Grand Prix - 1966 Film. One word. Awesome.
Discussion
Woke up at 430am - couldn't sleep - nothing for it but Millicano and a spot of half asleep ebay surfing (this is dangerous as a friends spontaneous purchase of a Porsche from USA once proved).
Bored very quickly then caught the DVD Collectors 2 disc edition of Grand Prix out the corner of my eye and sat down for a 3 hour pre dawn session! Wow - I've forgotten just how incredible that film really is, and it's incredible in so many ways not least that they actually had the lead actors driving real formula cars on the real tracks at real speeds. Then you consider that they had probably the ultimate camera car - a GT40 piloted by Phil Hill. Then you see James Garner genuinely nearly get seriously burned in the fire incident at Silverstone "I had two butane cannistors in the car feeding gas out the back to simulate fire" - jesus if those things weren't combustable enough!! It's all real - no cgi, minimal special FX, real cars were totalled.
It's a true spectacle. Dated? Not if you yearn for those bygone days (although the score is hideous even if it is Maurice Jarre). Things are so different now, and yet, in many ways nothing's changed - some telling parallels. Is there a better motorsport film ever made? Not IMHO. Could they do it now? Not a hope in hell and that's the saddest part! All the racers in the film - Bruce Mclaren, Graham Hill, Dan Gurney, Jochen Rindt and of course Jim Clark - and the team access granted - there's even scenes in Ferrari's factory where you can see work on P3/4's in background - unbelievable stuff.
The 2006 collectors edition has some excellent extras and if you haven't got it, well, you should have it! Cinerama and those '66 3 litre cars = awesome. Crystal clear print as well.
I have one question though - there are shed loads of people that go uncredited in the film and I am 99% sure the main race commentator is none other than Murray Walker (although unnaturally calm!) - can anyone confirm or deny this cos I can't find any mention on t'internet anywhere?
Bored very quickly then caught the DVD Collectors 2 disc edition of Grand Prix out the corner of my eye and sat down for a 3 hour pre dawn session! Wow - I've forgotten just how incredible that film really is, and it's incredible in so many ways not least that they actually had the lead actors driving real formula cars on the real tracks at real speeds. Then you consider that they had probably the ultimate camera car - a GT40 piloted by Phil Hill. Then you see James Garner genuinely nearly get seriously burned in the fire incident at Silverstone "I had two butane cannistors in the car feeding gas out the back to simulate fire" - jesus if those things weren't combustable enough!! It's all real - no cgi, minimal special FX, real cars were totalled.
It's a true spectacle. Dated? Not if you yearn for those bygone days (although the score is hideous even if it is Maurice Jarre). Things are so different now, and yet, in many ways nothing's changed - some telling parallels. Is there a better motorsport film ever made? Not IMHO. Could they do it now? Not a hope in hell and that's the saddest part! All the racers in the film - Bruce Mclaren, Graham Hill, Dan Gurney, Jochen Rindt and of course Jim Clark - and the team access granted - there's even scenes in Ferrari's factory where you can see work on P3/4's in background - unbelievable stuff.
The 2006 collectors edition has some excellent extras and if you haven't got it, well, you should have it! Cinerama and those '66 3 litre cars = awesome. Crystal clear print as well.
I have one question though - there are shed loads of people that go uncredited in the film and I am 99% sure the main race commentator is none other than Murray Walker (although unnaturally calm!) - can anyone confirm or deny this cos I can't find any mention on t'internet anywhere?
Murray doesn't feature anywhere in the film, as far as I know. In 1966, he wasn't really regarded as a "main" Grand Prix commentator. His forté was actually commentating on motorcycle racing and scrambling. For the really important car races, the Beeb used Raymond Baxter - who therefoere does feature in the film as he plays himself trying to conduct an ad hoc interview with the winner of the British GP.
The actors drove Formula 3 cars, purchased from Jim Russell's school. These cars were given fake intake trumpets and exhausts to make them look a bit more like the F1 cars they were portraying. A lot of the "racing" sequences therefore feature these fake cars but in some of the sequences real footage from the actual race or qualifying was inserted.
Although at first there was very good c-operation with the MGM team, as the season progressed and these "swaggering Yanks" started demanding more and more compromises to suit their filming requirements, the race organisers began to be far less amenable to the film makers.
The actors drove Formula 3 cars, purchased from Jim Russell's school. These cars were given fake intake trumpets and exhausts to make them look a bit more like the F1 cars they were portraying. A lot of the "racing" sequences therefore feature these fake cars but in some of the sequences real footage from the actual race or qualifying was inserted.
Although at first there was very good c-operation with the MGM team, as the season progressed and these "swaggering Yanks" started demanding more and more compromises to suit their filming requirements, the race organisers began to be far less amenable to the film makers.
I didn't know they were formula 3's til I watched the making of extra feature - I love the bit where James Garner gets so fed up waiting on the boat for his rescue from water crash because local shop owners are trying to force more money out ofthe production crew and he offers out the shop keeper rep (besides promisng to dump him in the ****ing water, hilarious!). James Garner was the only one who went to Carrol Shelby's racing academy and all the rest to Jim Russell - the upshot seems to be that Mr Garner could've had a career in racing whilst Brian Bedford was completely hopeless and was doubled in all driving scenes.
