putting LS1 in Ultima or other mid-engine car
Discussion
See www.kennedyeng.com/ . They can supply the adapter, flywheel, starter and other misc items needed to mate the LSx engine to a G50 or other Porsche transaxle. I believe the factory adapter kit is mfg. by Kennedy. If for an Ultima, call the factory as they are putting together a complete kit to adapt these engines.
kitcar builder said:Kennedy is probably where I will be getting my adapter plate. For the LSx motor mounts, try Street & Performance. ...bottom of page 64 in the catalog...
Has anyone installed the all-aluminum LS1 Chevy engine in an Ultima? Can this engine be adapted to the Porsche transaxle? If not what transaxle can be used with it?
RedGTRUSA said:
Hey Kit Car builder... what LSx motor are you putting in? I'm very interested in putting a LS6 or maybe LS7 in my newly purchased Ultima. Do you know the price tag on the LS7 yet?
>> Edited by RedGTRUSA on Thursday 9th June 13:46
Kyle:
It seems to me there is a difference in the chassis between Gen I and LS installations. A call or email to the factory might clear this up. If you're considering this because you're still having problems getting yours going without problems......post the problems here, get some advice and look for a new shop. This isn't rocket science and a competent shop should get you squared away. Good Luck.
Brad Z
Kennedy has advised me that they do not do the LS1 to Porsche G50 kit because of problems with the starter mounting. There isn't a Porsche starter that will work with the compression ratio of a V8 and the reduction drive high torque starter will not fit to the LS1 engine because of the block design. It will work with the standard cast iron small block but not the LS1.
usagtrman said:
Hey Kit Car builder... what LSx motor are you putting in? I'm very interested in putting a LS6 or maybe LS7 in my newly purchased Ultima. Do you know the price tag on the LS7 yet?
>> Edited by RedGTRUSA on Thursday 9th June 13:46
Kyle:
It seems to me there is a difference in the chassis between Gen I and LS installations. A call or email to the factory might clear this up. If you're considering this because you're still having problems getting yours going without problems......post the problems here, get some advice and look for a new shop. This isn't rocket science and a competent shop should get you squared away. Good Luck.
Brad Z
Hey Brad,
I think ill have my 383 running fine after this week. My car has been in the shop for a few days. I’m waiting for my headers and mufflers to come back from Jet Hot coatings. I think the combination of Jet Hot coating and all the small adjustments to the carb will keep the car running cool. The guy at the shop told me he got the car to idle at 170 and stay there for 10 min before we sent the exhaust out to Jet Hot. That’s a huge improvement over going past 210 in less then 3 min. I also relocated a new bigger Optima battery to the passenger side pod. It cut 40% length off the battery distance and almost twice the power. I also bought a beautiful carbon wing ($2,300 less then the factory wing) and I’m having them make custom brackets. Let me know if you want to see pics!
Kyle
BigAl1 said:Me too. The starter-fitting issue is one for certain gearboxes where the bellhousing needs to be clearanced (something like that). There are folks on this list that have done it themselves with a hand-held grinder. However, the trans builder should be able to set you up with the right combination. If you don't have a trans guy yet, there are a couple of good guys that have put boxes together for the Ultima. PH-II in Colorado (listed above) is one. California Motor Sports in Lake Havasu, AZ is another (that I am using). CMS works closely with Kennedy, as they are in each other's back yard.
When I emailed with Kennedy several weeks ago, they verified they have an adapter for my setup (LS6/G50/03), and supplied info about other transmissions that I was asking for. No hint at all about not selling to me!
RE: The LS7
This is high on my list. If it's available when I am ready, it will receive very serious consideration. I am on a couple of major distributor's waiting lists to get one. However, out of the box, it is not what I am looking for power-wise at 505 crank HP. That said, 505 should keep me very happy until I learn to drive the car and desire more thrust. Without question, there will be LS7 aftermarket parts coming quickly that will boost HP to 650+ N/A. The next engine down the list is a solid-roller, dry-sump, forged, stroked, 402 LS2. Lastly, a similar SBC with fuel injection.
It has been indicated, by folks at GM, that the LS7 will retail for $15k. I don't know if that's a long block, or everything including the computer. The street price is expected to be $12-13k. The block is
said to be available separately, as well. GM's Public Relations department has stated that the crate engine will be available at the same time as the Z06. So, we should see them start to show up in August/September...I hope!!!
Boosted LS1 said:Are you going 4.2 bore and 4.125 stroke for a 457ci engine? Low compression for boosing?
Why go ls7? I'm slowly building a darton MID with ls7 heads and titanium rods. It will be a stronger block/combo and will have forged not cast pistons.
Boosted.
