Jamie's Italian - it's back
Discussion
After Jamie's UK restaurants collapsed in 2019 owing £83 million to creditors and making 1000 people redundant, he's back.
He's found new backers, investment firm Cain International and its subsidiary Brava Hospitality, led by Jonathan Goldstein. Under a franchise agreement, Jamie Oliver will partner with Brava—which also operates Prezzo—to target up to 40 UK sites. The first to open is just off Leicester Square.
I just watched a review. A glass of wine, some fried cheesy pasta to start (he could have chosen the "sharing plank for two"), a plate of carbonara bucatini (with very sparse Guanciale) and a monstrously large cheesecake - £47. The reviewer thought it pretty good. He ate his bucatini with a knife and fork.
I found an interesting radio 4 program with industry experts looking at the failure of Jamie's Italian chain from Feb 2024. There's even a clip of Jamie talking to Kirsty Young in which Jamie has found a way to convince himself the collapse was all beyond his control, and that with all the staff he trained it was more "like a charity". Link here - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0h451lc
Perhaps Jamie and his new backers will have better luck reviving this franchise. From what I could see it appears little different to before.
He's found new backers, investment firm Cain International and its subsidiary Brava Hospitality, led by Jonathan Goldstein. Under a franchise agreement, Jamie Oliver will partner with Brava—which also operates Prezzo—to target up to 40 UK sites. The first to open is just off Leicester Square.
I just watched a review. A glass of wine, some fried cheesy pasta to start (he could have chosen the "sharing plank for two"), a plate of carbonara bucatini (with very sparse Guanciale) and a monstrously large cheesecake - £47. The reviewer thought it pretty good. He ate his bucatini with a knife and fork.
I found an interesting radio 4 program with industry experts looking at the failure of Jamie's Italian chain from Feb 2024. There's even a clip of Jamie talking to Kirsty Young in which Jamie has found a way to convince himself the collapse was all beyond his control, and that with all the staff he trained it was more "like a charity". Link here - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0h451lc
Perhaps Jamie and his new backers will have better luck reviving this franchise. From what I could see it appears little different to before.
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We're working our way through the recent Gordon Ramsey doc and we think the same-I can almost see the attraction for foreigners where he seems to be some celebrity but we'd have zero interest in eating in any of "his" restaurants too.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We did eat in a couple of Jamie's back in the day but it was more because we were away somewhere unknown and needed a quick meal where the standard was acceptable. A bit like a Miller and Carter or going to a Toni & Guy-you know the standard etc.
I heard the same programme on BBC Sounds, Sliced Bread. There's no doubt that the early success of JI was due to customers appreciating the attention and quality of the food in a casual dining offering. However it was also true that as that sector got more players in the market the customer basis just didn't appreciate quality and weren't prepared to pay for it. Thus JI struggled to maintain standards at the price point of the casual dining competition. OK that wasn't the whole story but it was a factor.
Considering how things are today with costs and the government seeming to have a bit of a lack of interest in hospitality other than how much they can screw out of it suspect that observation about customer view on prices might still be an issue.
Just to go slightly off topic really amused and
to Jeremy King who has reopened old school dining at Simpsons partly as a "giant f
k you to the Government". All power to your elbow there sir! This government deserves all the "fk you" sentiments possible.
Considering how things are today with costs and the government seeming to have a bit of a lack of interest in hospitality other than how much they can screw out of it suspect that observation about customer view on prices might still be an issue.
Just to go slightly off topic really amused and
to Jeremy King who has reopened old school dining at Simpsons partly as a "giant fk you to the Government". All power to your elbow there sir! This government deserves all the "fk you" sentiments possible.FiF said:
I heard the same programme on BBC Sounds, Sliced Bread. There's no doubt that the early success of JI was due to customers appreciating the attention and quality of the food in a casual dining offering. However it was also true that as that sector got more players in the market the customer basis just didn't appreciate quality and weren't prepared to pay for it.
That's not my experience - the food was distinctly average, and the prices were optimistic.ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
Agreed.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
I recently had close friends visit me here in London and I explained to them that most the food we are eating isn't actually made in the building we are sitting in. They didn't believe me, even after I explained all the why's and how's. I eventually called the lovely lady over that was looking after our table and she confirmed to my friends that everything is brought in from outside the premisses. My friends where really quite shocked and a little disappointed but I explained that its something we're used to here in the U.K.
Sporky said:
That's not my experience - the food was distinctly average, and the prices were optimistic.
Didn't suggest it was fine dining, but compared to other casual dining chains which were /are abysmal.But yes the prices ended up definitely optimistic for that market. Which was a big part of the problem. Then corners cut to try and compete / survive, which was the point.
I went to one of them by choice fairly early in their lifespan, and was underwhelmed by the food choice and quality, and taken aback by the pricing. I gave them the benefit of the doubt on the food as them having a one-off poor night.
Subsequently went to another branch, as someone else's guest, and had exactly the same experience.
Subsequently subsequently encountered the man socially a number of times, and had all my prejudices reinforced.
