Sous Vide at home. Talk me in or out of it please.
Discussion
I was so close last light to ordering one of those 'Sous Vide Supreme' baths (just £349 from John Lewis)...
But then SWMBO caught sight of the laptop screen and informed me that "We're not having one of those as it won't get used and will just clutter up the kitchen and anyway they're for restaurant food so I won't use it and it's too much bother to use during the week..."
Anyway, after I'd reminded her about how I didn't object to any of the kitchen gadgets she's bought and the fact that I know perfectly well as soon as she eats the first meal I cook using it, she'll say how great it is, I'm still not yet decided myself whether I'll get the use out of it.
So, it would be great if I could have some reasons from the PH foodie collective why I should or shouldn't buy one.
Comments please...
But then SWMBO caught sight of the laptop screen and informed me that "We're not having one of those as it won't get used and will just clutter up the kitchen and anyway they're for restaurant food so I won't use it and it's too much bother to use during the week..."
Anyway, after I'd reminded her about how I didn't object to any of the kitchen gadgets she's bought and the fact that I know perfectly well as soon as she eats the first meal I cook using it, she'll say how great it is, I'm still not yet decided myself whether I'll get the use out of it.
So, it would be great if I could have some reasons from the PH foodie collective why I should or shouldn't buy one.
Comments please...
I've been playing around with sous vide on and off for a while and it definitely has advantages for certain things. Particularly for complex meat and fish dishes. I'm not convinced the average household has the eating habits to make use of a dedicated bit of kit regularly enough to justify it.
People bang on about steaks cooked sous vide and while I agree it does produce excellent results so does a red hot griddle pan. I find poultry is better cooked traditionally and plain fish is easy to poach.
Where sous vide comes into it's own is with something like I am doing this afternoon. It's a shoulder of lamb seamed into individual muscles which is them marinated pressed with spinach to form a joint. This is then cooked sous vide, chilled, wrapped in Serano ham, chilled again. The whole lot is then pan fried and carved for service.
If that's the sort of thing you do every week then maybe it's worth it. I don't have a dedicated machine but I have a combi steam oven which will take 16 litre trays and hold them at steady temp. If I was doing this sort of thing more regularly then I would buy a machine.
Where sous vide really comes into it's own and has gained notoriety is from commercial use. In a restaurant sous vide is a great way of ensuring consist quality and extending product life.
For the home I'd say much of what sous vide achieves can be done with cling film and a low oven or a steamer.
/Forgot to add, it's critical that the vacuum packer has variable "pressure" you don't want to vacuum pack a fish fillet at the same pressure as a carrot for example. this lamb I'm doing will be on a vacuum of 2 or 3 out of 10 (which is just over one atmosphere). any more than that and it will mishape the meat from the neat little parcel I've created.
People bang on about steaks cooked sous vide and while I agree it does produce excellent results so does a red hot griddle pan. I find poultry is better cooked traditionally and plain fish is easy to poach.
Where sous vide comes into it's own is with something like I am doing this afternoon. It's a shoulder of lamb seamed into individual muscles which is them marinated pressed with spinach to form a joint. This is then cooked sous vide, chilled, wrapped in Serano ham, chilled again. The whole lot is then pan fried and carved for service.
If that's the sort of thing you do every week then maybe it's worth it. I don't have a dedicated machine but I have a combi steam oven which will take 16 litre trays and hold them at steady temp. If I was doing this sort of thing more regularly then I would buy a machine.
Where sous vide really comes into it's own and has gained notoriety is from commercial use. In a restaurant sous vide is a great way of ensuring consist quality and extending product life.
For the home I'd say much of what sous vide achieves can be done with cling film and a low oven or a steamer.
/Forgot to add, it's critical that the vacuum packer has variable "pressure" you don't want to vacuum pack a fish fillet at the same pressure as a carrot for example. this lamb I'm doing will be on a vacuum of 2 or 3 out of 10 (which is just over one atmosphere). any more than that and it will mishape the meat from the neat little parcel I've created.
Edited by 21TonyK on Monday 31st January 14:35
21TonyK said:
Where sous vide comes into it's own is with something like I am doing this afternoon. It's a shoulder of lamb seamed into individual muscles which is them marinated pressed with spinach to form a joint. This is then cooked sous vide, chilled, wrapped in Serano ham, chilled again. The whole lot is then pan fried and carved for service.
