Hi-fi separates advice needed.
Discussion
Hi Guys,
In the 1980’s I bought an Aiwa stereo system from Currys. It has a turntable, radio and twin cassette deck. I also connected a CD player to it. On the whole, it did exactly what I wanted it to do. However, having retired, I now want a decent/better set up. I am sure that I want a separate system. I know that I want a turntable, a CD player and an amplifier. Part of me would like a cassette deck, mini-disc player and radio, but these are not crucial, just on my unlimited budget wish list!
My questions are;
1) Would it be better to have a system where all the components come from the same manufacturer or is it better to “mix and match?”
2) Can anyone recommend a “universal” stand for such a set-up?
3) Can anyone recommend a supplier? I’ve looked at Richer sounds, but are there any others?
Finally, I should point out that my budget is not unlimited and it would be my intention to buy a component every month or two. I would also like advice/suggestions on speakers and connecting cables!
Thanks for all constructive responses.
In the 1980’s I bought an Aiwa stereo system from Currys. It has a turntable, radio and twin cassette deck. I also connected a CD player to it. On the whole, it did exactly what I wanted it to do. However, having retired, I now want a decent/better set up. I am sure that I want a separate system. I know that I want a turntable, a CD player and an amplifier. Part of me would like a cassette deck, mini-disc player and radio, but these are not crucial, just on my unlimited budget wish list!
My questions are;
1) Would it be better to have a system where all the components come from the same manufacturer or is it better to “mix and match?”
2) Can anyone recommend a “universal” stand for such a set-up?
3) Can anyone recommend a supplier? I’ve looked at Richer sounds, but are there any others?
Finally, I should point out that my budget is not unlimited and it would be my intention to buy a component every month or two. I would also like advice/suggestions on speakers and connecting cables!
Thanks for all constructive responses.
I’d highly recommend going to your nearest Richer Sounds and listening to a good selection and the What HiFi recommendations at the relevant price point are a god starting point.
I started with a Pro-Ject Essential III turntable, an Onkyo 9010 amp and a pair of Q Acoustics 3020s, all of which I’m very pleased with. There were various other options at the same rough cost I auditioned.
There’s also the vintage route - I picked up a Marantz CD63II KI Signature CD player which is amazing.
I started with a Pro-Ject Essential III turntable, an Onkyo 9010 amp and a pair of Q Acoustics 3020s, all of which I’m very pleased with. There were various other options at the same rough cost I auditioned.
There’s also the vintage route - I picked up a Marantz CD63II KI Signature CD player which is amazing.
Likewise, I am just starting to get into wanting some “decent” HiFi stuff, after years of being happy listening to Spotify music via various speakers in the house/connected to a BOSE dock etc.
I went down the vintage route for a starter, to see if I was actually going to use the stuff or if it would just be a passing and expensive fad.
Turns out I had really forgotten what it sounded like to have a house full of sound, with some depth.
I picked up a Yamaha CDs 300 from eBay.
Bought an Audio Technica LP120 BTUSB turntable
And then found a decent vintage/second hand place and went along to “just have a look”.
Left with a Marantz amp and a pair of Wharfedale Pacific EVO30’s and some bits (cables and whatnot) for about £350.
Am pretty pleased with the sound, as a “starter/newbie/budget” system, but the speakers could take a bit more shove and so I am now on the search for a more powerful amp….
….. and getting scope/budget creep.
Initial set up is below.
Wharfedale Pacific EVO30’s and Marantz amp.
https://youtu.be/uQE7XfGBaeU
TLDR.
Buy some stuff, but try and listen to it before buying, and welcome to the quite enjoyable wormhole that has taken even two hours of this eve as I casually browse amps that i can’t afford
Cheers
I went down the vintage route for a starter, to see if I was actually going to use the stuff or if it would just be a passing and expensive fad.
Turns out I had really forgotten what it sounded like to have a house full of sound, with some depth.
I picked up a Yamaha CDs 300 from eBay.
