Can Am Doors

[Graham-P]

I would like to redesign the way the gas struts operate when opening and closing the doors of the CanAm. I sometimes struggle to open the door when sitting inside as you have to push upwards at an angle to overcome the weight and the fact that the gas strut is pushing the door down, then half way up the strut takes over and whips the door up almost out of your hand.
Having had a look at this it seems the pivot point is all wrong, when you close the doors half way down the strut does nothing and the door slams (already lost a door mirror because of this). I’m none to good at working out these points so are there any clever bods out there who could help me come up with a strut position that when you pull on the handle will raise the door with the minimum of effort and in a controlled way and not just slam it open or shut.
I’m guessing that the hinge will be the limiting factor here.
Looks like I’m going to be busy over next winter with the stuff I have planned.
Any help would be appreciated .

Graham

[spatz]

since my gas strut broke a week ago I have removed it entirely and honestly I do not need it all
so in the next built will not fit it at all. Try it without !
The bigger problem I have are the door locks, if you push the door out it will get stuck in the door lock. Already grinded some
of the metal off but still annoying.

[Graham-P]

The problem I have is that I find it awkward and painful to open the doors and would really like to have assistance in the lifting. I know what you mean about the locks but that's another project!

Graham

[andygtt]

Graham-P said:

The problem I have is that I find it awkward and painful to open the doors and would really like to have assistance in the lifting. I know what you mean about the locks but that's another project!

Graham

it will take a little engineering, bring it round and we will do some brainstorming as Im sure there is a simple solution if we ponder it hard enough

[Spid]

I think they could do with a bit of work too, be interested in what you come up with
Adam

[MarkWebb]

I have all these problems as well. It seems that the gas strut applies a fairly constant load on the door but that the door weight changes with its angle being lightest when it is vertical and heaviest when nearly closed. The gas struts leverage needs to be increased as the door descends. Some sort of sprig to lift the door clear of the catch would solve the problem that Graham describes of the door catching if you don't lift at the correct angle. I have this problem as well.

[andygtt]

from memory having seen the GTR hinge it looked like the canam hinge is simply two of these welded together hence no engineering into getting it to work correctly (as the GTR one does)...

we have 2 choices I think, somehow add a shock or spring to existing setup or change the shock point on the hinge itself.

I favour the second, worth noting you can also get shocks that can be adjusted in resistace... if we use one of these and relocate the shock and hinge point we can make the door slowly open on its own when the door is released but still keep the resistance low enough to be able to be pulled down.

I cant see any way of doing this from behind the body... the shock will have to be partly on display IMO.

[F.C.]

MarkWebb said:

I have all these problems as well. It seems that the gas strut applies a fairly constant load on the door but that the door weight changes with its angle being lightest when it is vertical and heaviest when nearly closed. The gas struts leverage needs to be increased as the door descends. Some sort of sprig to lift the door clear of the catch would solve the problem that Graham describes of the door catching if you don't lift at the correct angle. I have this problem as well.

Sounds like door poppers is what you need.

Attach to inside bottom of door, as soon as the doocatch is released the door "pops" up 20mm or so clearing the catch.
Shutting is no problem drop door from 4-5 inches high and it should latch fully.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Door-Poppers-X2-Brand-ne...

[spatz]

great idea, many thanks !

[MarkWebb]

Agreed door poppers BUT are they man enough to lift the door of a Canam? Then I start thinking of positioning them on the front or back edge of the door so that they don't mark my precious C/F luggage box tops.
Will they be man enough? they usually only have to push a door outwards. Anybody with experience I would love to hear from you.

[F.C.]

MarkWebb said:

Agreed door poppers BUT are they man enough to lift the door of a Canam? Then I start thinking of positioning them on the front or back edge of the door so that they don't mark my precious C/F luggage box tops.
Will they be man enough? they usually only have to push a door outwards. Anybody with experience I would love to hear from you.

I have them fitted on my flush door GTR.
Just replaced them and repositioned and refitted new bowden cables to the actuators.
My doors "pop" nicely.

You can get various spring weights I've seen upto 95Lb quoted though mine are 25's I think.

Ps. if you do fit them they go at the bottom of the door at the catch end. sorry to state the obvious but you never know!

Edit to say they push on the area beyond the box lids.

Edited by F.C. on Wednesday 20th July 14:21

[V8 Vum]

Not sure how they work, so any pickys? Please?

[MarkWebb]

F.C. Not talking about lids. The whole top of my luggage compartment is C/F.
95lb should be more than enough. Do you know where I can purchase them with different spring rates?

[F.C.]

MarkWebb said:

F.C. Not talking about lids. The whole top of my luggage compartment is C/F.
95lb should be more than enough. Do you know where I can purchase them with different spring rates?

I've looked into this a bit more, I think the Poundage may be the "strength of the solenoid on remote "popper" doors.

However the poppers in the link are re-buildable so if they're not "man enough" for you you could change the spring easily.

[Storer]

Please forgive my ignorance but are Can-Am doors a lot heavier than GTR ones or is it just the way they are hinged?

I have no problem opening my GTR door.

My Cerbera has electric door openers (I think this is what you are calling "poppers") and I see them as an unnecessary complication especially if you end up with a flat battery. You need a "secret" way into the car in the event of a failure.

I want to spend time driving my car (when I eventually finish the rebuild!!!!) not fixing problems. When I walk up to the Cerbera there is always the question in the back of my mind "will the door open". The more electronics the more problems.

Paul

[F.C.]

Storer said:

Please forgive my ignorance but are Can-Am doors a lot heavier than GTR ones or is it just the way they are hinged?

I have no problem opening my GTR door.

My Cerbera has electric door openers (I think this is what you are calling "poppers") and I see them as an unnecessary complication especially if you end up with a flat battery. You need a "secret" way into the car in the event of a failure.

I want to spend time driving my car (when I eventually finish the rebuild!!!!) not fixing problems. When I walk up to the Cerbera there is always the question in the back of my mind "will the door open". The more electronics the more problems.

Paul

No poppers are a sprung loaded "plunger" that pushes the door open beyond the "catch point" of the locking mechanism.
Wnen the door handle or solenoid is operated the door "pops" open an inch or so on the plunger.

[Storer]

F.C. said:

No poppers are a sprung loaded "plunger" that pushes the door open beyond the "catch point" of the locking mechanism.
Wnen the door handle or solenoid is operated the door "pops" open an inch or so on the plunger.

This does sound exactly the same as a Cerbera. Push the button, the window drops about an inch and then the door "pops" open approx 2 inches.

Paul