If that's the sort of thing you do every week then maybe it's worth it. I don't have a dedicated machine but I have a combi steam oven which will take 16 litre trays and hold them at steady temp. If I was doing this sort of thing more regularly then I would buy a machine.
Now that sounds nice, but it's not the sort of thing I'd have time to do unless it was a special occasion. I'm forming the opinion that sous vide at home isn't going to give me much benefit day to day but for special meals, it could make a difference. Personally, I would probably justify it if I used it once every week, but maybe that's unrealistic. If that's the sort of thing you do every week then maybe it's worth it. I don't have a dedicated machine but I have a combi steam oven which will take 16 litre trays and hold them at steady temp. If I was doing this sort of thing more regularly then I would buy a machine.
FaineantFreddy said:
Now that sounds nice, but it's not the sort of thing I'd have time to do unless it was a special occasion. I'm forming the opinion that sous vide at home isn't going to give me much benefit day to day but for special meals, it could make a difference. Personally, I would probably justify it if I used it once every week, but maybe that's unrealistic.
I just changed my mind. the vacuum packer deformed the joint too much and unless you can get a "good fit" around the product then sous vide is pointless.Lamb is now in a low oven at 65 for a couple of hours.
Edited by 21TonyK on Tuesday 1st February 15:10
Tony- do you need to use a vacume packer? I have read about a lot of people just using ziplock bags with all of the air sucked out of them (i have done this myself with my makeshift setup) what is the benefit of putting something under really high pressure vacumes as opposed to heating it with most of the air expelled?
Pete Franklin said:
Tony- do you need to use a vacume packer? I have read about a lot of people just using ziplock bags with all of the air sucked out of them (i have done this myself with my makeshift setup) what is the benefit of putting something under really high pressure vacumes as opposed to heating it with most of the air expelled?
You don't need vacuum packer, it's just the simplest way to create a waterproof close fitting package. The point of expelling the air is so the surface of the product is in as near as direct contact with the water as possible without air pockets. This ensures a consistent surface temperature without hot spots. The level of vacuum is not relevant as long as the air around the product is expelled.Where higher pressure does become useful is for long term storage as expelling as much air as possible will help prolong the product life as well.
Seems dear for a slow cooker with an accurate thermometer. I reckon you could cobble together a good temp control using a project thermometer from radio shack with a relay for about £30 to control a conventional slow cooker, only issue would be mounting the probe. What makes these so much more?
hairyben said:
Seems dear for a slow cooker with an accurate thermometer. I reckon you could cobble together a good temp control using a project thermometer from radio shack with a relay for about £30 to control a conventional slow cooker, only issue would be mounting the probe. What makes these so much more?
Do a quick search on here. Several DIY solutions have been found. You can get a semi-commercial machine for £250 on eBay which I was/am/might thing about.FaineantFreddy said:
Personally, I would probably justify it if I used it once every week, but maybe that's unrealistic.
We bought one based on the 30 day trial period, and my OH was also of the opinion that it would never get used. We use ours 2-3x/week though and it will be staying. It is a lot cheaper over here though (US) - about half the UK price. timmybob said:
We bought one based on the 30 day trial period, and my OH was also of the opinion that it would never get used. We use ours 2-3x/week though and it will be staying. It is a lot cheaper over here though (US) - about half the UK price.
What do you find works in it for "every day" stuff?As you say Tony, some of what we cook in it (fish, steak) could be done other ways with similar results. I don't think I'd have tackled something like short-ribs without though as it meant we could cook them without braising. Really good for any meat that needs to be done long and slow that you don't want to cook in a sauce.
timmybob said:
Really good for any meat that needs to be done long and slow that you don't want to cook in a sauce.
Now that's one thing I was wondering about. We will quite often have pork belly or very slow cooked lamb shoulder or brisket or some other sort of meat which benefits from slow cooking, but often they'll be cooked in some sort of sauce, wine, beer, stock etc. which also helps add to the overall flavour.So if they aren't cooked in a sauce, is it necessary to put a lot more effort into a sauce when you come to serve it?
