vigier rock guitar

[franki68]

I sold my beloved prs brazilian last week ,and having spent a few days trying out various other makes ,was only blown away by the vigier gv rock and the esp eclipse and the Rasmus Gutherie govan signature ,the tone and playability and build quality are exceptional.I am leaning towards the vigier However I struggled with one aspect on the Vigier ,the fret marking dots are only on the side of the neck and not on the fretboard which I have never encountered before and I found it a bit awkward to find where I was on the fretboard.
Has anyone got a similar guitar and if so do you get used to this ? Really aside from this the guitar meets all my needs but this is a major concern to me,so any advice appreciated.

[gbbird]

Not in the same league as the Vigier you are considering, but i had a yamaha with no dots on the fretboard, just at the top. Tbh it was a bit of a pain and i never really felt comfortable with it so i sold it, not solely because of the lack of fretboard markings, but this did play a part in my decision to sell.

My peavey v type also lacks fret markings, but i am more forgiving on this one because it is a nice guitar. Yu do get used to it, although it is sometimes a pain if you play a lot of complex lead stuff and need to make big leaps around the fretboard.

[dojo]

Do you really look at dots on the fretboard?
I only ever use the top ones!
Most of the classical guitars don't even have the top ones, may be one at fret 7 if you're lucky! That's all I really like.
In short you'll get used to it in no time...

[Gokartmozart]

If you bought it, could you have the fret makers added by a luither ?.

Might be work contacting these guys first to see whats possible.

http://theguitarrepairworkshop.com/services/

also NW guys

http://www.luthierdirectory.co.uk/luthiers/england...

supplies of Albalone http://www.luthierssupplies.co.uk/

[Justin Cyder]

I have a Takamine classical that has no side markers & that was a pain, but over time I've adjusted to referencing the fret markers.

[Mastodon2]

Fret markers are one of those comfort things for beginners really, they should become fairly redundant pretty early on in the learning process. I don't mind a decorative inlay around the 12th fret, but I don't like fret dots or markers. My dream guitar would have a blank board, I much prefer the clean look.

[franki68]

I use them when I am learning a song ,worked out its how I sit with the guitar and the tab ,so I took the plunge and bought it,and wow,really WOW ,what a bit of kit.
I've pretty much owned everything guitar wise but have to say this thing is sensational ,the build,playability and the tone are off the scale.

[gbbird]

Mastodon2 said:

Fret markers are one of those comfort things for beginners really, they should become fairly redundant pretty early on in the learning process. I don't mind a decorative inlay around the 12th fret, but I don't like fret dots or markers. My dream guitar would have a blank board, I much prefer the clean look.

Disagree. I'm no beginner, yet i still use them. As i think the majority of other accomplished players do, judging by the number of high end guitars crafted with fret inlays. They serve as a reference point

[Justin Cyder]

They're not a hindrance are they? Ergo they're a help. We all need to know where we are once in a while. I don't go in for the inverted snobbery thing with guitars & don't understand why some people do.

[Baryonyx]

They're ugly and unnecessary, so why bother? Especially as a reliance on them will mean you can't pick up a blank fretboard and go all Shawn Lane on it, to your detriment as a player.

Imagine asking a Cello player if they'd like some little dots for reference. Or maybe a few frets to help them out?

[dojo]

I always finding it embarrassing when talking to violinist friends about frets etc... they are always asking, well how could you possibly play a wrong note... guess only small comfort is we have to play chords which would be near enough impossible to do accurately and quickly on a fretless ... maybe

[Mastodon2]

Justin Cyder said:

They're not a hindrance are they? Ergo they're a help. We all need to know where we are once in a while. I don't go in for the inverted snobbery thing with guitars & don't understand why some people do.

