Shakespeare - where to start
Discussion
(mods - please don't move this to P&P - as there's no book section it's possibly best in here ?)
OK, more of a book/literature topic obviously but what's the deal with old Shakey ?
I know very little about the guy but I'm aware of him as a supposedly 'fantastic' writer.
Where would I start with his work - which book would be a good starting point and would I need a translation guide
to help me understand it all?
Or indeed, is it worth exploring at all.
Curious.
OK, more of a book/literature topic obviously but what's the deal with old Shakey ?
I know very little about the guy but I'm aware of him as a supposedly 'fantastic' writer.
Where would I start with his work - which book would be a good starting point and would I need a translation guide
to help me understand it all?Or indeed, is it worth exploring at all.
Curious.
Overrated IMO. His stuff is promoted as a must read and him as a complete genius. I can't really see the magic myself, but commend you for going in there with an open mind.
I think he's used too much by competitive parents in order to boast about how early their children are reading it, when in practice there's much better material out there.
I can however see how it would be interesting from a historical point of view, although the thing about him "inventing" a large number of words is nonsense.
Anyway, this isn't helping you. A comedy of errors is quite easy going as a first go, and while they're a bit schooly, the York notes are really good for extracting more than you may first see from the story. Good luck.
I think he's used too much by competitive parents in order to boast about how early their children are reading it, when in practice there's much better material out there.
I can however see how it would be interesting from a historical point of view, although the thing about him "inventing" a large number of words is nonsense.
Anyway, this isn't helping you. A comedy of errors is quite easy going as a first go, and while they're a bit schooly, the York notes are really good for extracting more than you may first see from the story. Good luck.
Edited by 8Ace on Wednesday 21st July 09:43
Apart from the odd sonnet. So maybe the theatre might be the more appropriate place to start.I was obliged to watch Olivier's 'Henry V' at school and the memorable scene was the darkening of the sky as the English arrows flew at the French lines - the rest of the film, like the arrows, whizzed over my head frankly. However, watch the Kenneth Branagh version and after a while you might find that the Elizabethan language pales, the actors shine through and you get the plot so much more easily than with the more stilted Olivier film. As for reading the Bard - never tried it...
I'm a massive fanboy (full member) of the RSC @ Stratford and watch most of the new productions each season. I've been to a lot of theatre in my time but the plays put on by the RSC always seem to be at the next level with the quality of the acting and production. I'd recommend going as its as good as Shakespeare gets, reading it from a book really removes the power of the play. Oh, and the RSC has fantastic kids days as well with workshops, talks, open days and special kid friendly versions of the main plays. It can be expensive if you want to sit in the best seats on the weekend, go during the week and sit in the cheaper seats (not a problem with the "spur" style of stage) and its possible get a ticket for £5 if under 24 and £10 if not.
May I recommend this version of Richard III.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0114279/
Updated into the interwar years and the rise of facism in England but with all the original word.....
It just works.
It's a good watch.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0114279/
Updated into the interwar years and the rise of facism in England but with all the original word.....
It just works.
It's a good watch.
Avoid Stratford like the plague aswell unless you have Flemke levels of dosh.
The Globe is an excellent place to go and watch in a superb setting and doesnt cost the earth.
Where to start with the plays? Hmm, depends what you like...thrillers, comedy, romance, etc.
Id recommend starting with something you possible know a little bit of context about, ie. Henry V or a comedy you vaguely know the plot of. I personally think Romeo and Cleo is over-rated claptrap, but I think Anthony and Cleopatra is extraordinary.
The Globe is an excellent place to go and watch in a superb setting and doesnt cost the earth.
Where to start with the plays? Hmm, depends what you like...thrillers, comedy, romance, etc.
Id recommend starting with something you possible know a little bit of context about, ie. Henry V or a comedy you vaguely know the plot of. I personally think Romeo and Cleo is over-rated claptrap, but I think Anthony and Cleopatra is extraordinary.
DON'T see or read The Winters Tale, whatever you do.
Othello is brilliant, Romeo and Juliet is pretty good although I've studied it so many times some of the joy of it has worn off, Pericles is also very good but that's a "Pseudo-Shakespeare" play as people aren't sure if it's one of his or not.
Lawrence Fishburne did an Othello movie many years ago which I watched as part of my A-Level studies and it was decent enough so you could give that a try.
Othello is brilliant, Romeo and Juliet is pretty good although I've studied it so many times some of the joy of it has worn off, Pericles is also very good but that's a "Pseudo-Shakespeare" play as people aren't sure if it's one of his or not.
