Typhoons to be used in Ground Attack in Libya?

[cpufreak]

As per topic...

or is it just yet another badly written BBC Article:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-12983294


reads as though 4 typhoons will be used for Ground Attack

[Munter]

Why not?

[cpufreak]

this would be a first.

[Zaxxon]

Lets hope they exceed expectations, then let the overseas orders start rolling in.

[PaulG40]

Some Swing wing dagger of deaths are spiking the targets for them perhaps?

[Eric Mc]

Ground attack has been part of the aircraft specification for the past fews years. Although originally envisaged as an air defence fighter, it was later decided that the RAF variants would also have a ground attack capability.

[mackie1]

I remember the game EF2000 let you attack ground targets with LGBs and Mavs. Do they carry a laser designator in IRL?

[PaulG40]

Eric Mc said:

Ground attack has been part of the aircraft specification for the past fews years. Although originally envisaged as an air defence fighter, it was later decided that the RAF variants would also have a ground attack capability.

It's the flight control software which is causing all the problems with the bombing (more so the GPS aiming as I understand it) side of things and that means rewriting all the software, not easy when its spread across all 7 computers that all talk to one another, horrendous cost to do it!

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)


Hence its only just been done on the very latest (still development at BAE) typhoon airframes, see below first PGB IV dropped 8th March 2011.
http://www.defencemanagement.com/news_story.asp?id...

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 13:54

[PaulG40]

mackie1 said:

I remember the game EF2000 let you attack ground targets with LGBs and Mavs. Do they carry a laser designator in IRL?

They have the LIII pod( or LDP as buffoons call it)


EF2000 was a great game! Still have it upstairs, although won't work to well when in 'msdos mode' as runs the in flight game framerate too fast so very hard to control

[Uglybob]

PaulG40 said:

It's the flight control software which is causing all the problems with the bombing (more so the GPS aiming as I understand it) side of things and that means rewriting all the software, not easy when its spread across all 7 computers that all talk to one another, horrendous cost to do it!

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)


Hence its only just been done on the very latest (still development at BAE) typhoon airframes, see below first PGB IV dropped 8th March 2011.
http://www.defencemanagement.com/news_story.asp?id...

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 13:54

Don't know who where you get your information but that is rubbish. Typhoon has been ground attack cleared for about 4 years now I think. The aircraft can self designate and prosecute targets independent of any other platform, with the air of the LDP. (LIII as spotters call it) The paveway four has yet to enter service and is a GPS guided munition and is still in testing and has not been released to service on any RAF platform as far as I"m aware. The aerodinamic properties of a paveway 4 and 2 are very similar if not the same and therefore all that information regarding the flying control system and software change has come from a very poorly informed source.

[PaulG40]

Uglybob said:

PaulG40 said:

It's the flight control software which is causing all the problems with the bombing (more so the GPS aiming as I understand it) side of things and that means rewriting all the software, not easy when its spread across all 7 computers that all talk to one another, horrendous cost to do it!

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)


Hence its only just been done on the very latest development typhoon airframes, see below first PGB IV dropped 8th March 2011.
http://www.defencemanagement.com/news_story.asp?id...

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 13:54

Don't know who where you get your information but that is rubbish. Typhoon has been ground attack cleared for about 4 years now I think. The aircraft can self designate and prosecute targets independent of any other platform, with the air of the LDP. (LIII as spotters call it) The paveway four has yet to enter service and is a GPS guided munition and is still in testing and has not been released to service on any RAF platform as far as I"m aware. The aerodinamic properties of a paveway 4 and 2 are very similar if not the same and therefore all that information regarding the flying control system and software change has come from a very poorly informed source.

Then we've a difference of opinion!

[quote]with the aid of the LDP. (LIII as spotters call it)

Thats the Typhoon term for it, everyone else calls it a Litening III ATP pod, not just spotters.

And PV IV is cleared for operational use on the other platforms! I didn't say Typhoons were not cleared to release PGB, just that they have their problems with targetting.

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 15:03

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 15:55

[rhinochopig]

PaulG40 said:

Uglybob said:

PaulG40 said:

It's the flight control software which is causing all the problems with the bombing (more so the GPS aiming as I understand it) side of things and that means rewriting all the software, not easy when its spread across all 7 computers that all talk to one another, horrendous cost to do it!

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)


Hence its only just been done on the very latest (still development at BAE) typhoon airframes, see below first PGB IV dropped 8th March 2011.
http://www.defencemanagement.com/news_story.asp?id...