Why, you ask? "Why not?", might be a better question. There are lots of good reasons to go LS7. For me, it will come down to price, timing, and availability. Clearly, the LS7 will be an excellent choice for the Ultima:
Dependability
Factory warranty
Parts will be available at your local GM dealer
Probably 25+ mpg
Buy it, hook it up, drive it
Z06 killer with a Z06 engine
And, in 6-12 months, if you want more grunt (when you get bored with 505+ crank HP), change the heads, cam, intake, computer program, and make 600-700 HP. Add a six pound ProCharger and HOLD-ON-BETTY! Go with solid-rollers and turn it to 8k! WooooHoooo! Frankley, I am not sure how manageable an Ultima would be with that much power under foot. Sure would be fun though...
I wouldn't go Darton with my build schedule. And, for reliability, I would only get a sleeved block from the guy in southern California that invented the process. Also, the word on the street is...aftermarket block manufacturers are preparing to release big-bore LSx blocks (near future). Anyway...I'll have to see what's available in September/October before I decide.
Yes Builder,
It's going to be a 427 MID and yes it will be low compression hence the opportunity to improve the pistons at the same time. I like the MID blocks and I've seen the ls7 heads so putting them together should be good and if I damage an insert/liner it's easy enough to replace. Plus the liners will be much stronger then the ls7 stuff and won't crack under detonation. I couldn't afford to damage the ls7 block. The ls7 is a very exciting package and certainly got my attention but I suspect demand will be high as will initial prices. I can see why it appeals to you though. I shall use a wet sump and my own intake flanges so it will be a flexible combo (for me anyway) once it's built.
I've heard about the bigger blocks maybe being available but not seen anything more definate yet, have you?
Boosted.
It's going to be a 427 MID and yes it will be low compression hence the opportunity to improve the pistons at the same time. I like the MID blocks and I've seen the ls7 heads so putting them together should be good and if I damage an insert/liner it's easy enough to replace. Plus the liners will be much stronger then the ls7 stuff and won't crack under detonation. I couldn't afford to damage the ls7 block. The ls7 is a very exciting package and certainly got my attention but I suspect demand will be high as will initial prices. I can see why it appeals to you though. I shall use a wet sump and my own intake flanges so it will be a flexible combo (for me anyway) once it's built.
I've heard about the bigger blocks maybe being available but not seen anything more definate yet, have you?
Boosted.
Yup, unfortunately I can't make the time, and don't feel I have enough experience to build my own (high-performance, high-cost) engine. I have put together a couple of small blocks that are still running (knock on wood). If one of those lets go, it's a couple thousand dollars vs. $10k-$15k. Sure would like to, though. Maybe next time...
Boosted, why not go big? A 4.2" bore and 4.125" stroke will yield a 457 cubic inch engine, which is about seven percent more than a 427. I imagine a 10 percent loss (of that increase) due to size, but a net gain NA of probably 40+ HP. I presume your block has a 4.125" bore and 4" stroke. Are there issues boosting with the Darton 4.2" bore? Either way, that engine will dominate. Also, are you using the Evans pump and NPG+ coolant?
If the LS7 is not available, my next choice is a solid-roller, forged, stroked, dry-sump, 402 LS2 with a ported FAST 90 intake/TB and a dyno-tuned LSx PCM at about 11:1 static CR and 8.5:1 DCR. It should make between 600-650 HP on 91 octane pump gas with an aggressive lobe. Even if the LS7 is available, I still may choose the LS2 depending on price.
No confirmed date on the bigger factory blocks yet. The reps are saying "very soon" without quoting a date, so I am guessing a coupld of months.
With all of the options, I have to wait and see what's happening in a couple of month, when I am ready to pull the trigger. It's really amazing... And I thought the computer industry was evolving quickly!
Boosted, why not go big? A 4.2" bore and 4.125" stroke will yield a 457 cubic inch engine, which is about seven percent more than a 427. I imagine a 10 percent loss (of that increase) due to size, but a net gain NA of probably 40+ HP. I presume your block has a 4.125" bore and 4" stroke. Are there issues boosting with the Darton 4.2" bore? Either way, that engine will dominate. Also, are you using the Evans pump and NPG+ coolant?
If the LS7 is not available, my next choice is a solid-roller, forged, stroked, dry-sump, 402 LS2 with a ported FAST 90 intake/TB and a dyno-tuned LSx PCM at about 11:1 static CR and 8.5:1 DCR. It should make between 600-650 HP on 91 octane pump gas with an aggressive lobe. Even if the LS7 is available, I still may choose the LS2 depending on price.
No confirmed date on the bigger factory blocks yet. The reps are saying "very soon" without quoting a date, so I am guessing a coupld of months.
With all of the options, I have to wait and see what's happening in a couple of month, when I am ready to pull the trigger. It's really amazing... And I thought the computer industry was evolving quickly!
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