Cooking with alcohol
Discussion
I fancy making a French onion soup (if anyone has any decent recipes, please feel free to share!) and one of the recipes I've seen online says to use red wine, most of the others seem to say to use a white.
As I know nothing about wines, what should I use, and why?
Same as with other things that use alcohol (steak and ale pies etc), is it just a case of use something that you like the taste of and hope it goes well with the rest of the ingredients?
I've made a beef bourguignon a couple of times in the past, and it turned out really well the first time, but the next I used a bottle of red I was given from work and the end result was barely edible, ideally I'd like to avoid doing that in the future!
As I know nothing about wines, what should I use, and why?
Same as with other things that use alcohol (steak and ale pies etc), is it just a case of use something that you like the taste of and hope it goes well with the rest of the ingredients?
I've made a beef bourguignon a couple of times in the past, and it turned out really well the first time, but the next I used a bottle of red I was given from work and the end result was barely edible, ideally I'd like to avoid doing that in the future!
If you wouldn't drink it then don't cook with it 
Pretty much use your instinct, something like a beef bourguignon would be better with a rich heavy red whereas coq au vin can be done with something a bit more subtle.
Beef or other red meats with ales, pretty much any decent brown ale would work but I wouldn't bother using anything too hoppy as the flavours would be driven off during cooking anyway so a complete waste. I really like doing beef in Guinness.
Cider goes really well with Pheasant and pork.
I also lob a bit of Bourbon in chilis and sometimes use dry vermouth instead of white wine when doing a risotto as the aromatics in the vermout can complement it.
Pretty much use your instinct, something like a beef bourguignon would be better with a rich heavy red whereas coq au vin can be done with something a bit more subtle.
Beef or other red meats with ales, pretty much any decent brown ale would work but I wouldn't bother using anything too hoppy as the flavours would be driven off during cooking anyway so a complete waste. I really like doing beef in Guinness.
Cider goes really well with Pheasant and pork.
I also lob a bit of Bourbon in chilis and sometimes use dry vermouth instead of white wine when doing a risotto as the aromatics in the vermout can complement it.
French onion soup varies from place to place in France but this is how I was taught by a French chef I employed:
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
C0ffin D0dger said:
If you wouldn't drink it then don't cook with it
I think that's partly my problem, I don't drink that much wine so I've no idea what I like and walking down the aisle reading the descriptions at a supermarket, they all seem to blend in to one!21TonyK said:
Tasty looking food
That sounds simple enough, I'll give that a shot, Cheers!!21TonyK said:
French onion soup varies from place to place in France but this is how I was taught by a French chef I employed:
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
My favourite soup, I've made many times , and your recipe looks the best ever. thanks. I'll try it next time Onions are cheap in Aldi/Lidl.Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
How many Onions to a litre of stock do you use? I never knew slice root to shoot but it makes sense !
21TonyK said:
French onion soup varies from place to place in France but this is how I was taught by a French chef I employed:
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
Should I take the peppercorns out of the sachet or will that dilute the flavour???!!Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
JKRolling said:
21TonyK said:
French onion soup varies from place to place in France but this is how I was taught by a French chef I employed:
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
Should I take the peppercorns out of the sachet or will that dilute the flavour???!!Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
I have made French onion lots, it's one of my favourites. Largely Tony above has the idea, and then it is all a personal thing after that as to how you develop it when you make it a few times.
As for a recipe, the first one I used was this one, from from Julia Childs' very good "Mastering the art of French Cooking" book. Was very happy with it, it turned out almost exactly the same as the soup I had from a little side street eatery in Antibes. Pleased!
As for a recipe, the first one I used was this one, from from Julia Childs' very good "Mastering the art of French Cooking" book. Was very happy with it, it turned out almost exactly the same as the soup I had from a little side street eatery in Antibes. Pleased!
21TonyK said:
French onion soup varies from place to place in France but this is how I was taught by a French chef I employed:
Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
Gruyere cheese surely Large mild onions sliced thinly from "root to shoot", in other words shards not rings.
Sweat them down with butter and fresh thyme, bay leaves and whole black peppercorns in a sachet.
When, and only when the onions are reduced to a sticky brown mass should you add a glass of dry white wine and really good quality beef stock. If you want a slightly thicker soup add a sprinkle of flour and cook into the onions before adding the stock. How much stock you add depends on the quantity of onions and the consistency of the soup you want.
Finish with a splash of sherry vinegar.
Top with a crouton (or more) and a handful of grated comte or sliced emmental cheese.
Finish under the grill.
The Thermomix makes a great french onion soup
If your result was barely edible, I suspect you hadn't cooked the alcohol off - it would be very unpleasant if so. When cooking with alcohol, my advice would be to make sure it gets a really good rolling boil or other reduction to get a lot of the rawness off. Same with long braises with alcohol, give them a good few minutes at high heat to just get rid of some of the nasty taste.
dazco said:
Gruyere cheese surely
The Thermomix makes a great french onion soup
I think that's one of the big regional variations. My ex-head chef was from Grenoble so for him Comte was the cheese of choice. Also he always insisted that FOS was very dark and almost onions with a bit of stock where as others prefer the lighter stock with fine onion pieces.The Thermomix makes a great french onion soup
Personally I'm not a massive fan of any variety, nor fish soup... god that stinks.
21TonyK said:
I think that's one of the big regional variations. My ex-head chef was from Grenoble so for him Comte was the cheese of choice. Also he always insisted that FOS was very dark and almost onions with a bit of stock where as others prefer the lighter stock with fine onion pieces.
Personally I'm not a massive fan of any variety, nor fish soup... god that stinks.
A nice Bouillabaisse is one of my favourite thingsPersonally I'm not a massive fan of any variety, nor fish soup... god that stinks.
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