Lawrence Fishburne did an Othello movie many years ago which I watched as part of my A-Level studies and it was decent enough so you could give that a try.
Re: Othello, if nothing else it intrduced the word 'tupping' to my vocab. 
Hmmm... I used to quite like The Tempest, but it seems rather dull now - probably a result of over-exposure similar to that already mentioned.
The language is not too difficult to get to grips with, at least compared to something like Chaucer!
Hmmm... I used to quite like The Tempest, but it seems rather dull now - probably a result of over-exposure similar to that already mentioned.
The language is not too difficult to get to grips with, at least compared to something like Chaucer!
DJC said:
Avoid Stratford like the plague aswell unless you have Flemke levels of dosh.
Total horse poo, the RSC is committed to having a decent bank go cheap tickets available, as I said earlier ALL their plays have £5 and £10 tickets available depending on your age (above or under 24). Plenty of cheap places to eat as well, Mac'ds is just a couple of minutes walk away if you are that hard up. Free parking on the night as well if you turn up about an hour before the performance, right out side the Courtyard.I'd suggest avoiding the Histories like Richard III as a starting point, a bit long and a bit dry. Try King Lear and you can't go wrong with Romeo and Juliet if taking the Misses for the first time.
If you've never seen any Shakespeare can I suggest starting with Baz Luhrman's Romeo & Juliet? Ten minutes in and you won't notice the language. Most of the Brannagh films are worth watching too.
Twelfth Night's good at the theatre, as are the more well known plays. If you decide to go to the Globe though make sure you pay for a seat- I saw Romeo & Juliet there last year and after three hours of standing could barely walk back to the tube...
Twelfth Night's good at the theatre, as are the more well known plays. If you decide to go to the Globe though make sure you pay for a seat- I saw Romeo & Juliet there last year and after three hours of standing could barely walk back to the tube...
Edited by Alfa numeric on Wednesday 21st July 16:46
I'm another fan of Branagh's Henry V and the Ian McKellen Richard III. Branagh also did quite a good Hamlet in 1996 ( http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0116477/ ) which I thought was way better than the Mel Gibson treatment.
I agree that Shakespeare is better seen than just read. Even if you go to a local production to see it.
I agree that Shakespeare is better seen than just read. Even if you go to a local production to see it.
tankplanker said:
DJC said:
Avoid Stratford like the plague aswell unless you have Flemke levels of dosh.
Total horse poo, the RSC is committed to having a decent bank go cheap tickets available, as I said earlier ALL their plays have £5 and £10 tickets available depending on your age (above or under 24). Plenty of cheap places to eat as well, Mac'ds is just a couple of minutes walk away if you are that hard up. Free parking on the night as well if you turn up about an hour before the performance, right out side the Courtyard.I'd suggest avoiding the Histories like Richard III as a starting point, a bit long and a bit dry. Try King Lear and you can't go wrong with Romeo and Juliet if taking the Misses for the first time.
Stratford is the single most expensive, capitalistic place in the country. Im from Blackpool and I thought we pretty much had that title nailed till I went to Stratford and realised we were but amateurs. The whole town is set up for the single aim of fleecing tourists and visitors of as much dosh as possible.
Shakespeare is a bit like music. To understand it, you have to get your "ear" in so that the language begins to flow into your brain and still make sense. For modern ears, the problem is that the dialogue is dense and fast and leaves little time for our brains to unscramble what we have just heared before the action moves on.
We live in a very visual age where language plays a far lesser part in our lives than it did hundreds of years ago. I think Elizethans had well tuned ears and a sharp sense of understanding which allowed them to follow the dialogue much better than we can today.
Having said that, the best way to appreciate Shakespeare is to go along to a performance of one of his plays. I would suggest one of the comedies as a starter. A popular favourite is "A Midsummer's Night Dream" but I think the best for beginners is "The Merry Wives of Windsor" - which is nothing more than a bedroom farce and has more in common with the 1960s farces than a more "normal" Shakesperian play.
We live in a very visual age where language plays a far lesser part in our lives than it did hundreds of years ago. I think Elizethans had well tuned ears and a sharp sense of understanding which allowed them to follow the dialogue much better than we can today.
Having said that, the best way to appreciate Shakespeare is to go along to a performance of one of his plays. I would suggest one of the comedies as a starter. A popular favourite is "A Midsummer's Night Dream" but I think the best for beginners is "The Merry Wives of Windsor" - which is nothing more than a bedroom farce and has more in common with the 1960s farces than a more "normal" Shakesperian play.
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