Bought an Audio Technica LP120 BTUSB turntable
And then found a decent vintage/second hand place and went along to “just have a look”.
Left with a Marantz amp and a pair of Wharfedale Pacific EVO30’s and some bits (cables and whatnot) for about £350.
Am pretty pleased with the sound, as a “starter/newbie/budget” system, but the speakers could take a bit more shove and so I am now on the search for a more powerful amp….
….. and getting scope/budget creep.
Initial set up is below.
Wharfedale Pacific EVO30’s and Marantz amp.
https://youtu.be/uQE7XfGBaeU
TLDR.
Buy some stuff, but try and listen to it before buying, and welcome to the quite enjoyable wormhole that has taken even two hours of this eve as I casually browse amps that i can’t afford
Cheers
TwigtheWonderkid said:
I think Aiwa cassette decks had a pretty good reputation, so the one from your existing old system would probably do a half decent job, assuming you can separate it from the rest.
I’d be surprised if an 80s cassette deck was in decent working order now, but you could get a period one that’s been refurbished with new belts etc. I was always partial to Sony equipment and they did some very nice Dolby S decks. Failing that, there’s a new Teac 850 with tape and CD in a single unit that’s worth a look.
First of all, sort out an approximate budget.
Whether that’s for the whole system or per component, just do it. Until you and say, Richer Sounds, know what you’re happy to spend, you’ll get nowhere.
Richer will want to know how big your listening room is, its shape, and how it’s furnished. Do you want floor standing speaker? Speakers up against a wall? Bookshelf speakers on stands?
Once you have speakers that should make you happy, an amp that’s suitable for them is next on the list. It needs to be powerful enough and have the features/connections you require. Does it need an internal phono amp?
After that, the source components just do their job as required.
Stand? Don’t spend silly money. Maybe look online at what ikea have in their tables and sideboards. Stands really are a personal taste.
Whether that’s for the whole system or per component, just do it. Until you and say, Richer Sounds, know what you’re happy to spend, you’ll get nowhere.
Richer will want to know how big your listening room is, its shape, and how it’s furnished. Do you want floor standing speaker? Speakers up against a wall? Bookshelf speakers on stands?
Once you have speakers that should make you happy, an amp that’s suitable for them is next on the list. It needs to be powerful enough and have the features/connections you require. Does it need an internal phono amp?
After that, the source components just do their job as required.
Stand? Don’t spend silly money. Maybe look online at what ikea have in their tables and sideboards. Stands really are a personal taste.
As others have said, start with a combo of What HiFi and Richer Sounds. You can't really go wrong. I've been doing that since buying my first place in 1997.
Going s/h is also an option - you can get some great used kit on AV Forums and eBay. I bought a great AV receiver that way as the owner wanted the later interface/software. I didn't care about that; just wanted the higher grade internals.
I paid something like £350 for something that was released at £1.5k and was selling for £1k towards the end. Seven years on and it's still doing great service. Teamed with some MA Gold bookshelf speakers that I bought in 2008. So I have an amp that's maybe 15 years old and speakers that are 18 years old in use every single day. Plus a sub freed up from a previous surround sound set up that's well over 10 years old.
Just a thought. Goes off to look at Arcams on eBay.....
Going s/h is also an option - you can get some great used kit on AV Forums and eBay. I bought a great AV receiver that way as the owner wanted the later interface/software. I didn't care about that; just wanted the higher grade internals.
I paid something like £350 for something that was released at £1.5k and was selling for £1k towards the end. Seven years on and it's still doing great service. Teamed with some MA Gold bookshelf speakers that I bought in 2008. So I have an amp that's maybe 15 years old and speakers that are 18 years old in use every single day. Plus a sub freed up from a previous surround sound set up that's well over 10 years old.
Just a thought. Goes off to look at Arcams on eBay.....
Mr.Chips said:
My questions are;
1) Would it be better to have a system where all the components come from the same manufacturer or is it better to “mix and match?”
