Advice needed on 2nd-Hand Ultima purchase

[RS2_Russ]

Hi guys,
I have just trawled through all 313 pages of your forum, picking out all the good info! Why? Because I am thinking of buying this car: http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/198186.htm

I am thinking of trading in my (excellent) 996 Turbo (2001) for this car in order to:
a. Drive a British car
b. Double my power-to-weight ratio
c. Pay homage to the Group C racers I love and which Ultimas look like
d. Not drive a car loaded with stereotypes/ensuing reactions of other cars
e. Run a simpler, lighter, less expensive car to maintain

I would use the car once a week to travel about 70 miles: 50 motorway, 20 fun A-roads.

1. Do any of you guys know this car; its history,racing or otherwise?
2. Is this state of tune/setup too extreme for road use? Not bothered about track performance myself.
3. Will it be OK using it like this?
4. Will it be reliable (I will literally have a plane to catch half the time!)?
5. Does the car cope with bad weather ok? I will use it all year round.
6. Am I mad?

I would really appreciate your thoughts on whether to trade in or stick with the porsche.

Thanks ia, Russ (used to drive Audi RS2 btw, hence the tag)

[TuxMan]

Hi Russ ,nice looking car have not seen it around but to be honest i would buy a cheap diesel for the regular runs and save the ultima for the weekends !!! sounds like you will get the regular msd/carb/crap in traffic issues unless its been well sorted and i.m not sure about useing it all year round ....bit of a handfull in the frost !!!!! but when the sun comes out !!!! awsome ...the nice thing about the porsche is it is a usable supercar with 30 years of development the Ultima is not its a handbuilt supercar which will need constant care and attension ...........but when you drive it you will know it was worth it !!!! .

[GTWayne]

^ Agree with what Simon says ( Simon says?, sounds like a party game ) and don't get me wrong, I LOVE my Ultima, but it aint no Porsche. Yes, it is quicker, more visceral, and many other plus points but I think that unless you are a hands on kind of guy with regards to maintenance and are bestowed with more than your fair share of patience, you will soon yearn for that Porsche turbo as it is the most all round tool that is available IMO.

[RS2_Russ]

Thanks very much guys for your replies. Much appreciated.
Russ

[highflyer]

Yo Russ just a thought, where will you be leaving it when you catch the plane, because these cars attract a lot of attention, and I wouldn't leave it in an unattended car park, reliability ? no problem, after all its a Chevy, and if you are a hands on guy, you can do the servicing yourself and save a fortune against the porsche costs, and its kinda fun working around the car yourself, GO FOR IT !! there is nothing like an Ultima, best of Luck from another Russ

[RS2_Russ]

Hi again,
I was a little disappointed when you guys (quite rightly, thank you) recommended against the Ultima; it is a credit to your integrity that you are so open about your cars.

HOWEVER.............

It made me realise JUST how much I want an Ultima now, so I thought some more and will put a little aside to fit MASS-FLO fuel injection to the car IF it's really not good < 2000rpm. My father is an engineer who can take apart/put together engines with his eyes closed, so he can teach me all I need to know and certainly fit Mass-Flo easily. Might be worth it anyway just to get better MPG!

So thanks, GT_Wayne and TuxMan, for your sage advice, but I WILL go and look at the car and if there's ANY way I can do the deal (both cars worth pretty much the same I reckon) I will!

Excellent point, highflyer, regards security, but I park in a friendly farmer's locked barn, so the old girl's tucked away most satisfactorily. Thanks for the "Go for it", too

Hope to see more of you guys online in the future, if the garage co-operates on the deal.
Thanks again, Russ

Edited by RS2_Russ on Sunday 2nd September 21:47

[Steve_D]

I should draw your attention to the classifieds section which contains examples of younger, cheaper, and better spec cars than you are looking at in the dealer. We also know the cars so can tell you something about them (the owners will just have to wait and see what we say).

Steve
PS None of them are mine nor do I have a specific interest in them other than pointing you at a good deal.

[crafty]

If you want a "daily" driveable Ultima, put an LS engine in it. It will still have all of its other peculiarities that make it less than ideal "daily", but overheating, fuel smell, stalling, engine longevity and (compared to a carbed small block chev) fuel economy will not be issues.