OK so it can't be the Murray Meister then - sounds so, so similar though....really frustrating not knowing who it i!!
OK so it can't be the Murray Meister then - sounds so, so similar though....really frustrating not knowing who it i!!
weyland yutani said:
Is this the film with some spectacular onboard footage at insane speeds around the Monza banking? Never seen the whole movie but what I've seen is breathtaking stuff!
Not insane enough. Since they were only F3 cars, they weren't really that fast. No F1 cars had run on the banking since 1961.weyland yutani said:
Is this the film with some spectacular onboard footage at insane speeds around the Monza banking? Never seen the whole movie but what I've seen is breathtaking stuff!
Whatever speed they were doing it feels fast and that's all I ask 
- the forward facing camera with drivers unseen shots do seem to be carrying real speed.Refresh your memory here
http://www.vimeo.com/29933414 - clip of the Monza scenes.The GT40 camera car with "aerodynamic" Panavision cameras!! (last pic - safety first!)
It's a very honest film, and crucially seems to have been made by genuine fans of racing. I have no idea why there aren't more films about early Grand Prix racing, particularly in the 60s when it was astonishingly dangerous and exciting. Just don't let Stallone near it.
I know there was talk of a film on the life of Bruce McLaren which may fill that gaping void but I don't know much about it. Off to Google
I know there was talk of a film on the life of Bruce McLaren which may fill that gaping void but I don't know much about it. Off to Google
durbster said:
It's a very honest film, and crucially seems to have been made by genuine fans of racing. I have no idea why there aren't more films about early Grand Prix racing, particularly in the 60s when it was astonishingly dangerous and exciting. Just don't let Stallone near it.
I know there was talk of a film on the life of Bruce McLaren which may fill that gaping void but I don't know much about it. Off to Google
Early Grand Prix racing in the 1960s?I know there was talk of a film on the life of Bruce McLaren which may fill that gaping void but I don't know much about it. Off to Google
The 1960s is more or less mid point in the current timespan of Grand Prix racing -which began in 1906.
Despite its rather obvious plot clichés, "Grand Prix" remains the only half decent film that captured the essence of motor racing in the era in which it was shot. I would put "Le Mans" in second place and possibly "Winning" in third.
All theree films weere made by people who at least had a genuine sense of what it was like to be involved in the motor racing world and by and large, let the on track duels be the centre point of the film, rather than the peripheral plots (although Grand Prix and Winning do throw some of that into the mix).
Eric Mc said:
Early Grand Prix racing in the 1960s?
The 1960s is more or less mid point in the current timespan of Grand Prix racing -which began in 1906.
Yes I know that's technically true but thanks for pointing it out despite its irrelevance. The 1960s is more or less mid point in the current timespan of Grand Prix racing -which began in 1906.
The 1960s is where Grand Prix as we know it today began to enter the public consciousness, and it was also when it began its transition from weekend playground for rich nutters to a professional sport. 1960s F1 must be one of the most fascinating eras of any sport at any time, and therefore surely a perfect backdrop for a decent story.
I think the main problem with modern motorsport films is that the film-makers try and make the on-track battles mean so much more than it actually does, so they introduce pantomime villains and improbable situations to lather on the drama.
That won't work. For a good F1 film to work, the racing would have to be the backdrop but not the focus.
I agree with virtually everything you say - although I would argue that the Mercedes, Auto Union, Alfa Romeo and Ferrari efforts at grand prix racing, both pre and post war, were far from "gentleman racing" efforts and were extremely professional for their time.
Indeed, I would say that one of the significances and glories of The movie "Grand Prix" is that it was shot in what was almost the very LAST F1 season where overt commercialisation of the sport hadn't yet taken a grip. The cars and drivers were still in their national colours, for instance.
For me, the real modern era began two yaers later, with the arrival of sponsor liveried cars and the dawning of downforce. Both utterly changed F1 forever.
Indeed, I would say that one of the significances and glories of The movie "Grand Prix" is that it was shot in what was almost the very LAST F1 season where overt commercialisation of the sport hadn't yet taken a grip. The cars and drivers were still in their national colours, for instance.
For me, the real modern era began two yaers later, with the arrival of sponsor liveried cars and the dawning of downforce. Both utterly changed F1 forever.
Actaully yes, good point. The battling manufacturers of the 50s would be also be fascinating to watch.
Otherwise, Grand Prix Legends chose 1967 for very good reasons.
(OK it was probably also because of all the source material available in Grand Prix)
There is another issue here and that's Bernie's absolutely astronomical charges for accessing F1 archives of the 70s, 80s and 90s. I think it's criminal that this footage is just kept in a vault somewhere.
Otherwise, Grand Prix Legends chose 1967 for very good reasons.
(OK it was probably also because of all the source material available in Grand Prix)
There is another issue here and that's Bernie's absolutely astronomical charges for accessing F1 archives of the 70s, 80s and 90s. I think it's criminal that this footage is just kept in a vault somewhere.
Edited by durbster on Monday 3rd October 17:01
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