Are Free Range eggs a con?
Discussion
Try to buy them whereever possible, but read a post on another forum by an exfarm worker who says its bit of a con, anyone on here have any knowledge? and if so should go caged along with ignoring fairtrade 
I've worked on many farms, some producing "free range", and I don't believe it exists. Bit like fair trade. I'll stick to value eggs.
When people think of free range they think of small holdings - chickins pecking about in a farm yard or wandering about in a field, but the commercial side of things is very different.
The standard for free range outside (where they are to spend 1/2 their life i.e. 23 days) is 1 meter squared per bird, but frankly they're lucky if they get that, same for the time, in reality they probably get a week outside and don't get the meter squared per bird they're supposed to (yes, 1 meter squared = free range) and there is no requirement for grass so outside = concrete because its easier to clean.
When inside (where they spend the majority of their 56 day lives) the regulations for free range are 13 birds per meter squared, because the flock sizes are in the thousands (usually around 8 or 9000 but there's no limit) it means that its pretty hard to rotate the chickens so they all get equal time outside, so what generally happens is the majority are trapped inside the shed.
And these are the official standards, its rare that the producers stick to them.
Is it better than caged? Just about, doesn't mean they're not still scabby as **** and leading very **** lives, its not the farmers fault - they want good welfare for their animals, but in a commercial environment where you're mass producing for the supermarkets there's ****all you can do about it.
I've seen a few articles and videos where people like Dispatches and Panorama go to "fair trade" producers, the workers have never even heard of the term, in one article they interviewed a worker for some chocolate company and in the 15 years he had been working there the standards hadn't improved, if anything they had gotten worse, and the company was meant to have switched to "fair trade" two years prior to them interviewing him, yet he had seen no changes... hmmm... I mean in some remote location in a country corrupt as **** a few $$$ can quite easily buy you the fair trade logo to stick on your box.
I also heard stories of workers being sent home for the day when european inspectors come around, all the producers know when they're going to get paid a visit (hotel rooms being booked, flights to their remote locations) etc etc
Words like "fair trade" and "free range" look good on packaging, especially when accompanied by a nice picture of a happy worker and a handful of chickens in a lush pasture but in reality its just not like that at all.
Taken from http://www.hotukdeals.com/item/613293/6-x-medium-f...
I've worked on many farms, some producing "free range", and I don't believe it exists. Bit like fair trade. I'll stick to value eggs.
When people think of free range they think of small holdings - chickins pecking about in a farm yard or wandering about in a field, but the commercial side of things is very different.
The standard for free range outside (where they are to spend 1/2 their life i.e. 23 days) is 1 meter squared per bird, but frankly they're lucky if they get that, same for the time, in reality they probably get a week outside and don't get the meter squared per bird they're supposed to (yes, 1 meter squared = free range) and there is no requirement for grass so outside = concrete because its easier to clean.
When inside (where they spend the majority of their 56 day lives) the regulations for free range are 13 birds per meter squared, because the flock sizes are in the thousands (usually around 8 or 9000 but there's no limit) it means that its pretty hard to rotate the chickens so they all get equal time outside, so what generally happens is the majority are trapped inside the shed.
And these are the official standards, its rare that the producers stick to them.
Is it better than caged? Just about, doesn't mean they're not still scabby as **** and leading very **** lives, its not the farmers fault - they want good welfare for their animals, but in a commercial environment where you're mass producing for the supermarkets there's ****all you can do about it.
I've seen a few articles and videos where people like Dispatches and Panorama go to "fair trade" producers, the workers have never even heard of the term, in one article they interviewed a worker for some chocolate company and in the 15 years he had been working there the standards hadn't improved, if anything they had gotten worse, and the company was meant to have switched to "fair trade" two years prior to them interviewing him, yet he had seen no changes... hmmm... I mean in some remote location in a country corrupt as **** a few $$$ can quite easily buy you the fair trade logo to stick on your box.
I also heard stories of workers being sent home for the day when european inspectors come around, all the producers know when they're going to get paid a visit (hotel rooms being booked, flights to their remote locations) etc etc
Words like "fair trade" and "free range" look good on packaging, especially when accompanied by a nice picture of a happy worker and a handful of chickens in a lush pasture but in reality its just not like that at all.
Taken from http://www.hotukdeals.com/item/613293/6-x-medium-f...
They do have a better taste and colour than battery eggs, not by much though. Nothing beats properly free range as in roaming around a farm yard or garden, they are beautiful, just got to persuade the rest of the family that there would be nothing better than a few rescued hens pecking around the garden.
The problem is the regulation allows a farmer to describe eggs as such so they will, can't really blame them but it is a sort of miss selling.
The problem is the regulation allows a farmer to describe eggs as such so they will, can't really blame them but it is a sort of miss selling.
I had a friend who lived on his parents battery farm and the chickens seemed jolly happy. In comparison if you've seen a 'free range' farm you'll understand where the term 'pecking order' comes from, the dominant birds literally bully the other birds.
Best to keep your own birds if you have the time/space.
Best to keep your own birds if you have the time/space.
You can do whatever makes you the greatest sense of self satisfaction.
If you want to give all these nice little chooks a happy life, buy soil association organic.... Quietly ignoring the fact that more land was diverted away from feeding the starving Africans than if you had bought gaged-hen eggs.
If you care about the starving Africans, buy caged-hen eggs..... Quietly ignoring the fact that the hens didn't look as if they were happy because they didn't live outdoors.
Pays your money, takes your choice. Africans, or happy looking chooks.