There is no 'one size fits all' answer but, if you look at most peoples' systems, you will see a few different manufacturers represented. Lots of brands specialize in certain areas and few cater for all, so I would try out what you like and create your own system rather than take a specific manufacturer's predetermined path. 1) Would it be better to have a system where all the components come from the same manufacturer or is it better to “mix and match?”
Mr.Chips said:
2) Can anyone recommend a “universal” stand for such a set-up?
Again, not necessary. My equipment sat on a dedicated hifi rack for years. I currently house my equipment on a 16th century court cupboard and the sound difference between the two was zero. Unless you want a turntable, isolation of equipment doesn't need to be a consideration providing sensible placement of items and cables. Depending on your furnishings, you may find a hifi rack jars with the overall aesthetic in an event. Mr.Chips said:
3) Can anyone recommend a supplier? I’ve looked at Richer sounds, but are there any others?
Google is your friend. You will notice with hifi that there is very little difference in price between shops outside of sales or ex-demonstration items. I bought my amplifier through Vickers Hifi in York but they didn't have it in stock, so they sourced me one from The Music Room in Glasgow. In short, authorized dealers should help you locate what you want whether it's from their shop or not. I would buy from whoever has what I want and values customer service. In my experience Richer Sounds fall short on both fronts. Mr.Chips said:
Finally, I should point out that my budget is not unlimited and it would be my intention to buy a component every month or two. I would also like advice/suggestions on speakers and connecting cables!
Buy the cheapest cables that do the job. Van Damme receive good reviews and even Amazon basics have equalled (or bettered in some cases) extremely expensive cables in blind tests. Use the power leads provided and spend the extra money on equipment that makes a difference. Speakers are probably the most important component of a hifi system and, as such, I would work backwards from the speakers. Don't be tempted to buy speakers that are too big for the room and take into consideration the placement and power requirements. Some speakers are more happy than others to be placed against walls for example. Work out your room, then your speakers, then the amplification that feeds your chosen speakers sufficiently for your listening requirements. The source gear is less critical. Far more important is what you are playing rather than what it's being played on. Oasis won't sound good on a £100k player whereas Tracy Chapman will sound excellent on a £200 one.
I have optimized my room as best I can, within the realms of maintaining comfort and aesthetics, but there are still certain tracks (predominantly jazz and piano) that just don't agree with the room acoustics. I use headphones for these tracks.
Good luck in your quest.
I think that 90% of components operate at 90% levels in 90% of circumstances, generally speaking. Your room probably dictates 'how it sounds' more than anything, and most of that isn't radically changeable in usual domestic circumstances. Our ears are probably the limiting factor at our age for that nth degree stuff, most kit will operate well beyond our spec.
Things like cables [both between componants and from amp to speakers] can be relatively cheap and generic without compromise, don't sweat these, the only time I've done so is taking a moving coil signal where you look for low impedance and good shielding to the phono stage particyularly, but even that I wouldn't worry about too much.
i. For a turntable I'd look at either Pro-ject or Rega - Rega would be my preference but only as I've had one. If you want something a little more 'plug-n-play' with maybe some more automation [easy 45rpm/33rpm] I'd look at Technics. The Rega cartridges are generally good [I've been through a few] and I'd just stick to MM for compatibility and a lower noise floor [as if we'd hear it!]. Either offer excellent value for money and should last years.
ii. No idea whatsoever on CD players, except the internals of most are mostly the same, probably an aesthetic choice as much as anything.
iii. For amps, it depends - for a 'one stop shop' that's under a grand new, that performs well, with enough power to drive most speakers, I'd look at something like a Rega Brio Mk 7 integrated as a start point / bench mark for what features/quality you are looking for - well engineered, digital inputs for when you need, MM phono stage, remote and a headphone socket should cover most needs.
iv. For stands, again, anything flat and approved by the ministry of the interior will do - largely aesthetic. For the turntable you may want to isolate it from the same floor as your speakers and feet are vibrating on [esp. if wooden/sprung]. Best solution is always wall mounting, but various isolation platforms/feet exist. Not hugely critical but some decoupling is a 'good to have' certainly.
v. Speakers - virtually every speaker when reviewed is an improvement over the last one to be reviewed...it's another '90%' component again I think - and again room is a factor - small speakers/floorstanders depending how much oomf you want/room you have - don't let size fool you though - plenty of small yet loud speakers out there... They are all generally around 8Ohm/87dB sensitivity when you look at specs, so anything 'standard' will be easy to drive with most amps.