Edited by PaulG40 on Thursday 7th April 13:54

Don't know who where you get your information but that is rubbish. Typhoon has been ground attack cleared for about 4 years now I think. The aircraft can self designate and prosecute targets independent of any other platform, with the air of the LDP. (LIII as spotters call it) The paveway four has yet to enter service and is a GPS guided munition and is still in testing and has not been released to service on any RAF platform as far as I"m aware. The aerodinamic properties of a paveway 4 and 2 are very similar if not the same and therefore all that information regarding the flying control system and software change has come from a very poorly informed source.

And your info comes from where exactly?

Given both your locations you could well work for the same parent company

[PaulG40]

and possibly on different aircraft types too, unless we share a hanger, lol.

[rhinochopig]

PaulG40 said:

and possibly on different aircraft types too, unless we share a hanger, lol.

It would explain the difference of opinion - internal comms isn't exactly one of said company's strong points

[Mojocvh]

http://www.raf.mod.uk/equipment/paveway4.cfm

"The first platforms to receive the weapon were the Tornado GR4 and Typhoon F2"

[plasticpig]

Britain only has 8 qualified pilots for ground attack in the Typhoon. IIRC at least two of those are instructors.

[UVB]

PaulG40 said:

They have the LIII pod( or LDP as buffoons call it)


EF2000 was a great game! Still have it upstairs, although won't work to well when in 'msdos mode' as runs the in flight game framerate too fast so very hard to control

<-- Co-wrote the official strategy guide for it. Fond memories of 8 player LAN sessions with EF2000. Last one was at a Travelodge in Guildford with people flying in from Germany and Portugal for it! MD of DiD (the developers) had a 348 Competizione at the time they released it.

[Ian Lancs]

Mojocvh said:

http://www.raf.mod.uk/equipment/paveway4.cfm

"The first platforms to receive the weapon were the Tornado GR4 and Typhoon F2"

Interesting... The Harrier GR9 used it for about 2 yrs before GR4 got it. Typhoon still doesn't have it (or at least didn't when I left work a bit ago!) as they've not finished the trials (only done 1 release with a "real" weapon)

PaulG40 said:

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)

Not sure what incidents you're referring to, but the GR1 moved to medium level as the SAM and air to air threat had been driven to a low enough level to make it safer.

[PaulG40]

UVB said:

PaulG40 said:

They have the LIII pod( or LDP as buffoons call it)


EF2000 was a great game! Still have it upstairs, although won't work to well when in 'msdos mode' as runs the in flight game framerate too fast so very hard to control

<-- Co-wrote the official strategy guide for it. Fond memories of 8 player LAN sessions with EF2000. Last one was at a Travelodge in Guildford with people flying in from Germany and Portugal for it! MD of DiD (the developers) had a 348 Competizione at the time they released it.

Very Cool! The box and contents are still in great condition considered its from 1995.

I had TFX too, also by DiD before EF2000.

[PaulG40]

Ian Lancs said:

Mojocvh said:

http://www.raf.mod.uk/equipment/paveway4.cfm

"The first platforms to receive the weapon were the Tornado GR4 and Typhoon F2"

Interesting... The Harrier GR9 used it for about 2 yrs before GR4 got it. Typhoon still doesn't have it (or at least didn't when I left work a bit ago!) as they've not finished the trials (only done 1 release with a "real" weapon)

GR4 had fuzing issues IIRC, memory may be blurred a little, so a step up from PGBII, to Enhanced PGBII, to Enhanced PVII+ to PV IV. Harrier was a UOR on CAP A/B, then Cap C.

PaulG40 said:

So they are getting other aircraft to aim for them. Co-operative bombing as per Gulf War 1 (anyone remember that? buccaneers lasering the targets for the Tonka's who were now operating at medium level, due to so many low level incidents)

Not sure what incidents you're referring to, but the GR1 moved to medium level as the SAM and air to air threat had been driven to a low enough level to make it safer.

Interesting, an article i was reading a while back mentioned the reason they went to a higher level of height in ops was down to the many Surface to air incidents/losses because at low level ops, mainly the JP233 sorties due to the fixed low height (circa 250ft?) and speed (500kts?) they had to stay at for a certain period of time (15secs?) on approach to their target (eneny runway) to ensure correct release. Be interesting to know if that wasn't the case then?