If you want to give all these nice little chooks a happy life, buy soil association organic.... Quietly ignoring the fact that more land was diverted away from feeding the starving Africans than if you had bought gaged-hen eggs.
If you care about the starving Africans, buy caged-hen eggs..... Quietly ignoring the fact that the hens didn't look as if they were happy because they didn't live outdoors.
Pays your money, takes your choice. Africans, or happy looking chooks.
I know there are issues about pecking etc in these very large indoor freerange flocks but I also used to work in a battery egg shed and it was the most hideous place I have ever had the mis-pleasure to work in. The cages were about the size of a big microwave casing with 6 hens in each, all tiered above each other. The heat, noise, poor quality eggs and dead birds was just staggering.
Ok, this was about 1980 and things have probably changed but please give these birds a little bit of room, regardless of the taste of the eggs.
My eggs now come from the farm down the road where they all sit in the apple trees and get a fantastically varied diet - great tasting eggs and happy chooks.
Ok, this was about 1980 and things have probably changed but please give these birds a little bit of room, regardless of the taste of the eggs.
My eggs now come from the farm down the road where they all sit in the apple trees and get a fantastically varied diet - great tasting eggs and happy chooks.
Edited by tonyvid on Monday 22 February 17:45
bitwrx said:
Quietly ignoring the fact that more land was diverted away from feeding the starving Africans than if you had bought gaged-hen eggs.
not true. the problem is distribution, not production. there are millions of tonnes of surplus wheat produced each year which sits in sheds. The starving Africans don't have it because they have no money to pay for it.Has anyone bothered to ask the free range chickens if they are really happy though?. As much as people whinge about the weather etc, I would think the chickens would rather be sheltered in a warm. dry shed than outside in the pissing rain and cold, having to dodge foxes and all sorts.
I do buy Free Range meat and eggs, though I'm as cynical as the next PHer. I also try to buy them from farmers markets. Sure, my purchasing decision is tiny, and I cannot possibly make the sort of difference to farming practices that e.g. McDonalds have done in the US. But, if it allows room for improvement rather than a merciless focus on price I believe we'll get there in the end. Eggs in Borough Market (hardly cheap) are 12 for £2.20, which is barely more than battery eggs.
Organic vegetables are a whole other argument, however.
Organic vegetables are a whole other argument, however.
buy free range from a local farm shop, Franklins it is called, recall the guy commenting that his chickens were making a right mess of the field by splashing in all the muddy puddles, so guess they get out a fair bit, eggs taste great and the chickens have a yellow colour instead of the bland look from the supermarket
amir_j said:
anyone on here have any knowledge?
I've always thought PH has someone for everything so I hope not to let you down!No they're probably one of the few things that aren't a con.
Many are monitored by the RSPC Freedom Food Standards.
Here are some of mine
Couple of Points I'll make on the info the OP put up.
The comments from the farm worker do not ring true (for us egg producers anyway).
- "spend 1/2 their life i.e. 23 days outside". Egg laying birds do not start to lay until around 18 weeks of age & carry on until nearly 80 weeks.
- "Standard 1mSq per bird outside range". Freedom Foods standards = 1-2000 birds per hectare (10,000sq meters) depending on habitat
- "when inside & rotating their time outside!" as this is PH please view their time inside as being "like a garage where they park for the night" mine go in and sleep on perches or roof bars (there are requirements to ensure plenty perch space for each bird) and as for rotating them so they get equal time! The doors are opened and the birds all have access to go outside, at the same time. In the morning my birds pour out like ants to go and forage, going in and out as they like throughout the day.
- "rare producers stick to official standards" please, I've told you the comments from the farm worker are untrue, however the ones I have mentioned are rigourously enforced. As an egg producer we get visits & inspections from the Lion Brand People & the RSPCA's Freedom foods to ensure compliance.
Andy
Edited by AndyAudi on Monday 22 February 22:02
redtwin said:
Has anyone bothered to ask the free range chickens if they are really happy though?. As much as people whinge about the weather etc, I would think the chickens would rather be sheltered in a warm. dry shed than outside in the pissing rain and cold, having to dodge foxes and all sorts.
They're strange with the rain, sometimes they are happy in it other times not, although on wet days when it doesn't look like there are a lot out if you wander through the house it is amazing the number of "wet birds".They are not however a fan of bright sunlight, we are required to provide shaded areas for the birds and in the summer they lurk about beside them, at the moment they have been sticking to the shaded areas due to the glare from the snow!
Our hens are in a large field surrounded by an electric fence to deter foxes etc, this keeps stuff out but there are a few hens who've figured out how to escape through the wires as their feathers insulate them a bit.
Funny thing is when my Grandad was farming 50 odd years ago he kept what we now know as barn eggs. He'd got out of it by the time battery had come around, but now everyone is going on about how we need to think of the welfare of the Chicken and have barn or free range eggs. That's what we did do before everyone wanted something for nothing!
Slightly OT, but it's like home delivery. All the shops in my village in 50's and earlier (apparently, far too young to have seen it myself!) would deliver the goods to you, and the shops were open pretty much 24/7. Just walk in and ring the bell, if we're having tea we'll stop to serve you, was the way back then. Now the supermarkets deliver and stay open 24 hours and we are supposed to think this is some great new way!
Slightly OT, but it's like home delivery. All the shops in my village in 50's and earlier (apparently, far too young to have seen it myself!) would deliver the goods to you, and the shops were open pretty much 24/7. Just walk in and ring the bell, if we're having tea we'll stop to serve you, was the way back then. Now the supermarkets deliver and stay open 24 hours and we are supposed to think this is some great new way!
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