Discussion
I have yet to start the repairs to my rear clip and wing but I have been thinking about the wing and possibly trying a newer looking design.
What got me thinking was this
or this
Both would require quite a lot of work to achieve.
Not thinking of trying to recreate the braking effect but possibly the raising and lowering so that at less than, say, 60mph it is down and part of the rear bodywork and above it rises up.
Discuss.
Paul
What got me thinking was this
or this
Both would require quite a lot of work to achieve.
Not thinking of trying to recreate the braking effect but possibly the raising and lowering so that at less than, say, 60mph it is down and part of the rear bodywork and above it rises up.
Discuss.
Paul
I knew this would polarise opinions.
My current wing is an early Factory standard 2 element and is very similar but not identical to the current design and will therefore need parts made specially to repair it (something the Factory supplier can do btw) but it will not be 'inexpensive'.
If I am going to spend a fair amount I am considering designing my own 'special' wing. It may not be a route I go down, but it is one I wish to investigate.
I am also thinking about changing to on the move hydraulically adjustable front dampers and if I do the pump could also power the wing up and down.
The biggest problem is the fact that the wing is mounted to the rear clip which in turn is only attached to the chassis by two ball joints at the rear that will have to take the increased load/weight. I know it is the same for the current wing so this may not be an issue.
Paul
My current wing is an early Factory standard 2 element and is very similar but not identical to the current design and will therefore need parts made specially to repair it (something the Factory supplier can do btw) but it will not be 'inexpensive'.
If I am going to spend a fair amount I am considering designing my own 'special' wing. It may not be a route I go down, but it is one I wish to investigate.
I am also thinking about changing to on the move hydraulically adjustable front dampers and if I do the pump could also power the wing up and down.
The biggest problem is the fact that the wing is mounted to the rear clip which in turn is only attached to the chassis by two ball joints at the rear that will have to take the increased load/weight. I know it is the same for the current wing so this may not be an issue.
Paul
I think that's a great idea, Paul. I like it when people customise their Ultimas. Nice though the cars are, it does get a bit boring looking at the same shape, so any deviation/potential improvement will be interesting at least.
Why not keep the same top surface as the the rear clip, so that it sits flush when not needed? When it raises, it could help with under-clip temperature reduction by leaving a hole in the clip. Controlling it wouldn't necessarily be difficult. You can get stand-alone programmable modules to control it, so that it raises on braking and cornering, or at a certain speed.
Do it!
Daniel
Why not keep the same top surface as the the rear clip, so that it sits flush when not needed? When it raises, it could help with under-clip temperature reduction by leaving a hole in the clip. Controlling it wouldn't necessarily be difficult. You can get stand-alone programmable modules to control it, so that it raises on braking and cornering, or at a certain speed.
Do it!
Daniel
Pedders said:
Saw this a while back, If it were used as an air brake I suspect the current mountings would give up pretty quickly.A new under clam mount for lateral and vertical movement.
F.C. said:
Saw this a while back, If it were used as an air brake I suspect the current mountings would give up pretty quickly.
A new under clam mount for lateral and vertical movement.
Agreed. I guess ideally you would attach the wing supports to the chassis, which would need some creative thinking around how to allow the rear clam to hinge whilst avoiding big slots in it!A new under clam mount for lateral and vertical movement.
Edited to add, as an afterthought, you might be able to add chassis mounted supports which sit just underneath the rear clam mounted wing mounts (and would transmit the force from the wing) rather than being directly connected.
Edited by Pedders on Sunday 12th January 11:32
Pedders said:
Agreed. I guess ideally you would attach the wing supports to the chassis, which would need some creative thinking around how to allow the rear clam to hinge whilst avoiding big slots in it!
The wing supports are already attached to the chassis via the clam hinge, though only with "normal" use in mind.The most efficient place to mount it would be directly to the uprights, however this may not be possible due to the size of the wheels.
so you will be looking at a chassis mounted design. there's enough chassis at the back to mount something to fairly easily. opening the clam will be your biggest issue. Do you want to remove the wing elements before opening the engine bay each time? could it raise with the clam and latch down solidly when closed?
so you will be looking at a chassis mounted design. there's enough chassis at the back to mount something to fairly easily. opening the clam will be your biggest issue. Do you want to remove the wing elements before opening the engine bay each time? could it raise with the clam and latch down solidly when closed?
The above comments are, as usual, helpful in the thought process.
Having the wing the shape of the rear clip is a good one and along the lines of my previous thoughts. It could sit in a cut out of the rear clip which would still be able to open when the spoiler was in the retracted position.
The rams could be mounted to the chassis and the wing supports could be a telescopic tube. The hole left when the wing raises could either give more ventilation (not really needed at more than 60mph) or it could be the shape of the underside of the wing blanking the engine bay off and sealed with rubber door seal.
I don't know how easy or practical it would be but food for thought.
The SS adjustable rear wing requires a complete redesign of the rear clip and is probably a step to far for me.
Paul
Having the wing the shape of the rear clip is a good one and along the lines of my previous thoughts. It could sit in a cut out of the rear clip which would still be able to open when the spoiler was in the retracted position.
The rams could be mounted to the chassis and the wing supports could be a telescopic tube. The hole left when the wing raises could either give more ventilation (not really needed at more than 60mph) or it could be the shape of the underside of the wing blanking the engine bay off and sealed with rubber door seal.
I don't know how easy or practical it would be but food for thought.
The SS adjustable rear wing requires a complete redesign of the rear clip and is probably a step to far for me.
Paul
Hi Paul,
I looked into doing similar on my Vortex, in the end I decided it was a bit too much work and never got round to it. There's a thread in the readers cars area, a guy with a honda civic, who has made an actuated rear wing and his own controller etc… might be worth a look for you. I'll see if I can find it somewhere.
EDIT - Found it http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
I looked into doing similar on my Vortex, in the end I decided it was a bit too much work and never got round to it. There's a thread in the readers cars area, a guy with a honda civic, who has made an actuated rear wing and his own controller etc… might be worth a look for you. I'll see if I can find it somewhere.
EDIT - Found it http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Edited by EddyP on Sunday 12th January 20:16
Storer said:
Thanks for the link Ed
I am not sure that Bowden cables would be strong enough for the pressure exerted by air at 150+mph. Hydraulics would be much stronger.
Paul
The Lotus 49 used a bowden cable to flatten the wing and two bungee straps pulled it in to position. In Mexico 1968, one of the.bungee cords fell off, But the wing still worked enough for Hill to win the race and the championship.I am not sure that Bowden cables would be strong enough for the pressure exerted by air at 150+mph. Hydraulics would be much stronger.
Paul
Don't rule out the concept as it is compact and very lightweight compared to anything hydraulic.
Quite agree Paul, however thought it might be useful, especially as the guy might people able to help you out on the electrical controlling side of things.
Pneumatics would be nice, but think it's tricky to control an pneumatic actuator to stop in a mid way position which you may want to adjust wing angle, the advantage of using the ables and a linear actuator is you can stop it anywhere.
Pneumatics would be nice, but think it's tricky to control an pneumatic actuator to stop in a mid way position which you may want to adjust wing angle, the advantage of using the ables and a linear actuator is you can stop it anywhere.
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