This reboot attempt will quietly close its doors on 30 Dec 2027.
Subsequently went to another branch, as someone else's guest, and had exactly the same experience.
Subsequently subsequently encountered the man socially a number of times, and had all my prejudices reinforced.
This reboot attempt will quietly close its doors on 30 Dec 2027.
LRDefender said:
Agreed.
I eventually called the lovely lady over that was looking after our table and she confirmed to my friends that everything is brought in from outside the premisses. My friends where really quite shocked and a little disappointed but I explained that its something we're used to here in the U.K.
You and others might be but I’m certainly not. I eventually called the lovely lady over that was looking after our table and she confirmed to my friends that everything is brought in from outside the premisses. My friends where really quite shocked and a little disappointed but I explained that its something we're used to here in the U.K.
vixen1700 said:
How do you have a smallish chain of restaurants and end up owing £83m to creditors?
Billion turnover. I d imagine most of that was rent arrears which were a contributing factor. By his own admission they were arrogant in their acquisition of sites and agreeing to high rents initially bit them in the ass later on. Edited by 21TonyK on Saturday 14th March 18:53
Newc said:
I went to one of them by choice fairly early in their lifespan, and was underwhelmed by the food choice and quality, and taken aback by the pricing. I gave them the benefit of the doubt on the food as them having a one-off poor night.
Subsequently went to another branch, as someone else's guest, and had exactly the same experience.
Subsequently subsequently encountered the man socially a number of times, and had all my prejudices reinforced.
This reboot attempt will quietly close its doors on 30 Dec 2027.
I fear I may be turning into a gossipy old woman, but I can't help be curious to hear more about that. Subsequently went to another branch, as someone else's guest, and had exactly the same experience.
Subsequently subsequently encountered the man socially a number of times, and had all my prejudices reinforced.
This reboot attempt will quietly close its doors on 30 Dec 2027.
vixen1700 said:
How do you have a smallish chain of restaurants and end up owing £83m to creditors? At the time he was endorsing so much too.
Can't bear him for that alone.
Ate in the Cambridge one years ago, and it was quite forgettable to be honest.
I haven't seen his accounts, but his claimed just shy of £1bn turnover seems very unlikely. I expect he's included turnover from the foreign restaurants and cruise ships to get to that number. If not, then he's saying each restaurant was turning over an average £3.7m pa. Nobody should ever need to close a restaurant if they were making that much money.Can't bear him for that alone.
Ate in the Cambridge one years ago, and it was quite forgettable to be honest.
He did say in that Kirsty Young interview that all staff and suppliers were sorted (obviously that's unverifiable), and said that landlords might have lost a couple of months rent but "had had ten or twelve good years of rent out of him". And he never took a salary or dividends.
Edited by suffolk009 on Saturday 14th March 15:06
I recall they opened in Aberdeen, renovating an old space at enormous expense - first time we went it was decent. Went a few months later, notably after the ‘launch’ kitchen team had gone back to London and it was so bad we didn’t need to pay. Other folk we know had similar experiences. Didn’t ever go back, and after a brief tenure the place closed.
PRO5T said:
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We're working our way through the recent Gordon Ramsey doc and we think the same-I can almost see the attraction for foreigners where he seems to be some celebrity but we'd have zero interest in eating in any of "his" restaurants too.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We did eat in a couple of Jamie's back in the day but it was more because we were away somewhere unknown and needed a quick meal where the standard was acceptable. A bit like a Miller and Carter or going to a Toni & Guy-you know the standard etc.
48k said:
PRO5T said:
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We're working our way through the recent Gordon Ramsey doc and we think the same-I can almost see the attraction for foreigners where he seems to be some celebrity but we'd have zero interest in eating in any of "his" restaurants too.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We did eat in a couple of Jamie's back in the day but it was more because we were away somewhere unknown and needed a quick meal where the standard was acceptable. A bit like a Miller and Carter or going to a Toni & Guy-you know the standard etc.
I don't doubt Gordon has some superb establishments within "his" portfolio and I do actually like the man, or the character he has created at least! But in the end you're not eating in a chef's own place in reality. The chef at 22 Bishopsgate, fantastic but is High his or Gordon Ramsey's?
Is Ramsey and his investors investors or curators? It's a strange set of affairs but not one that makes me want to visit.
I'm sure the food at High is amazing but what are people going for-the food, the view, the location, the hype or because it says Gordon Ramsey above the door. Does it matter if it's any of the above or something else?
PRO5T said:
48k said:
PRO5T said:
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We're working our way through the recent Gordon Ramsey doc and we think the same-I can almost see the attraction for foreigners where he seems to be some celebrity but we'd have zero interest in eating in any of "his" restaurants too.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
We did eat in a couple of Jamie's back in the day but it was more because we were away somewhere unknown and needed a quick meal where the standard was acceptable. A bit like a Miller and Carter or going to a Toni & Guy-you know the standard etc.
