So more Police= the violence stops.

[sjc]

Weather aside, is it purely coincidence that when all Police leave was cancelled,the violence virtually stopped. And if it's not coincidence,doesn't it back up what Joe Public nad Mrs.Commonsense has been crying out for, for years?
Or is that a way too simplistic ideal?

[Puggit]

To play devil's advocate, there was already a large police 'service' - they were just spending their entire careers inside filling out paperwork so that the Labour Party could measure their effectiveness.

If the paperwork was removed, it would free up a lot of police to make a visible presence on the streets (which is incidentally where the BiB would prefer to be).

Another problem caused by the lefty hand-wringers.

[Dr Doofenshmirtz]

Puggit said:

To play devil's advocate, there was already a large police 'service' - they were just spending their entire careers inside filling out paperwork so that the Labour Party could measure their effectiveness.

If the paperwork was removed, it would free up a lot of police to make a visible presence on the streets (which is incidentally where the BiB would prefer to be).

Another problem caused by the lefty hand-wringers.

+1 ...but it was mostly the weather and these sort of things always die down after a few days anyway.
Next week there will be different news.

[sjc]

Puggit said:

To play devil's advocate, there was already a large police 'service' - they were just spending their entire careers inside filling out paperwork so that the Labour Party could measure their effectiveness.

If the paperwork was removed, it would free up a lot of police to make a visible presence on the streets (which is incidentally where the BiB would prefer to be).

Another problem caused by the lefty hand-wringers.

This was my thoughts also.Whilst it doesn't do anything about the underlying society issues,more Police on the beat can only be a positive thing surely, for communities and the BiB alike?

[VxDuncan]

Dr Doofenshmirtz said:

+1 ...but it was mostly the weather and these sort of things always die down after a few days anyway.
Next week there will be different news.

+1. It rained.

[Mr_annie_vxr]

More officers but more importantly finally the willingness to take a more robust stance with the groups thanks to an acceptance that the weak tactics public order had ended up with didn't suit this or work.

Kettling. Baton charges. Dog charges. Taking the fight to the rioters. All tactics previously condemned and dropped. Coupled with ample numbers to no longer be playing catch up.

Then add a general public attitude shift toward zero tolerance of the behaviour.

That's what brought it under control.

The question is when it bubbles up again will the police have the support to deal with it how they see fit. Or will the handcuffs be on again.

[Puggit]

VxDuncan said:

Dr Doofenshmirtz said:

+1 ...but it was mostly the weather and these sort of things always die down after a few days anyway.
Next week there will be different news.

+1. It rained.

The weather in the South has only just changed this morning. Something else happened to keep the feral scum off the streets.

[roachcoach]

Mr_annie_vxr said:

More officers but more importantly finally the willingness to take a more robust stance with the groups thanks to an acceptance that the weak tactics public order had ended up with didn't suit this or work.

Kettling. Baton charges. Dog charges. Taking the fight to the rioters. All tactics previously condemned and dropped. Coupled with ample numbers to no longer be playing catch up.

Then add a general public attitude shift toward zero tolerance of the behaviour.

That's what brought it under control.

The question is when it bubbles up again will the police have the support to deal with it how they see fit. Or will the handcuffs be on again.

Basically this I reckon.

I fired off a praise email to GMP for their actions.

[mattviatura]

Puggit said:

police 'service'

There's a big part of the problem, right there.

Years of tosspots like 'Sir' Ian Blair have emasculated the police, the now necessary beatings handed out to the scum would not be necessary if the 'brand' hadn't been diluted so much.

It has led to a complete lack of respect for the police "service" which when added to liberal prosecutors has created the perfect storm we now have.

As usual, what needed to be changed many years ago has been changed far too much.

[Miguel Alvarez]

I think it is more down to all the areas have already been hit. Its easy to attack an area you've grown up in and know like the back of your hand. Those kids will know the side roads and estates blind folded. Put those same kids in an alien place and it would require planning more than "oi blud link up on the high street innit".