What happens with meats which produce their own gravy when oven cooked slowly (such as brisket, lamb shoulder etc.? Do the juices just stay in the meat and make it eben more moist or does the bag end up with enough liquid around the meat at the end of the cooking time to allow you to make a gravy?
It's not been mentioned yet, but in the US they have a Sous Vide (Supreme) Demi which is smaller and about 2/5ths of the price. Given how long it took for the manufacturer to fit 220V power to the Supreme, expect it here in about 6 months. I'd imagine £150-200 which seems reasonably sensible for home experimentation.
TomOSmith said:
It's not been mentioned yet, but in the US they have a Sous Vide (Supreme) Demi which is smaller and about 2/5ths of the price. Given how long it took for the manufacturer to fit 220V power to the Supreme, expect it here in about 6 months. I'd imagine £150-200 which seems reasonably sensible for home experimentation.
Or you could try and get one from the States and use a transformer. Although once you've added shipping, VAT etc. it's going to be around £250 and so I would expect them to sell for around the same price when the 220v versions get here.I've been thinking maybe it would be sensible for me to give it a go using a rice cooker and controller as Tontoro has done. It would give me the chance to try it out without spending too much money.
TomOSmith said:
It's not been mentioned yet, but in the US they have a Sous Vide (Supreme) Demi which is smaller and about 2/5ths of the price. Given how long it took for the manufacturer to fit 220V power to the Supreme, expect it here in about 6 months. I'd imagine £150-200 which seems reasonably sensible for home experimentation.
I think you mean 2/3 the price! At $180 they'd be selling a lot more than they do at the $300 the Demi actually costs...After a bit more research, I think I've found good compromise between cost, performance and practicality.
The SVM 1500D controller ($159.50 + free shipping)
http://freshmealssolutions.com/index.php?page=shop...
And a Morphy Richards 48715 6.5 litre Slow Cooker (£24.99)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Morphy-Richards-48715-litr...
That way, we can use the slow cooker for sous vide and regular slow cooking, so we get more use out of it and the start-up cost is going to be around £150. If we don't get on with it, I can always sell the controller on and we've still got a slow cooker which will be useful.
I am still tempted by the SVS Demi, but the information they had on their website seems to have disappeared so maybe they're having problems with it?
The SVM 1500D controller ($159.50 + free shipping)
http://freshmealssolutions.com/index.php?page=shop...
And a Morphy Richards 48715 6.5 litre Slow Cooker (£24.99)
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Morphy-Richards-48715-litr...
That way, we can use the slow cooker for sous vide and regular slow cooking, so we get more use out of it and the start-up cost is going to be around £150. If we don't get on with it, I can always sell the controller on and we've still got a slow cooker which will be useful.
I am still tempted by the SVS Demi, but the information they had on their website seems to have disappeared so maybe they're having problems with it?
Saw that, but didn't really want anything that large in the kitchen.
Too late anyway as my slow cooker is sitting here now waiting for the temperature controller to arrive next week
In the meantime, I've started reading this marvellous book:
It was a bit pricey for a cookbook, but I've already learned so much from reading just the introduction that I reckon it was worth it.
Now I'm planning a 2 or 3 course meal, cooking most of it sous vide, to get my GF properly hooked on the idea so I can justify a more expensive vacuum sealer and maybe a more sophisticated water bath set-up later in the year.
Thinking of salmon mi-cuit for the starter, but not decided on the main yet. Got some pork belly in the freezer, but also a couple of Dexter filet steaks. Wondering if filet might not be the best cut to cook in this way? Also got some ox cheeks I think...
Anyway, suggestions welcome...
Too late anyway as my slow cooker is sitting here now waiting for the temperature controller to arrive next week
In the meantime, I've started reading this marvellous book:
It was a bit pricey for a cookbook, but I've already learned so much from reading just the introduction that I reckon it was worth it.
Now I'm planning a 2 or 3 course meal, cooking most of it sous vide, to get my GF properly hooked on the idea so I can justify a more expensive vacuum sealer and maybe a more sophisticated water bath set-up later in the year.
Thinking of salmon mi-cuit for the starter, but not decided on the main yet. Got some pork belly in the freezer, but also a couple of Dexter filet steaks. Wondering if filet might not be the best cut to cook in this way? Also got some ox cheeks I think...
Anyway, suggestions welcome...
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