I don't doubt Gordon has some superb establishments within "his" portfolio and I do actually like the man, or the character he has created at least! But in the end you're not eating in a chef's own place in reality. The chef at 22 Bishopsgate, fantastic but is High his or Gordon Ramsey's?
Is Ramsey and his investors investors or curators? It's a strange set of affairs but not one that makes me want to visit.
I'm sure the food at High is amazing but what are people going for-the food, the view, the location, the hype or because it says Gordon Ramsey above the door. Does it matter if it's any of the above or something else?
suffolk009 said:
After Jamie's UK restaurants collapsed in 2019 owing £83 million to creditors and making 1000 people redundant, he's back.
He's found new backers, investment firm Cain International and its subsidiary Brava Hospitality, led by Jonathan Goldstein. Under a franchise agreement, Jamie Oliver will partner with Brava which also operates Prezzo to target up to 40 UK sites. The first to open is just off Leicester Square.
I just watched a review. A glass of wine, some fried cheesy pasta to start (he could have chosen the "sharing plank for two"), a plate of carbonara bucatini (with very sparse Guanciale) and a monstrously large cheesecake - £47. The reviewer thought it pretty good. He ate his bucatini with a knife and fork.
I found an interesting radio 4 program with industry experts looking at the failure of Jamie's Italian chain from Feb 2024. There's even a clip of Jamie talking to Kirsty Young in which Jamie has found a way to convince himself the collapse was all beyond his control, and that with all the staff he trained it was more "like a charity". Link here - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0h451lc
Perhaps Jamie and his new backers will have better luck reviving this franchise. From what I could see it appears little different to before.
I have always wondered with Jamie whether his actions are driven by commendable beliefs or ego. If forced to choose, I'd run with ego. It's quite hard to replicate genuine Italian food in the UK and trying to do it at scale, whilst having bugger all clue about a lot of important stuff, was always going to end just one way.He's found new backers, investment firm Cain International and its subsidiary Brava Hospitality, led by Jonathan Goldstein. Under a franchise agreement, Jamie Oliver will partner with Brava which also operates Prezzo to target up to 40 UK sites. The first to open is just off Leicester Square.
I just watched a review. A glass of wine, some fried cheesy pasta to start (he could have chosen the "sharing plank for two"), a plate of carbonara bucatini (with very sparse Guanciale) and a monstrously large cheesecake - £47. The reviewer thought it pretty good. He ate his bucatini with a knife and fork.
I found an interesting radio 4 program with industry experts looking at the failure of Jamie's Italian chain from Feb 2024. There's even a clip of Jamie talking to Kirsty Young in which Jamie has found a way to convince himself the collapse was all beyond his control, and that with all the staff he trained it was more "like a charity". Link here - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p0h451lc
Perhaps Jamie and his new backers will have better luck reviving this franchise. From what I could see it appears little different to before.
He is re-entering the casual dining market at a very challenging time. I hope for him his backers will keep him reigned in.
ThingsBehindTheSun said:
Do you think Jamie Oliver will even know where they are? I am sure it will be the same prepared frozen food reheated just with his name above the door.
Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
I think the big difference is Ramsey has been awarded 17 stars. Jamie Oliver has worked in River Cafe as a Commis or Sous was it and done some telly. Every Ramsey restaurant I have been too has been excellent, worth every penny and somewhere I would go again in heart beat.Never really understood this obsession with celebrity chef restaurants where the celebrity chef never even goes there. Same thing with all the Gordon Ramsey enterprises, honestly he would stick his name on McDonald's if they paid him.
I used to live about 100m from a Jamie s Italian and went maybe 15 times it was good once, within 5 minute walk there was 10-15 other eating places, something always offered a better option. It was like KFC, I would think, not been there for ages, go and be reminded why. The big failing was of those 15 one was a Carluccio's better in every respect, or Burger King at least you knew what to expect.
I think if he tries the same again, it will fail again.
You can do an authentic rustic experience at the next level up, not Michelin level but special occasions dining and people will appreciate a tiny rabbit ragu a mozzarella salad made with cheese hand selected from a specific farm in Calabria and pay a premium because they want Italian food. In a shopping centre/ high street most people want to grab a bite and eat something vaguely familiar, tasty and good value.
At that end of market I think ASK/ zizzi & pizza express get the offer right, it s authentic enough for a Saturday afternoon or Tuesday after work, there is no need to go the whole hog. They have kitchens de skilled enough to cope with scaling the concept, the one good meal I had at Jamie s was opening.
I also found the service terrible slow, formal up its own arse.i reckon i went 3 more times and left after waiting to be seated. Again 8 think the other multiple brands don t try to pretend they are upmarket and have a more familiar/ friendly service service.
My mums cousin was charged £120 for Jamie’s attending table at a Jamie’s Italian. (I posted on another thread it was my mum but that was wrong lol)
Anyone remember Jamie s Union Jacks? Now that was even worse lol
Edited by nikaiyo2 on Saturday 14th March 20:31
Edited by nikaiyo2 on Saturday 14th March 20:44
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