Protecting our children
Discussion
bristolracer said:
Parents cant afford to buy the boy a bed,yet have Sky tv, a dog to feed, and a laptop about the house.
I thought that too. f
king fat lazy heaps of st, can't even be bothered to tidy their house up and get their young lad to brush his teeth, they fking disgust me.Poor kid
I thought it was an extremely sad programme - and illustrated exactly the massive difficulties faced by the social services in dealing with cases like this.
People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
Eric Mc said:
I thought it was an extremely sad programme - and illustrated exactly the massive difficulties faced by the social services in dealing with cases like this.
People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
Agreed with all of this. I expected to get extremely angry during the course of this show and, at times, I did. The father was useless and clearly had huge issues engaging with people, including his own son. However, I did get the impression that the mother truely loved the son and the baby. I think she just did not know/appreciate how to raise a child properly. Only later on did it seem clear to her that she could not raise either child properly and so she made the right decision to give them up for adoption.People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
It was a truely heartbreaking program really. It certainly made me consider more about how some people in our own country have to live.
The only reason she gave them up was because the fat lazy bh could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.
h could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.By far the most depressing thing I have watched for a long time.
I agree that both parents were absolutely useless, but as has already been said and as Tiffany admitted in the program, these problems with parenting stem from their own experiences as children.
My Mum deals with cases like these as head of antinatal services in a maternity hospital and some of the stories she has are horrifying. As a normal and well balanced human being it is hard to relate to what she tells you other than to laugh at some of them.
One such story is of a woman who had something like 7 children from 7 fathers and was pregnant again, with the current boyfriend having a history of abusive behaviour. Case conference arrives and one of the social workers expressed concern that her six year old boy had told them in response to the question "what would you like to be when you're older?", that he would like to be a murderer. The mother looked puzzled and thought for a bit and exclaimed "OOOOHHHH he doesn't want to be a murderer, he wants to be an assasin".
This program confirmed to me that I would not want to be a social worker in any form and actually I thought that it was amazing that the female social worker felt ok to walk in to the house with Mike there. He looked like he would just snap and smash her face in at any time.
I agree that both parents were absolutely useless, but as has already been said and as Tiffany admitted in the program, these problems with parenting stem from their own experiences as children.
My Mum deals with cases like these as head of antinatal services in a maternity hospital and some of the stories she has are horrifying. As a normal and well balanced human being it is hard to relate to what she tells you other than to laugh at some of them.
One such story is of a woman who had something like 7 children from 7 fathers and was pregnant again, with the current boyfriend having a history of abusive behaviour. Case conference arrives and one of the social workers expressed concern that her six year old boy had told them in response to the question "what would you like to be when you're older?", that he would like to be a murderer. The mother looked puzzled and thought for a bit and exclaimed "OOOOHHHH he doesn't want to be a murderer, he wants to be an assasin".
This program confirmed to me that I would not want to be a social worker in any form and actually I thought that it was amazing that the female social worker felt ok to walk in to the house with Mike there. He looked like he would just snap and smash her face in at any time.
markbigears said:
The only reason she gave them up was because the fat lazy bh could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.
Great.h could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.Where and how?
And you still have to deal with the children.
In the end, despite the depressing nature of the programme, you felt that the children had some hope at least. It was amazing to see the change in the little boy after only a few weeks away from Mike the dad. Mike was the REAL problem and actually in serious need of psychiatric attention.
Eric Mc said:
markbigears said:
The only reason she gave them up was because the fat lazy bh could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.
Great.h could could then sit on her arse all day munching burgers and biscuits that you and I pay for. This program made me sad and angry and thank the lord the kids got taken away from this good for nothing monsters. Letting a kid play in dog st with no clothes, no bed and no attention, I want the fkers locked up.Where and how?
And you still have to deal with the children.
In the end, despite the depressing nature of the programme, you felt that the children had some hope at least. It was amazing to see the change in the little boy after only a few weeks away from Mike the dad. Mike was the REAL problem and actually in serious need of psychiatric attention.
The baby may have a chance.
Eric Mc said:
I thought it was an extremely sad programme - and illustrated exactly the massive difficulties faced by the social services in dealing with cases like this.
People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
This was clearly a bad case and fairly cut and dry that it was in the best interests of the child to be removed from the home and from the parents.People like Mike and Tiffany come from extremely dysfunctional backgrounds and cary these problems with them into adult life. You could see that Mike had extreme difficulty engaging with ANYONE. He immediately became defensive and was reluctant to make eye contact. He was a real psychological challenge. This behaviour was even more marked when he was observed playing with his son.
In the end, I think I ended up admitring Tiffany for her courage. She was obviously more intelligent than her partner Mike and in a very short space of time she took the only intelligent options she could - leave Mike and pass the children over for adoption.
It takes a special type of person to even WANT to be a social worker, in my opinion.
However the program was biased in that it selected clearly dreadful parent’s who were beyond rational help - for every case like this there are plenty that would highlight the utterly disgusting methods social services and the family court go to remove children from their parent’s where the circumstances are not cut and dry and most likely are innocent.