I don't go for the whole "inverted snobbery" thing either, I just don't see why people think they are necessary - normally because they've only ever owned guitars with them. I'm sure that no guitarist with more than a few months of playing under his belt would struggle on a blank fretboard guitar, and tbh much like learning to type properly, the muscle memory required to perform the task by hand without looking is present in the individual long before most "take the leap" and realise they don't need to look at what they are doing. Even guitars with blank fretboards have dots on the side of the neck, so you never truly don't have them.

If you need to look at dots on the fretboard to understand where you are, how do you play and read music at the same time?

dojo said:

I always finding it embarrassing when talking to violinist friends about frets etc... they are always asking, well how could you possibly play a wrong note... guess only small comfort is we have to play chords which would be near enough impossible to do accurately and quickly on a fretless ... maybe

Ain't that the truth. Fretless bassists and guitarists have done without since the invention of electric instruments, and cellists, violinists etc have done without for hundreds of years. Not to mention practically every other stringed, brass or woodwind instrument out there that don't have visual markers. I agree they are useful when learning the instrument, but I'd bet you could blindfold any experienced guitarist on this forum and ask them to play a song they are comfortable with and they could do it without needing the dots, as they wouldn't even be able to see. As if by magic, eh?

Edited by Mastodon2 on Sunday 7th April 22:15

[Justin Cyder]

Mastodon2 said:

If you need to look at dots on the fretboard to understand where you are, how do you play and read music at the same time?

Routinely I don't but they don't hurt & from time to time I get lost. When I do get lost, they're there for me. That's all. I'm very imperfect as a musician, in fact in the overall scheme of things, I'm very average but I'm also not a beginner & I don't mind them, don't find them ugly nor unnecessary.

[Mastodon2]

Justin Cyder said:

Which shows it's not comparing apples with apples. Again, the inverted snobbery is a chuckle.


Shawn Lane being a case in point. Odd how as the proficiency increases, the passion in the actual music decreases. I guess if you're out to impress one another with your technical proficiency then fair enough, but I'd rather be moved by three chords than sit there stroking my goatee as Eric Johnson knocks out 16th notes on a fretless fanned fandango with no fret markers.

So much for a sensible debate then.

Out of interest, how do you measure "passion" in music as a quantifiable trait? This will be interesting, should I prepare for a genuine response or more childish insults?

[Justin Cyder]

Just an observation that as technical ability increases, the tendency to throw notes in increases exponentially. It's horses for courses, but the G3, seven string, post metal, whatever-core schtick leaves me cold. Only an opinion, but there's a very good reason why the pentatonic blues scale demonstrably dominates western music to this day & has done for a good sixty years.

For me it's just a shame that people who feel they've evolved beyond it rarely make enduring music. Again just my two cents & if you want to argue that whilst colouring in your fret markers, it's all good with me.

[Mastodon2]

Justin Cyder said:

Just an observation that as technical ability increases, the tendency to throw notes in increases exponentially. It's horses for courses, but the G3, seven string, post metal, whatever-core schtick leaves me cold. Only an opinion, but there's a very good reason why the pentatonic blues scale demonstrably dominates western music to this day & has done for a good sixty years.

For me it's just a shame that people who feel they've evolved beyond it rarely make enduring music. Again just my two cents & if you want to argue that whilst colouring in your fret markers, it's all good with me.

So is this that "inverted snobbery" thing you seem so keen to talk about?

[Justin Cyder]

If you like. I do get your point, by the same token you accept that not all of us have infallible photographic memory & so there are some who aren't absolute beginners & still find fret dots useful?

In other words, making music is a broad church with many points of view & few absolutes?

[Animal]

I've been playing for a long time and I'd still consider myself to be st. I need all the help I can get, be it fret markers, extra fingers, etc.

[vsonix]

yeah never been a problem for me, I always try and learn to feel my way round an instrument as quickly as possible, develop muscle memory to flit instantly from 5th, 7th & 12th fret then if I hit a wrong note either side of those I just bend the crap out of it till it sounds right... which I suppose is me ultimately admitting I have shoddy technique, haha!