Greer - "Trans-exclusionary views"?
Discussion
It's not uncommon nowadays for university speakers to be uninvited. Not that long ago, an ex-muslim woman (I believe) was "uninvited" because she was an apostate, and may have upset some muslim attendees.
It's not all bad though, Bahar Mustafa has at least been called out on it. It's standard ineffectual student politics which just happen to make the news, I think.
It's not all bad though, Bahar Mustafa has at least been called out on it. It's standard ineffectual student politics which just happen to make the news, I think.
The campuses of the west are being swept by a wave of anti free speech nonsense.
This analysis is pretty good:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opinion/sunday/j...
This analysis is pretty good:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opinion/sunday/j...
Real feminist PWNS fake feminists:
Greer said she had seen the university’s statement, which she said was “as weak as piss”.
“If the University of Cardiff cannot guarantee that I will not have things thrown at me then I won’t go there. I can’t be bothered.”
Of her critics, she added: “They think that they are entitled to throw things at me and then they say that I am inciting violence against transexuals. I have never incited anyone to violence against anyone. I am just fed up with it all. It’s all just froth.”
Germaine Greer, you go girl!
Greer said she had seen the university’s statement, which she said was “as weak as piss”.
“If the University of Cardiff cannot guarantee that I will not have things thrown at me then I won’t go there. I can’t be bothered.”
Of her critics, she added: “They think that they are entitled to throw things at me and then they say that I am inciting violence against transexuals. I have never incited anyone to violence against anyone. I am just fed up with it all. It’s all just froth.”
Germaine Greer, you go girl!
IMO, we seem to be turning towards a period of 'anti-enlightenment'. A time when doctrine reasserts itself in many walks of life. Where dissenting from the 'accepted norms' is seen as dangerous and ultimately, unacceptable.
What this debate is crying out for is a concerted campaign by a group of respected individuals from across as many disciplines as possible, who will publicly challenge this childish, fear-driven, self-hating view of the world which has been crippling Western society since the seventies.
I won't be holding my breath.
What this debate is crying out for is a concerted campaign by a group of respected individuals from across as many disciplines as possible, who will publicly challenge this childish, fear-driven, self-hating view of the world which has been crippling Western society since the seventies.
I won't be holding my breath.
rxtx said:
It's not uncommon nowadays for university speakers to be uninvited. Not that long ago, an ex-muslim woman (I believe) was "uninvited" because she was an apostate, and may have upset some muslim attendees.
Increasingly we have freedom of speech only in name, anyone not conforming to the latest PC agenda is denied a platform to express dissenting views. Hearing about universities and student unions that have 'uninvited' speakers simply because their views are not in line with them is rather depressing. University is supposed to be a place where people are exposed to lots of different viewpoints and debate could take place safely.
Yeah of course it is a bit ironic that it is happening to Greer but that doesn't make it right.
Edited by VolvoT5 on Saturday 24th October 08:47
Blib said:
IMO, we seem to be turning towards a period of 'anti-enlightenment'. A time when doctrine reasserts itself in many walks of life. Where dissenting from the 'accepted norms' is seen as dangerous and ultimately, unacceptable.
What this debate is crying out for is a concerted campaign by a group of respected individuals from across as many disciplines as possible, who will publicly challenge this childish, fear-driven, self-hating view of the world which has been crippling Western society since the seventies.
I won't be holding my breath.
That's thoughtcrime that is.What this debate is crying out for is a concerted campaign by a group of respected individuals from across as many disciplines as possible, who will publicly challenge this childish, fear-driven, self-hating view of the world which has been crippling Western society since the seventies.
I won't be holding my breath.
This quote is especially ridiculous IMO:
"“While debate in a university should be encouraged, hosting a speaker with such problematic and hateful views towards marginalised and vulnerable groups is dangerous. Allowing Greer a platform endorses her views, and by extension, the transmisogyny which she continues to perpetuate.”"
^ There is nothing hateful about what Greer has said, as far as I can see all she is saying is she doesn't believe surgery turns a man into a woman.... I can understand why some might find that offensive but no matter how 'vulnerable' you are there is no right not to be offended ...... it isn't like she advocating violence against LGBT community or anything outrageous.
And who the hell are they to judge if views are 'problematic' in the first place.
"“While debate in a university should be encouraged, hosting a speaker with such problematic and hateful views towards marginalised and vulnerable groups is dangerous. Allowing Greer a platform endorses her views, and by extension, the transmisogyny which she continues to perpetuate.”"
^ There is nothing hateful about what Greer has said, as far as I can see all she is saying is she doesn't believe surgery turns a man into a woman.... I can understand why some might find that offensive but no matter how 'vulnerable' you are there is no right not to be offended ...... it isn't like she advocating violence against LGBT community or anything outrageous.
And who the hell are they to judge if views are 'problematic' in the first place.
Edited by VolvoT5 on Saturday 24th October 08:48
Breadvan72 said:
The campuses of the west are being swept by a wave of anti free speech nonsense.
This analysis is pretty good:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opinion/sunday/j...
Good article. Didn't realise America had gone quite that far in that direction.This analysis is pretty good:
http://www.nytimes.com/2015/03/22/opinion/sunday/j...
My nephew is an undergraduate, and he, although a bright person, has been infected by the nonsense. He and his peers no longer accept that free speech is a (virtually) inviolable principle. They are not all that sold on the presumption of innocence, either. They are obsessed with the idea of "harm". If speech upsets someone, that is harm. But only some can be harmed, it seems. What of the speaker who is banned and those (even those who are bigots) who wanted to hear the speaker? If they are upset, presumably that is tough, because they have the wrong ideas.
My well meaning but misguided nephew said that, when Marie Le Pen was asked to speak at the Oxford Union, some of his friends felt so upset that they stayed in their rooms in college for a week. This was, I note, without even hearing a word said by Le Pen. The self infantilising idiots demand to be protected even from the idea of what Le Pen might say. I pointed out that you deal with Le Pen by arguing against her and showing her for the hatemonger that she is. You do not let words frighten you. You combat those words with better words. I then went straight to Godwin Mode and said that, if people had sat around feeling sad and cuddling their soft toys every time that Hitler had said something unpleasant about Jews, World War Two might not have gone so well. No answer, but presumably nephew would say that Hitler should not have been allowed to say nasty things in the first place. OK, so that's that sorted then.
I have another nephew at the same college but he is older, wiser, and argues vociferously against all the nonsense and in favour of Enlightenment values, but for this he is censured by the student body. The Dons show no leadership - my older nephew was told by the Dean to shut up and stop upsetting the young ones.
My well meaning but misguided nephew said that, when Marie Le Pen was asked to speak at the Oxford Union, some of his friends felt so upset that they stayed in their rooms in college for a week. This was, I note, without even hearing a word said by Le Pen. The self infantilising idiots demand to be protected even from the idea of what Le Pen might say. I pointed out that you deal with Le Pen by arguing against her and showing her for the hatemonger that she is. You do not let words frighten you. You combat those words with better words. I then went straight to Godwin Mode and said that, if people had sat around feeling sad and cuddling their soft toys every time that Hitler had said something unpleasant about Jews, World War Two might not have gone so well. No answer, but presumably nephew would say that Hitler should not have been allowed to say nasty things in the first place. OK, so that's that sorted then.
I have another nephew at the same college but he is older, wiser, and argues vociferously against all the nonsense and in favour of Enlightenment values, but for this he is censured by the student body. The Dons show no leadership - my older nephew was told by the Dean to shut up and stop upsetting the young ones.
Edited by anonymous-user on Saturday 24th October 09:33
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