At this stage they are maybe the most influential part of the system, think where you will be told to put them and look at the bass porting directions if it's ported. Certainly take some time out for a no obligation listen, ideally a few examples for A<->B comparisons and to get a sense of them but again, think about the space they will end up in.
vi. New or S/H? Lots of bargains and pitfalls with preowned, usual caveats, I prefer old British stuff but it's largely a mental trick, a new Chinese D class will sound within the 90% range but just isn't satisfying mentally!
For the TT watch for shipping damage and add a new cartridge cost, for much older amps have a friendly technician for re-capping etc if need be. Otherwise there are some absolutely fantastic sounding old components out there.
vii. Take your time deciding all the above, albeit the problem with upgrading everything is choice paralysis sometimes!
--
This is a baseline, whatever you get you may develop an itch to change/upgrade later on maybe, or start to get into the weeds of hifi as a 'fiddling hobby' - nothing at all wrong with that by the way! - but if you factor in initially: good quality, not over the top price/level/RoI, well regarded manufacturer then you won't have to much trouble moving it on if need be.
--
If I was starting out from the terrible position of having a lot of music in vinyl format [like me!] I'd be looking at auditioning a Rega Planar 3, an amp from Rega/Cambridge Audio/NAD/Audiolab/Mission or similar and for speakers someone like PMC, Monitor Audi, Fyne or Acoustic Energy amongst others.
[For Richer Sounds, ymmv but my one experience was walking into what looked like a warehouse knock-down distribution center to be very well treated/indulged by knowledgeable and friendly staff who will have an eye for a deal - of course they will try to upgrade you etc, but you're an old fox so should be wise to those ways
]
Good luck and enjoy!
Things like cables [both between componants and from amp to speakers] can be relatively cheap and generic without compromise, don't sweat these, the only time I've done so is taking a moving coil signal where you look for low impedance and good shielding to the phono stage particyularly, but even that I wouldn't worry about too much.
i. For a turntable I'd look at either Pro-ject or Rega - Rega would be my preference but only as I've had one. If you want something a little more 'plug-n-play' with maybe some more automation [easy 45rpm/33rpm] I'd look at Technics. The Rega cartridges are generally good [I've been through a few] and I'd just stick to MM for compatibility and a lower noise floor [as if we'd hear it!]. Either offer excellent value for money and should last years.
ii. No idea whatsoever on CD players, except the internals of most are mostly the same, probably an aesthetic choice as much as anything.
iii. For amps, it depends - for a 'one stop shop' that's under a grand new, that performs well, with enough power to drive most speakers, I'd look at something like a Rega Brio Mk 7 integrated as a start point / bench mark for what features/quality you are looking for - well engineered, digital inputs for when you need, MM phono stage, remote and a headphone socket should cover most needs.
iv. For stands, again, anything flat and approved by the ministry of the interior will do - largely aesthetic. For the turntable you may want to isolate it from the same floor as your speakers and feet are vibrating on [esp. if wooden/sprung]. Best solution is always wall mounting, but various isolation platforms/feet exist. Not hugely critical but some decoupling is a 'good to have' certainly.
v. Speakers - virtually every speaker when reviewed is an improvement over the last one to be reviewed...it's another '90%' component again I think - and again room is a factor - small speakers/floorstanders depending how much oomf you want/room you have - don't let size fool you though - plenty of small yet loud speakers out there... They are all generally around 8Ohm/87dB sensitivity when you look at specs, so anything 'standard' will be easy to drive with most amps.
