Drummers - Overated / Underated?

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

Following on from the 'guitarists' thread.

I'm fortunate enough to have been in some great bands, and seen some fabulous gigs.

Despite being a singer, I have always loved / wished I could play the drums.

Whenever I listen to music, my ear usually tunes into the drumming.

Spectaculour drumming skill really takes my breath away - I marvel at how some drummers manage to fit in so many different, technical sounds sometimes, all with military precision to the beat and tempo.

My vote for top man - Lars Ulrich, Metallica. Highly rated and rightly so.

Nicko Mc. Brain from Maiden - another superstar. I went to one of his 'drum clinics' back in the '90's, where he shared some technical tips, and it was clear just how passionate the man was about his drumming and just how much he used to practice, practice, practice - despite already being in one of the top bands of all time, he never stops practicing.

So overated / underated? Your comments please...

My vote for overated - Keith Moon. Not a great technical drummer by anyone's standards - just a mentalist who made lots of exciting noise with a big personality to match.

Next?

[Justin Cyder]

Of contemporary drummers, the one I feel is most underrated is Reni. Loose limbed percussion genius.

Him & Gene Krupa of course.

[drumsterphil]

Ok, I'll play (RRLRLL... ) -

There's probably loads of either category but he's a few for starters -

Over-rated -
Virgil Donati - virtuoso with a complete absence of feel
Larry Mullen (not sure if he's rated, but imo his playing is horrible)

Under-rated -
Paul Bostaph (much, much better than Lombardo)
Gene Hoglan (only now getting the true recognition he deserves)

[Foofighter]

Ray Luxury-Yacht said:

My vote for overated - Keith Moon. Not a great technical drummer by anyone's standards - just a mentalist who made lots of exciting noise with a big personality to match.

Never really heard anyone rate Keith Moon as a great drummer, but you won't find anyone who can copy him, or provide a beat like him. Listen to any Who track with him on drums and you soon realise how big a part he and John Entwistle were to their sound.

For that, I can't say you could call him overated. Underrated for sure!

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

Foofighter said:

Never really heard anyone rate Keith Moon as a great drummer, but you won't find anyone who can copy him, or provide a beat like him. Listen to any Who track with him on drums and you soon realise how big a part he and John Entwistle were to their sound.

For that, I can't say you could call him overated. Underrated for sure!

Ah, but that's two different things, no? 'Sound' and 'talent' aren't necessarily exclusive?

I can't play the drums for toffee, but I often get on my band's drummers kits and fk about when we have a break.

I played along to 'Baba O'really' recently, and kept up just fine with Mooney, even as a non player. My 'amateur smashing' sounded pretty similar to Mooney's 'unique' sound, according to my band mates....

[Sir Snaz]

Underrated - Steve Shelton (confessor).....amazingly lovely guy.....never seen anyone play drums as well

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_54BL0aOt5E&fea...

I defy anyone not to marvel at Steve's chops

Snaz

[Z06George]

Pretty much agree with all that's been said, here are my additions.

Overated:
Thomas Lang

Underated:
Max Roach
Kim Tompson
Lionel Hampton
Benny Benjaman
Tony Royster Jnr
Eric Moore
Aaron Spears

I think the list of underated drummers can go on forever, I did have more over rated drummers but mind has gone blank now. As for Lars I think he's largely rated as he should be, the right drummer for Metallica but by no means a good/underated drummer.

[Animal]

Always thought this was pretty good...

[tuscaneer]

the guy from cinematic orchestra is sensational.very understated but obscenely talented jazz drummer

[doosht]

Mitch Mitchell = awesome! Rip

[darreni]

Ray Luxury-Yacht said:

Ah, but that's two different things, no? 'Sound' and 'talent' aren't necessarily exclusive?

I can't play the drums for toffee, but I often get on my band's drummers kits and fk about when we have a break.

I played along to 'Baba O'really' recently, and kept up just fine with Mooney, even as a non player. My 'amateur smashing' sounded pretty similar to Mooney's 'unique' sound, according to my band mates....

Some of Moons playing gets a littled muffled in the mixing.
There wasn a classic albums doc about Who's Next a few years ago where Roger is in the Studio playing various tracks & isolating Keiths drumming & just laughing with excitement at how good he was.
If you've not seen it, The Who Live at the Isle of Wight DVD is superb, moon at his best.

I think his drumming is overshadowed by the rest of his life, which is a shame.

I agree 100% about Nico, great drummer & always seems to enjoy it.

[drumsterphil]

Lars - agree - the right drummer for Metallica but looks like he can't be arsed now, were his peers (Lombardo and Benante) are still improving.

Charlie Benante (Anthrax)is very under-rated.

I'd also go as far to say that Mike Portnoy was over-rated....