[mattviatura]

Miguel Alvarez said:

I think it is more down to all the areas have already been hit. Its easy to attack an area you've grown up in and know like the back of your hand. Those kids will know the side roads and estates blind folded. Put those same kids in an alien place and it would require planning more than "oi blud link up on the high street innit".

Watching the filthy peasant scum in Manchester the other night would back this up, coupled with their mobility. There isn't much that a load of coppers in riot gear can do to chase a bunch of scum when they have BMXs and know all the cut-throughs. Tough one to respond to I'll bet, although they wouldn't have been able to outrun baton rounds.

[roachcoach]

mattviatura said:

Miguel Alvarez said:

I think it is more down to all the areas have already been hit. Its easy to attack an area you've grown up in and know like the back of your hand. Those kids will know the side roads and estates blind folded. Put those same kids in an alien place and it would require planning more than "oi blud link up on the high street innit".

Watching the filthy peasant scum in Manchester the other night would back this up, coupled with their mobility. There isn't much that a load of coppers in riot gear can do to chase a bunch of scum when they have BMXs and know all the cut-throughs. Tough one to respond to I'll bet, although they wouldn't have been able to outrun baton rounds.

A stunning pincer movement, resulting in a good kicking to said scum.

Like they did

[Puggit]

mattviatura said:

Miguel Alvarez said:

I think it is more down to all the areas have already been hit. Its easy to attack an area you've grown up in and know like the back of your hand. Those kids will know the side roads and estates blind folded. Put those same kids in an alien place and it would require planning more than "oi blud link up on the high street innit".

Watching the filthy peasant scum in Manchester the other night would back this up, coupled with their mobility. There isn't much that a load of coppers in riot gear can do to chase a bunch of scum when they have BMXs and know all the cut-throughs. Tough one to respond to I'll bet, although they wouldn't have been able to outrun baton rounds.

The range for use of baton rounds is woefully short - they are more of a defensive measure for the lines of the police as they have the capacity to fell someone.

[mattviatura]

Puggit said:

The range for use of baton rounds is woefully short - they are more of a defensive measure for the lines of the police as they have the capacity to fell someone.

I wouldn't have a problem with proper bullets to be honest.

[Caulkhead]

sjc said:

Weather aside, is it purely coincidence that when all Police leave was cancelled,the violence virtually stopped. And if it's not coincidence,doesn't it back up what Joe Public nad Mrs.Commonsense has been crying out for, for years?
Or is that a way too simplistic ideal?

Or maybe it's just that the shops haven't restocked yet?

[Corsair7]

Mr_annie_vxr said:

More officers but more importantly finally the willingness to take a more robust stance with the groups thanks to an acceptance that the weak tactics public order had ended up with didn't suit this or work.

Kettling. Baton charges. Dog charges. Taking the fight to the rioters. All tactics previously condemned and dropped. Coupled with ample numbers to no longer be playing catch up.

Then add a general public attitude shift toward zero tolerance of the behaviour.

That's what brought it under control.

The question is when it bubbles up again will the police have the support to deal with it how they see fit. Or will the handcuffs be on again.

Has Kettling been dropped?

Kettling seemed to be used to stop noisy but basically legal protests developing into something more than they were in recent years. Didnt knw it had been dropped as a tactic.

[Mr_annie_vxr]

Grossly limited. Lots changed in the past 6 months. Large part of public order training was HRA training rather than tactics.

That's why you saw officers in hackney suddenly remove helmets and get rid if shields.

[turbobloke]

Caulkhead said:

sjc said:

Weather aside, is it purely coincidence that when all Police leave was cancelled,the violence virtually stopped. And if it's not coincidence,doesn't it back up what Joe Public nad Mrs.Commonsense has been crying out for, for years?
Or is that a way too simplistic ideal?

Or maybe it's just that the shops haven't restocked yet?

Cynical. Good point.

[vixen1700]

Wonder how the police are going to play it in a couple of weeks when it's the Notting Hill carnival.

Could turn nasty.

[M@verick]

turbobloke said:

Cynical. Good point.

Equally they might just all be at home watching their new 50 inch plasma tv's and kicking back in their new addidas whilst selling Ipads on Ebay ?

R.