At this stage they are maybe the most influential part of the system, think where you will be told to put them and look at the bass porting directions if it's ported. Certainly take some time out for a no obligation listen, ideally a few examples for A<->B comparisons and to get a sense of them but again, think about the space they will end up in.
vi. New or S/H? Lots of bargains and pitfalls with preowned, usual caveats, I prefer old British stuff but it's largely a mental trick, a new Chinese D class will sound within the 90% range but just isn't satisfying mentally!
For the TT watch for shipping damage and add a new cartridge cost, for much older amps have a friendly technician for re-capping etc if need be. Otherwise there are some absolutely fantastic sounding old components out there. vii. Take your time deciding all the above, albeit the problem with upgrading everything is choice paralysis sometimes!
--
This is a baseline, whatever you get you may develop an itch to change/upgrade later on maybe, or start to get into the weeds of hifi as a 'fiddling hobby' - nothing at all wrong with that by the way! - but if you factor in initially: good quality, not over the top price/level/RoI, well regarded manufacturer then you won't have to much trouble moving it on if need be.
--
If I was starting out from the terrible position of having a lot of music in vinyl format [like me!] I'd be looking at auditioning a Rega Planar 3, an amp from Rega/Cambridge Audio/NAD/Audiolab/Mission or similar and for speakers someone like PMC, Monitor Audi, Fyne or Acoustic Energy amongst others.
[For Richer Sounds, ymmv but my one experience was walking into what looked like a warehouse knock-down distribution center to be very well treated/indulged by knowledgeable and friendly staff who will have an eye for a deal - of course they will try to upgrade you etc, but you're an old fox so should be wise to those ways
]Good luck and enjoy!
Hi Guys,
Thanks for all responses so far. My old Aiwa system has recently been brought back from storage and, although once the dust was cleaned off, the turntable and radio worked well, the CD player and cassette deck haven’t fared as well!
I think that I will nip up to the nearest Richer sound and sort out speakers and an amp, followed by CD and then turntable. After that, I will consider just how much of the other stuff I really want.
The good thing about all of this is that SWMBO is a fan of vinyl, so is very keen and supportive of my spending on these items. If only she felt the same about my TVR and other car projects!
Thanks again for the advice.
Thanks for all responses so far. My old Aiwa system has recently been brought back from storage and, although once the dust was cleaned off, the turntable and radio worked well, the CD player and cassette deck haven’t fared as well!
I think that I will nip up to the nearest Richer sound and sort out speakers and an amp, followed by CD and then turntable. After that, I will consider just how much of the other stuff I really want.
The good thing about all of this is that SWMBO is a fan of vinyl, so is very keen and supportive of my spending on these items. If only she felt the same about my TVR and other car projects!
Thanks again for the advice.
I would say that speakers are more than half of what makes a system nice or not.
Lots of very reasonable amps out there.
Most will sound fine with most speakers, unless you are talking about quite loud in a pretty big room.
Huge choice of speakers and choice relates to personal taste, type of music and the character of the room.
At the moment I'm mostly happy with some Wharfedales, but I'd always be open to hearing different speakers.
If you can get to listen to other people's expensive systems, it's time well spent IMHO.
I would also suggest thinking about sources other than CD/gramophone/broadcast wireless.
Think about some kind of 'jukebox' functionality which will store all your CDs etc, and/or streaming.
So you might want a Wiim or a BlueTooth receiver to open up your choice of material.
This may shape your choice of CD player, maybe prompting you towards an external DAC.
Or a more modern amp with inbuilt DAC.
Also you might think about multi-room, from an extra pair of speakers in the kitchen upwards.
If you think about this and still want a trad CD/Amp/speakers in one room, that's a valid choice too IMHO.
Or get some bargain used gear and blow the budget on CDs and live gigs.
Lots of very reasonable amps out there.
Most will sound fine with most speakers, unless you are talking about quite loud in a pretty big room.
Huge choice of speakers and choice relates to personal taste, type of music and the character of the room.
At the moment I'm mostly happy with some Wharfedales, but I'd always be open to hearing different speakers.