And, although I loved Fear Factory, Raymond Herrera was one dimensional (all feet, no hands).

If you're going to link to Meshuggah then praise has to be given Thomas Haake - truly incredible technique with sense of time and feel (check out Bleed if you've never heard his work).

Two drummers that immediately spring to mind as being utterly amazing and the complete package are Gavin Harrison and Marco Minneman.

Trouble today is that with the advent of Pro-tools there are soo many technically perfect drummers out there, but where's the feel???

Having said that my current fav is Chris Adler (LoG)- utterly amazing at what he does and can pull it off live.

[Greenwich Ross]

Dale Crover from the Melvins. Who he/they? Currently the Melvins have two drummers - this is them doing an end-of-set duel solo.

http://youtu.be/ycLnEOemOlo

If you wanna get into the Melvins, check out their (fairly) recent album Senile Animal (the first one where they started the two drummer formation).

[ratbane]

darreni said:

Some of Moons playing gets a littled muffled in the mixing.
There wasn a classic albums doc about Who's Next a few years ago where Roger is in the Studio playing various tracks & isolating Keiths drumming & just laughing with excitement at how good he was.
If you've not seen it, The Who Live at the Isle of Wight DVD is superb, moon at his best.

I think his drumming is overshadowed by the rest of his life, which is a shame.

I agree 100% about Nico, great drummer & always seems to enjoy it.

The reality is, The Who would not have been The Who without Keith Moon. I absolutely don't get the one drummer is better than another argument, unless we are looking at solo performers. Each member of The Who went into creating one of the great bands, and neither of them were the best at their chosen trade. Same goes for The Beatles. Without Ringo - wouldn't have worked. Daltrey and Townsend regularly comment that it was the inclusion of Moon that drove the band to another level.

It's definitely not all about technique. I mean Dave Weckl would make The Who sound like a lounge band. I've been drumming and recording for 3 decades, and the more I do, I realise the "greats" are not necessarily the clinicians. However, that doesn't account for Steve Gadd or Jeff Porcaro!!!!

[Chimune]

I agree with the above - each member of The Who was vital to The Who. I dont think many people rate him as a technically great drummer. Certianly not Pete or Roger.

Even Keith said he was 'The best Who-style drummer in the world' and that he just sang along with the rest of the band - using his drum kit.

He cited Gene Krupa has one of his heros.

I have nothing more to add to this thread !

[offspring86]

Z06George said:

Underated:
Max Roach
Tony Royster Jnr

I'd disagree with those 2 being underated. I wouldn't say they were by any means overated either. I think they get the praise and recognition they deserve, particularly Max as he was (and I guess in spirit, still is) hugely influential.

My underated drummer would be Darren Jesse of Ben Folds Five. They had good success in America, but the group never caught on here in the UK. All 3 members are brilliantly talented musicians who demonstrated an incredible amount of creativity and prioficiency with their instruments. Their songs ranged from jazz, to blues, to rock, to punk, to small amounts of metal. Coincidentally they announced a few days ago that they're reforming and writing a new album.

My overated drummer would be Thomas Lang, excellent technique and extremely skilled, but very boring, far too clinical and seems to be hell bent on fitting in as many notes as is humanly possible. Plus, what's up with the sleevless shirt and tie combo?

[Riff Raff]

I've started to get into Jazz a bit recently. And I'm ashamed to say I didn't know who Joe Morello was until I did. So, for me he's under-rated. And all done on a four drum, three cymbal kit.

[drumsterphil]

Have to say I agree with Thomas Lang being over-rated - incredibly boring to watch and listen to (and his video on how to play blast beats was laughable...).

If anybody saw the Dream Theatre auditions then completely under-rated has to go to Peter Wildoer who blew me away and should have got the gig (I did hear that Marco DID get the gig but then turned them down - whether that's true or not??...).

Derek Roddy has turned into a clinic bore now, which is a shame. Didn't like the hatchet job they did on Aquiles Priester either....

[gazza285]

drumsterphil said:

Gene Hoglan (only now getting the true recognition he deserves)

Are you sure? I toured with him in the mid '90s, he had a fanatical following then, plus groupies who followed him through Europe. Can't have been for his looks.


As for underated drummers, Bryan Spring.

[Ray Luxury-Yacht]

drumsterphil said:

Lars - agree - the right drummer for Metallica but looks like he can't be arsed now, were his peers (Lombardo and Benante) are still improving.

Charlie Benante (Anthrax)is very under-rated.

Yeh, know what you mean about Lars...the earlier stuff and his double bass drumming is quite something, but when I saw them last at the O2 (the seventh time I've seen them) he didn't seem to be on form...

Charlie Benante - is awesome in the song 'only'.