[andygtt]

completely agree with crafty, stick an LS engine in, they are so much better its not funny.... I used my canam (now highflyers canam) as often as I could afford but the SBC just makes it impractical as an everyday car, but an LS would solve that.

I also left it werever I went, in multi story car parks, high streets, work car park. wherever. After all lets be hounest if its gona be stolen then its gona be a pro job... and it could just as easily get scratched etc at a show/meet...
Not saying I didn't worry about the car, but no more than any other car I owned of the same value.

IMO if you could live with a lotus elise everyday and liked tinkering then you could live with an LS powered Ultima.

[TuxMan]

or you could fit a EFI engined small block !!!!

[GTWayne]

^ Now why on earth didn't I think of that

[andygtt]

Unfortunatelly a SBC even with FI will never even be close to an LS engine IMO, just much better than a carbed SBC.
I must admit whilst I loved my Ultima and never had any trouble with the engine I'd never have a carbed SBC in anything again, not even if I had an old hotrod.

[TuxMan]

Very true Andy ...but its the next best thing (even if it won't work)

[GTWayne]

andygtt said:

Unfortunatelly a SBC even with FI will never even be close to an LS engine IMO

How so Andy?

My engine builder is indeed impressed with the latest generation of LS series motor but tells me that the old school small block that is built using high end aftermarket components and state of the art FI is still the better outright alternative ( IHO that is ).
Even if this is a slightly biased opinion, ( and I am not saying that it is ), surely the two are not that far apart?

[harshman]

Apart from the substantial block changes that are incorporated in the LS (that will allow it to handle a greater HP load), here is another thread about why the LS is indeed superior.


http://www.pro-touring.com/forum/showthread.php?t=...

[Boosted LS1]

GTWayne said:

andygtt said:

Unfortunatelly a SBC even with FI will never even be close to an LS engine IMO

How so Andy?

My engine builder is indeed impressed with the latest generation of LS series motor but tells me that the old school small block that is built using high end aftermarket components and state of the art FI is still the better outright alternative ( IHO that is ).
Even if this is a slightly biased opinion, ( and I am not saying that it is ), surely the two are not that far apart?

As stock, they're miles apart technology wise but maybe the older engine can be specced up more cheaply because of the huge aftermarket parts availability? That said, there's a lot of stuff available for the lsx these days. The lsx ecu is way superior to aftermarket stuff unless you get into the top end ecu's at what a couple of grand upwards? LSx initial investment is costly but it is certainly superior, it's all aluminium for starters and only shares the rod bearings with the earlier engines. Rest of the package was a totally new design.

Boosted.

[crafty]

GTWayne said:

.....but tells me that the old school small block that is built using high end aftermarket components and state of the art FI is still the better outright alternative

Not for daily driveability.

Oil Leaks?
Belt problems?
Overheating?
Rev control with AC (using standard GM ECU)

etc etc

[GTWayne]

The main point that I was asking is that, is a 'built' SBC really that far apart from a standard LS7?

[G Man]

RS2_Russ said:

Hi again,
I was a little disappointed when you guys (quite rightly, thank you) recommended against the Ultima; it is a credit to your integrity that you are so open about your cars.

HOWEVER.............

It made me realise JUST how much I want an Ultima now, so I thought some more and will put a little aside to fit MASS-FLO fuel injection to the car IF it's really not good < 2000rpm. My father is an engineer who can take apart/put together engines with his eyes closed, so he can teach me all I need to know and certainly fit Mass-Flo easily. Might be worth it anyway just to get better MPG!

So thanks, GT_Wayne and TuxMan, for your sage advice, but I WILL go and look at the car and if there's ANY way I can do the deal (both cars worth pretty much the same I reckon) I will!

Excellent point, highflyer, regards security, but I park in a friendly farmer's locked barn, so the old girl's tucked away most satisfactorily. Thanks for the "Go for it", too

Hope to see more of you guys online in the future, if the garage co-operates on the deal.
Thanks again, Russ

Edited by RS2_Russ on Sunday 2nd September 21:47

RS2_Russ

If you want a proper Ultima, I have a proper one that is for sell when I get round to it !!
It has a little bit of history too !!

G Man

[Boosted LS1]

GTWayne said:

The main point that I was asking is that, is a 'built' SBC really that far apart from a standard LS7?

It could make similar power and might cost less but it would certainly weigh a lot more and it could never be as efficient as an ls7 package with modern engine management etc.

Boosted.