If you can get to listen to other people's expensive systems, it's time well spent IMHO.
I would also suggest thinking about sources other than CD/gramophone/broadcast wireless.
Think about some kind of 'jukebox' functionality which will store all your CDs etc, and/or streaming.
So you might want a Wiim or a BlueTooth receiver to open up your choice of material.
This may shape your choice of CD player, maybe prompting you towards an external DAC.
Or a more modern amp with inbuilt DAC.
Also you might think about multi-room, from an extra pair of speakers in the kitchen upwards.
If you think about this and still want a trad CD/Amp/speakers in one room, that's a valid choice too IMHO.
Or get some bargain used gear and blow the budget on CDs and live gigs.
Mr.Chips said:
Hi Guys,
I think that I will nip up to the nearest Richer sound and sort out speakers and an amp, followed by CD and then turntable.
Consider an amp/CD player/ tuner or DAB all in one. I've got a Yamaha CDX M170 Amp/CD/DAB which does a fine job. They don't make it anymore but there are many similar things out there, like the Denon RDCM41DAB. Marantz I think do a more sophisticated one for around £500.I think that I will nip up to the nearest Richer sound and sort out speakers and an amp, followed by CD and then turntable.
The first thing I'd do is work out what sort of sound you like to help rule out some components. Some people prefer music as the artist intended, some like a bright sound, some prefer bass heavy. I prefer a slightly more artificial musical/forward sound. Component reviews often give good hints as to how equipment sounds and performs. What Hi-Fi is a good source of information although not the only one and not Gospel either.
The easiest thing to do is set a budget and book a demo with Richer Sounds. They'll happily setup an amp or two and a range of speakers if they think you are serious about buying. You can start with the amp and speakers and add a CD player and turntable when you can. I'd argue the speakers are the most important component when it comes to delivering a sound that you find agreeable.
There are some great integrated amplifiers out there which have built in phono stages, Network Playing ability, DAB, Internet radio, FM receivers, USB inputs, Spotify connect, etc. As much as I love my expensive Naim gear, I also have a sub £400 Yamaha amp setup in my games room which does everything apart from play CD's.
The easiest thing to do is set a budget and book a demo with Richer Sounds. They'll happily setup an amp or two and a range of speakers if they think you are serious about buying. You can start with the amp and speakers and add a CD player and turntable when you can. I'd argue the speakers are the most important component when it comes to delivering a sound that you find agreeable.
There are some great integrated amplifiers out there which have built in phono stages, Network Playing ability, DAB, Internet radio, FM receivers, USB inputs, Spotify connect, etc. As much as I love my expensive Naim gear, I also have a sub £400 Yamaha amp setup in my games room which does everything apart from play CD's.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Consider an amp/CD player/ tuner or DAB all in one. I've got a Yamaha CDX M170 Amp/CD/DAB which does a fine job. They don't make it anymore but there are many similar things out there, like the Denon RDCM41DAB. Marantz I think do a more sophisticated one for around £500.
We've got the Marantz one (the Melody X) and it's a cracking bit of kit. We've paired it with an old set of Rogers db101s I had which were notoriously fussy to find an amp they worked with, but this sounds great - nice and open with decent punch. It's got CD, DAB, FM, Internet Radio and various Connect apps along with A/B speaker terminals and will play most things you throw at it.
Only limitations in this case are it only has a single Analogue In and no phono stage, so it may preclude connecting both vinyl and tape. It does have two Optical Ins however so an MD Player will work, not sure there were any tape decks that had digital outputs tho. I do have a Pioneer deck that has a Coax input, no digital out tho.
Other than that however I'd highly recommend it.
I have a nice oak stand from -
https://www.hifiracks.co.uk
Made to the size and height I wanted and when I added a component that was a different size I could order the 4 longer upright sections rather having to get a new stand.
https://www.hifiracks.co.uk
Made to the size and height I wanted and when I added a component that was a different size I could order the 4 longer upright sections rather having to get a new stand.
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