Since Shoesmith and Baby P cases into which SS get their talons are far from balanced. In their eyes it is far better to remove a child and convince the world they were right to do it through the closed FC (where Judge, social worker and lawyer all belong to the same squash club...) than risk a potential ‘incident’ being pinned on them.
A case my friend is going through at the moment has highlighted the inherent victimisation process of the parents by SS. If it’s your word against a paediatrician who might have reported “marks” on a child who do you think SS will side with? They do not solely work in the interests of the child, rather in their own interests to protect their arses. In this case, any evidence given in favour of the parent’s was dismissed! Not even written down. In the end, claims the child was making about the father were unveiled in court as lies – even then SS attitude was “he got off”.
One heinous case I read about was a woman who discovered her husband was abusing their daughter. She reported him to the authorities immediately and divorced the husband (as was required by SS). Despite this, SS and the FC deemed she had “not done enough” to protect the child and she was taken away. Once deemed unfit, that is it. Years later she had another child with a different man and on birth the child was taken away!
Perhaps this is not the right forum for a rant but “protecting our children” does not automatically require them to be taken away by the state. In my view, many elements of SS and the FC are working with excess power and without a balanced consideration.
Tin-foil hat firmly on and proud of it.
I also thought that the tone of the Social workers was hideously patronising.
In my opinion, the way they dealt with the parents wasn't great either. Mixed messages came from the way they introduced themselves: "Alright mate, yeh, how you doing Mike, Hello, nice to see you"
Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
In my opinion, the way they dealt with the parents wasn't great either. Mixed messages came from the way they introduced themselves: "Alright mate, yeh, how you doing Mike, Hello, nice to see you"
Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
bulldong said:
In my opinion, the way they dealt with the parents wasn't great either. Mixed messages came from the way they introduced themselves: "Alright mate, yeh, how you doing Mike, Hello, nice to see you"
Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
Agreed on the variation in tone. Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
Very noticeable after Mike suddently withdrew his consent for Toby to be taken in to care for just the one night at first. That said, I guess it's an inevitable and obvious step if the touchy-feely "We're help to help" tone is clearly falling on deaf ears.
Like any conflict, it gets to the point where offers of cooperation and discussion are rapidly replaced by decisive action.
I couldn't see it ending any other way really. How could the parents possibly raise a child with unique needs when they themselves had similarly unique needs that weren't being addressed?
You only needed to watch the bit with Mike and Toby "playing" together. The glazed look on Mike's face as he was seemingly out-foxed by childrens' toys while Toby got giggly and had fun said it all.
Agreed and this is how many of them operate - what is scary is the power these people wield.
In the case of my friend, once the child had made the claims in question SS took them as gospel.
Not interested in the dad's explanation.
Not interested in discovering that the kid has severe social difficulties and is a lying, manipulative little SOB.
In their eyes, the dad was a child abuser. Case closed.
From then on, it was an exercise in manipulation of family members, making them question their own thoughts and actions, jumping on any mistakes made (which there will be when the spotlight is on you as a parent), the poor little mite etc etc.
Once you are in their sights, it's just about how they can pull the trigger.
In the case of my friend, once the child had made the claims in question SS took them as gospel.
Not interested in the dad's explanation.
Not interested in discovering that the kid has severe social difficulties and is a lying, manipulative little SOB.
In their eyes, the dad was a child abuser. Case closed.
From then on, it was an exercise in manipulation of family members, making them question their own thoughts and actions, jumping on any mistakes made (which there will be when the spotlight is on you as a parent), the poor little mite etc etc.
Once you are in their sights, it's just about how they can pull the trigger.
Crossflow Kid said:
bulldong said:
In my opinion, the way they dealt with the parents wasn't great either. Mixed messages came from the way they introduced themselves: "Alright mate, yeh, how you doing Mike, Hello, nice to see you"
Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
Agreed on the variation in tone. Then they drop the bomb:
"Mike and Tiffany, we are going to take your kid off you"
Very noticeable after Mike suddently withdrew his consent for Toby to be taken in to care for just the one night at first. That said, I guess it's an inevitable and obvious step if the touchy-feely "We're help to help" tone is clearly falling on deaf ears.
Like any conflict, it gets to the point where offers of cooperation and discussion are rapidly
replaced by decisive action.
I couldn't see it ending any other way really. How could the parents possibly raise a child with unique needs when they themselves had similarly unique needs that weren't being addressed?
You only needed to watch the bit with Mike and Toby "playing" together. The glazed look on Mike's face as he was seemingly out-foxed by childrens' toys while Toby got giggly and had fun said it all.
They are not there to be friends with the people and this is where I think that Mike bloke got so defensive. I mean, I know his kid was being taken off him, but if someone goes in to your home and is all matey with you and then they turn round and try to f
k you upside down, you're going to like it less than if they have been playing hard all along.I felt some of the social workers came across much better than others. One of them would be the sort of person who could be difficult to deal with. She saw things far too much in simplistic terms and I very much doubt that she had children of her own or had had much experience with children.
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