we need to argue about something. I think the First 20 would be a pain to trailer sail, it's quite big and getting it rigged and unrigged isn't going to be quick. If you are happy to leave it on a mooring or in a marina then it opens up lots of possibilities (and costs).Sounds like what you're really after is a trailer sailor, something 19-23ft, with a weighted keel, some enclosed cabin space, cockpit at the back etc.
Something a lot more like this (First 20)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C3iFyo41IQQ
Than this (Lazer 1)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hF2eK6sCOrI
Being patriotic and completely ignoring any budget the OP may have had I'm going to recommend the Swallow Yachts Bayraider 20.
Water ballast, so it would be very, very tough to capsize.
Want to make the boat light, so it will go faster in the water, easier to tow and manhandle on land? Just dump the water.
Simple ketch rig, so you can get the thing launched quickly.
http://swallowyachts.com/range/bay-raider-20/
Trying to capsize it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYrFXsHzvcg&t=...
If I had 20Kish for a day sailor it would be my choice.
Fittster said:
Water ballast, so it would be very, very tough to capsize.
Trying to capsize it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYrFXsHzvcg&t=...
You've literally linked to a video of them righting it having already been capsized Trying to capsize it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYrFXsHzvcg&t=...
Condi said:
Fittster said:
Water ballast, so it would be very, very tough to capsize.
Trying to capsize it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYrFXsHzvcg&t=...
You've literally linked to a video of them righting it having already been capsized Trying to capsize it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yYrFXsHzvcg&t=...
Fittster said:
President of the dinghy cruising association getting wet:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-rJH9D_908&t=...
He's very experienced dinghy sailor, who has written books on the subject.
Poor guy, was wondering why you linked to someone who looked like a floating tramp - I didn't realise he'd only just been rescued from a capsize moments before.https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O-rJH9D_908&t=...
He's very experienced dinghy sailor, who has written books on the subject.
OP - most sailors on PH are yachties who think capsizing will spill their G&T's
Something like a Wayfarer will be a lot more stable than a Pico, and will have a lot more room as well, the Pico is mainly aimed at kids. Having said that capsizing is a possibility for anything without a heavy keel, personally I would not want to sail without a wetsuit in this country even in the summer.
Another alternative is catamarans - even less likely to capsize unless you are pushing it, but a real pain to right if they do capsize.
Something like a Wayfarer will be a lot more stable than a Pico, and will have a lot more room as well, the Pico is mainly aimed at kids. Having said that capsizing is a possibility for anything without a heavy keel, personally I would not want to sail without a wetsuit in this country even in the summer.
Another alternative is catamarans - even less likely to capsize unless you are pushing it, but a real pain to right if they do capsize.
MBBlat said:
OP - most sailors on PH are yachties who think capsizing will spill their G&T's
Something like a Wayfarer will be a lot more stable than a Pico, and will have a lot more room as well, the Pico is mainly aimed at kids. Having said that capsizing is a possibility for anything without a heavy keel, personally I would not want to sail without a wetsuit in this country even in the summer.
Another alternative is catamarans - even less likely to capsize unless you are pushing it, but a real pain to right if they do capsize.
You haven't suffered a knockdown in a yacht then? Tends to spoil your day and generally spills more than one's G&T!!!Something like a Wayfarer will be a lot more stable than a Pico, and will have a lot more room as well, the Pico is mainly aimed at kids. Having said that capsizing is a possibility for anything without a heavy keel, personally I would not want to sail without a wetsuit in this country even in the summer.
Another alternative is catamarans - even less likely to capsize unless you are pushing it, but a real pain to right if they do capsize.
The OP is a complete novice by his own admission and has suggested his preference is for a simple, steady sailing dinghy/small dayboat style of craft that he can sit 'inside' rather than hanging his backside outboard, so a small catamaran hardly fits the bill!!
Edited by pequod on Saturday 25th July 16:11
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